Kirkland Megathread Forum

[Anonymous User]

Another Q: what is first year 'orientation' week like? Is it different for each group? Do we start working on matters during the first week?

Corporate folks (including TIPT) had a three day event at the Ritz Carlton at Chicago. I forget what it was called. Lit folks had a watered down version of that.very unlikely to do substantive workin the first week.

When do you actually start working/billing?

[Dr Tobias Funke]

It's kind of funny that Fishbowl has eaten this place's lunch so bad that the only people still posting here are those who haven't gotten their work email accounts yet.

[Anonymous User]

Typically how easy is it to move offices? New in Lit at one of NY/Chi and likely will need to make a move to one of SF/DC within the next couple years--would be easier if I didn't have to lateral.

[Anonymous User]

The number of worthless mandatory training sessions I am being compelled to attend makes me want to hurl myself off the roof. Very clear that I am a cog in this machine. Maybe that's really what they mean to teach.

[doctor]

Kirkland is getting aggressive in the market, and sent out firm-wide emails boosting their referral bonuses. If anyone is interested in Kirkland, pm me. Better odds with me than a recruiter. 'll bypass recruiting and go straight to the partners in the group to make it happen.

[Anonymous User]

It's kind of funny that Fishbowl has eaten this place's lunch so bad that the only people still posting here are those who haven't gotten their work email accounts yet.

People actually use their work email accounts to sign up for Fishbowl? That seems like a bad idea.

[Anonymous User]

It's kind of funny that Fishbowl has eaten this place's lunch so bad that the only people still posting here are those who haven't gotten their work email accounts yet.

People actually use their work email accounts to sign up for Fishbowl? That seems like a bad idea.

Ikr? I browse fishbowl using a nonwork random email but I guess since it is nonwork I can't comment? Feels insane to me to give them my actual firm email.

[Anonymous User]

Some basic questions about NSP:

1. What's the typical comp?

2. How many hours are you expecting to bill?

I am a senior associate at a V50 firm and am being recruited for a KE NSP (litigation). Right now I make 550k (top of Cravath scale with bonus included) and bill ~2000 hours a year; it's really not that bad. And my firm culture is good.

Wondering if I can do 2-3 years at KE at 2000 hours as a lit NSP or if they'll boot me if I'm not at 2600 or whatever.

[Sackboy]

Some basic questions about NSP:

1. What's the typical comp?

2. How many hours are you expecting to bill?

I am a senior associate at a V50 firm and am being recruited for a KE NSP (litigation). Right now I make 550k (top of Cravath scale with bonus included) and bill ~2000 hours a year; it's really not that bad. And my firm culture is good.

Wondering if I can do 2-3 years at KE at 2000 hours as a lit NSP or if they'll boot me if I'm not at 2600 or whatever.

I have no clue why you'd make this move. Seems like a downgrade to me. Probably more hours for the same money (maybe worse since you'll have to pay both sides of payroll tax), and you're never going to be a lit equity partner at KE, realistically.

[The Lsat Airbender]

Yeah, I wouldn't do that without, at minimum, a guarantee of improved comp

[Anonymous User]

Ok but can someone answer my questions? I have my reasons, trust me. And let's assume the money is even.

[Anonymous User]

They're probably bad reasons.

[Anonymous User]

They're probably bad reasons.

Not OP, but lots of associates switch to NSP Kirkland because partnership prospects at their own firm are more bleak/opaque and it takes a lot longer. Doesn't seem like a bad reason if you're willing to sacrifice some hours to get a title. Not everyone wants to ride out associate pay until their a 17th year.

[Anonymous User]

They're probably bad reasons.

Not OP, but lots of associates switch to NSP Kirkland because partnership prospects at their own firm are more bleak/opaque and it takes a lot longer. Doesn't seem like a bad reason if you're willing to sacrifice some hours to get a title. Not everyone wants to ride out associate pay until their a 17th year.

But you're not really a partner if you're an NSP. They just made up that title a few years ago to convince people to work more.

[Anonymous User]

They're probably bad reasons.

Not OP, but lots of associates switch to NSP Kirkland because partnership prospects at their own firm are more bleak/opaque and it takes a lot longer. Doesn't seem like a bad reason if you're willing to sacrifice some hours to get a title. Not everyone wants to ride out associate pay until their a 17th year.

But you're not really a partner if you're an NSP. They just made up that title a few years ago to convince people to work more.

Sure but what is a better exit option for a litigator: V50 10th year associate or whatever or Kirkland NSP Partner?

[The Lsat Airbender]

They're probably bad reasons.

Not OP, but lots of associates switch to NSP Kirkland because partnership prospects at their own firm are more bleak/opaque and it takes a lot longer. Doesn't seem like a bad reason if you're willing to sacrifice some hours to get a title. Not everyone wants to ride out associate pay until their a 17th year.

But you're not really a partner if you're an NSP. They just made up that title a few years ago to convince people to work more.

Sure but what is a better exit option for a litigator: V50 10th year associate or whatever or Kirkland NSP Partner?

They're basically the same thing, so it's hard to talk coherently about the differences. Kirkland is a V50 (what does Vault even mean wrt litigation? Susman and MTO are ranked in the 40s), and NSPs are super-senior associates.

[Anonymous User]

No one has answered, actually what is comp (estimated) for Kirkland NSP lit partners?

[Anonymous User]

No one has answered, actually what is comp (estimated) for Kirkland NSP lit partners?

Cravath scale plus maybe a 10% bonus bump.

[Anonymous User]

They're probably bad reasons.

Not OP, but lots of associates switch to NSP Kirkland because partnership prospects at their own firm are more bleak/opaque and it takes a lot longer. Doesn't seem like a bad reason if you're willing to sacrifice some hours to get a title. Not everyone wants to ride out associate pay until their a 17th year.

But you're not really a partner if you're an NSP. They just made up that title a few years ago to convince people to work more.

Sure but what is a better exit option for a litigator: V50 10th year associate or whatever or Kirkland NSP Partner?

They're basically the same thing, so it's hard to talk coherently about the differences. Kirkland is a V50 (what does Vault even mean wrt litigation? Susman and MTO are ranked in the 40s), and NSPs are super-senior associates.

'Basically the same thing' in practice is not the same as how they're perceived in the market. The idea that a 10th year associate has the same exit options as a Kirkland NSP is silly.

[Anonymous User]

They're probably bad reasons.

Not OP, but lots of associates switch to NSP Kirkland because partnership prospects at their own firm are more bleak/opaque and it takes a lot longer. Doesn't seem like a bad reason if you're willing to sacrifice some hours to get a title. Not everyone wants to ride out associate pay until their a 17th year.

But you're not really a partner if you're an NSP. They just made up that title a few years ago to convince people to work more.

Sure but what is a better exit option for a litigator: V50 10th year associate or whatever or Kirkland NSP Partner?

They're basically the same thing, so it's hard to talk coherently about the differences. Kirkland is a V50 (what does Vault even mean wrt litigation? Susman and MTO are ranked in the 40s), and NSPs are super-senior associates.

'Basically the same thing' in practice is not the same as how they're perceived in the market. The idea that a 10th year associate has the same exit options as a Kirkland NSP is silly.

What exactly are you basing that on? I think people have gotten wise to the fake partner thing.

[Anonymous User]

They're probably bad reasons.

Not OP, but lots of associates switch to NSP Kirkland because partnership prospects at their own firm are more bleak/opaque and it takes a lot longer. Doesn't seem like a bad reason if you're willing to sacrifice some hours to get a title. Not everyone wants to ride out associate pay until their a 17th year.

But you're not really a partner if you're an NSP. They just made up that title a few years ago to convince people to work more.

Sure but what is a better exit option for a litigator: V50 10th year associate or whatever or Kirkland NSP Partner?

They're basically the same thing, so it's hard to talk coherently about the differences. Kirkland is a V50 (what does Vault even mean wrt litigation? Susman and MTO are ranked in the 40s), and NSPs are super-senior associates.

'Basically the same thing' in practice is not the same as how they're perceived in the market. The idea that a 10th year associate has the same exit options as a Kirkland NSP is silly.

Do you really think any in house counsel worth a damn doesn't know that the vast majority of "partners" at K&E are just NSPs? I guess you can trick someone outside of a major market, but a K&E NSP is not going to have materially better exit options in NY/CH/DC/LA/SF compared to senior associates from other top tier firms. For example, senior associates at Cravath/Skadden/Latham/SullCrom/DPW/PW are going to similar in house roles as NSPs at K&E (and in some instances, they will outperform K&E NSPs).

You can look all this up for yourself either on LinkedIn or Firm Prospects (which, from what I can tell, just aggregates data from LinkedIn) if you don't want to believe me.

[Anonymous User]

I left a few years ago, but I actually had the opposite issue when I was interviewing for in-house roles.

"You're a partner at Kirkland -- why do you want this $200k/year in house job?"

[LittleRedCorvette]

I left a few years ago, but I actually had the opposite issue when I was interviewing for in-house roles.

"You're a partner at Kirkland -- why do you want this $200k/year in house job?"

How did you answer

[Anonymous User]

I left a few years ago, but I actually had the opposite issue when I was interviewing for in-house roles.

"You're a partner at Kirkland -- why do you want this $200k/year in house job?"

How did you answer

"I'm actually a non-equity partner so I don't make nearly as much money as you think I do"

[Anonymous User]

Some basic questions about NSP:

1. What's the typical comp?

2. How many hours are you expecting to bill?

I am a senior associate at a V50 firm and am being recruited for a KE NSP (litigation). Right now I make 550k (top of Cravath scale with bonus included) and bill ~2000 hours a year; it's really not that bad. And my firm culture is good.

Wondering if I can do 2-3 years at KE at 2000 hours as a lit NSP or if they'll boot me if I'm not at 2600 or whatever.

I am in Kirkland lit and can help answer some of these.

1. Typical comp = Big Law associate comp + a tiny bump. All-in, given recent changes to make up for perceived drawbacks, there is no material difference between a typical KE NSP and a senior associate at, say, SullCrom, Paul Weiss, etc. There are some older NSPs who have negotiated pay structures that are above market, but they have been NSPs for like 5+ years, will never make SP, and are well-liked, and so have bespoke packages. You're not getting this package unless you're already BFFs with like Andrew Kassoff in Chi or Sandra Goldstein in NY.

2. A LOT. Senior associates at Kirkland Lit typically bill around 2300/year easily; as a new NSP, you'd be expected to bill more than that while establishing relationships with key SPs. 2000 hours as an NSP would be noticeably low and raise eyebrows.

Without knowing more about your situation, seems like an easy choice to avoid this lateral move, especially in litigation.