ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012) Forum

[Holly Golightly]

Eh, some of this stuff would piss me off if I were the employer (i.e., staying late just to stay late, sucking up, etc.). But I'm not your employer, so carry on...

Also, I take it you were never an employer? I don't generally expect/need my employees to do these things, but I wouldn't them making extra effort when not asked.

I've had people working under me in an office situation, but I would only want them to work late if it were necessary to do their work. Otherwise it's just stupid.

[r6_philly]

I've had people working under me in an office situation, but I would only want them to work late if it were necessary to do their work. Otherwise it's just stupid.

When employees on salary wants to put in extra time and you dislike it? I will never ever complain about workers staying late looking for more things to do when I don't have to pay them extra. It's hard enough getting them to do things while you are paying them.

[rad lulz]

Wow, basically everyone ITT is insane. Shouldn't surprise me, I suppose, but Jesus Christ...

It's probably good to stay on your toes ITE.

Eh, some of this stuff would piss me off if I were the employer (i.e., staying late just to stay late, sucking up, etc.). But I'm not your employer, so carry on...

some of the associates will roll their eyes at you but it's not like the partners care

Associates and partners have told me they worked late and on weekends as summers.

[rad lulz]

Yes I have the work flow to justify staying late.

[Pate]

Has anyone ever heard of an SA being let go? Wonder what an SA could do to piss someone off so much to become road kill? I am guessing 60/40 it was an argument rather than work assignment.

[Morgan12Oak]

Wait, you heard of an SA being let go? LOL, that's the most TTT thing I've ever heard.

[bk1]

Has anyone ever heard of an SA being let go? Wonder what an SA could do to piss someone off so much to become road kill? I am guessing 60/40 it was an argument rather than work assignment.

Tucker Max

[los blancos]

You don't understand what an amazing luxury that is...

Do you have a legitimate reason to be worried about being no-offered? Because my firm is definitely more like the one where they assume everyone is going to get an offer and you have to screw up pretty seriously not to.

I think he's trying to hint at the fact that his firm is NOT like that.

Yeah, it comes with the territory. It's what you pay for the advantages of being at the type of firm that takes a very small summer class.

I'm absolutely loving the job; It's just hard to enjoy work when you're thinking "I either get this job and feel AWESOME or I don't get this job and I'm totally screwed... because 3L LOLCI is just that..."

[Anonymous User]

For 2L SAs with grade-related no-offer anxiety, I asked about the role of grades in offers during my midsummer review and they said grades only matter for getting through the door as an SA, not for getting an offer. They said they ask for transcripts only to make sure we haven't failed out. NYC V100 for what it's worth.

[Holly Golightly]

I've had people working under me in an office situation, but I would only want them to work late if it were necessary to do their work. Otherwise it's just stupid.

When employees on salary wants to put in extra time and you dislike it? I will never ever complain about workers staying late looking for more things to do when I don't have to pay them extra. It's hard enough getting them to do things while you are paying them.

It would probably make me think they were being annoying and trying to suck up, or incredibly inefficient at doing their jobs. Doing extra work is one thing, unnecessarily staying late is another.

[Holly Golightly]

Yes I have the work flow to justify staying late.

You have enough work to justify staying until 8 or 9 every day? I highly doubt that. Sounds more like a case of law students again creating extra busy work for themselves and trying to suck up.

[keg411]

Yes I have the work flow to justify staying late.

You have enough work to justify staying until 8 or 9 every day? I highly doubt that. Sounds more like a case of law students again creating extra busy work for themselves and trying to suck up.

It's rad. Trust me, it's not surprising .

[r6_philly]

It would probably make me think they were being annoying and trying to suck up, or incredibly inefficient at doing their jobs. Doing extra work is one thing, unnecessarily staying late is another.

Law is such a profession that if you stay late and look for work, you will probably find some. So if you stay late but shut your door and listen to music, I agree it's stupid. If you stay late and talk with attorneys and trying to get work, then it's not, regardless of whether or not you get work. A big part of being a summer is to establish relationships. If you want to call that "suck up" I don't know what to tell you.

[Detrox]

It would probably make me think they were being annoying and trying to suck up, or incredibly inefficient at doing their jobs. Doing extra work is one thing, unnecessarily staying late is another.

Law is such a profession that if you stay late and look for work, you will probably find some. So if you stay late but shut your door and listen to music, I agree it's stupid. If you stay late and talk with attorneys and trying to get work, then it's not, regardless of whether or not you get work. A big part of being a summer is to establish relationships. If you want to call that "suck up" I don't know what to tell you.

ITT, rising 2L's give advice as to "how to have a successful summer in a law firm." I take no position on the specific issue of staying late without a pre-existing reason to do so, as I am sure, like most things, it varies from firm to firm, partner/associate to partner/associate, and to individual personalities.

[Renne Walker]

For 2L SAs with grade-related no-offer anxiety, I asked about the role of grades in offers during my midsummer review and they said grades only matter for getting through the door as an SA, not for getting an offer. They said they ask for transcripts only to make sure we haven't failed out. NYC V100 for what it's worth.

Ditto here! Anxiety level over my less than stellar 2nd semester grades have vanished. Better yet, get to avoid the entie OCI hassle!

[rad lulz]

Yes I have the work flow to justify staying late.

You have enough work to justify staying until 8 or 9 every day? I highly doubt that. Sounds more like a case of law students again creating extra busy work for themselves and trying to suck up.

It's rad. Trust me, it's not surprising .

I did not ask for work since the first day. I accepted every assignment and normally was juggling 5-7 assignments of various sizes at a time. Last week I had to tell 3 attys there was no way I could do their shit before my rotation ended.

That was first half firm, and it's over.

[r6_philly]

ITT, rising 2L's give advice as to "how to have a successful summer in a law firm." I take no position on the specific issue of staying late without a pre-existing reason to do so, as I am sure, like most things, it varies from firm to firm, partner/associate to partner/associate, and to individual personalities.

I merely quoted what I was told at several "how to have a successful summer in a law firm" event run by managing and hiring partners of several firms including mine and others. No need to be snarky about my class year at least, I know how to get ahead at the work place a long many years ago.

[Anonymous User]

Anyone else absolutely bored with biglaw practice as a summer? Some people do seem to genuinely like it, but reading dense 60+ page contracts for tiny errors and drafting sections of the same super boring documents by chopping up old sections of boring documents is making me dread this life -- especially when you're doing it for 14 hours a day. I certainly expected this is in biglaw, but it's worse when you're actually doing it.

[Anonymous User]

Anyone else absolutely bored with biglaw practice as a summer? Some people do seem to genuinely like it, but reading dense 60+ page contracts for tiny errors and drafting sections of the same super boring documents by chopping up old sections of boring documents is making me dread this life -- especially when you're doing it for 14 hours a day. I certainly expected this is in biglaw, but it's worse when you're actually doing it.

I'm not at a big firm but it's a boutique with biglaw level work, pay and hours. I hate what I'm doing more than I've hated anything in my life. I honestly think I would become suicidal if I had to keep working here. There's probably at least an 80% chance I'm dropping out of LS since I've only paid for 1L.

[Anonymous User]

Anyone else absolutely bored with biglaw practice as a summer? Some people do seem to genuinely like it, but reading dense 60+ page contracts for tiny errors and drafting sections of the same super boring documents by chopping up old sections of boring documents is making me dread this life -- especially when you're doing it for 14 hours a day. I certainly expected this is in biglaw, but it's worse when you're actually doing it.

No. I enjoy it.

But it is good that you got this experience so that you can cross it off your list and perhaps try to find something else for your full-time job.

[r6_philly]

Anyone else absolutely bored with biglaw practice as a summer? Some people do seem to genuinely like it, but reading dense 60+ page contracts for tiny errors and drafting sections of the same super boring documents by chopping up old sections of boring documents is making me dread this life -- especially when you're doing it for 14 hours a day. I certainly expected this is in biglaw, but it's worse when you're actually doing it.

I enjoy the adversarial process of litigation very much. And the tedious work supporting the process is palatable.

[Old Gregg]

Anyone else absolutely bored with biglaw practice as a summer? Some people do seem to genuinely like it, but reading dense 60+ page contracts for tiny errors and drafting sections of the same super boring documents by chopping up old sections of boring documents is making me dread this life -- especially when you're doing it for 14 hours a day. I certainly expected this is in biglaw, but it's worse when you're actually doing it.

It's a necessary process of learning. You don't know how to do anything more advanced. Once you "graduate" from it, you'll be drafting key provisions of a merger agreement, if not the whole damn thing (with input from specialists). Once you graduate from that, you'll be negotiating key provisions of the merger agreement and editing someone else's first draft of it. Once you graduate from that, you'll be negotiating the most key provisions of a deal and making sure everyone below you puts that in place.

It's really hard to see the forest for the trees when you're changing "corporation" to "limited liability company" in a resolution. The thing that should keep you motivated, and that keeps me motivated, is looking at what people more senior to me do and seeing where what you do falls in the bigger picture.

[keg411]

Anyone else absolutely bored with biglaw practice as a summer? Some people do seem to genuinely like it, but reading dense 60+ page contracts for tiny errors and drafting sections of the same super boring documents by chopping up old sections of boring documents is making me dread this life -- especially when you're doing it for 14 hours a day. I certainly expected this is in biglaw, but it's worse when you're actually doing it.

Try getting work in a different practice group? Sounds like you've been doing mostly transactional, so why not give litigation a shot and maybe you'll like it better.

Personally, I'm really enjoying the BigLaw work I've done so far. It's interesting. Plus, while I've enjoyed most of the work I've been doing, I've definitely started to narrow down to which practice areas I can see myself doing/enjoying long-term.

[Anonymous User]

Anyone else absolutely bored with biglaw practice as a summer? Some people do seem to genuinely like it, but reading dense 60+ page contracts for tiny errors and drafting sections of the same super boring documents by chopping up old sections of boring documents is making me dread this life -- especially when you're doing it for 14 hours a day. I certainly expected this is in biglaw, but it's worse when you're actually doing it.

Try getting work in a different practice group? Sounds like you've been doing mostly transactional, so why not give litigation a shot and maybe you'll like it better.

Personally, I'm really enjoying the BigLaw work I've done so far. It's interesting. Plus, while I've enjoyed most of the work I've been doing, I've definitely started to narrow down to which practice areas I can see myself doing/enjoying long-term.

For the last several weeks I have been stuck on an incredibly boring, tedious, brain-melting contract review thing. Just when I was contemplating slitting my wrists/dropping out of LS, I got a new project. New project is very interesting. Ask for other work to break up the monotony.

[romothesavior]

At least at my firm, it would be totally reasonable to go to the recruiter and say, "If there are any opportunities, I really want to try something new. I am particularly interested in X and Y." Of course, I would never stop working on an assignment I've been assigned, and I always try to be enthusiastic towards the partners assigning my work, but at least in my experience, the recruiter genuinely wants to get us into areas that interest the summers.

Fortunately, I've never had to have this conversation with the recruiter because I've been doing stuff I find interesting, but I would feel comfortable doing it at one of our regular reviews. So to the poster who said they're bored, I think you should consider having a conversation like this. It's all about how you approach it and how you sell it. Unless it is a strictly rotation/assignment environment, I imagine they want you to find areas you like as a summer so they can place you into areas you like as an associate, which will maximize your effectiveness as an employee.