Incoming Associates Getting Deferred Forum

[Res Ipsa Loquitter]

No one said the practical (though fatally flawed - see above) advice was "callous and insensitive". Folks are all ears for solutions. Rather, it's the "shaddup, quit whining, you have NOTHING to complain about, in fact you're so LUCKY to have your start date bumped to 2021 because now you have more vacay time!" attitude that comes across as really entitled and tone-deaf. The assumption underlying that attitude is that all future BigLawyers come from upper-middle-class families and have no significant financial concerns - thus, a few extra months of post-bar vacation? All for the better! But that's a very entitled and completely incorrect assumption. Many future BigLawyers in the class of 2020 in fact come from poor or lower-middle-class families, or are cut off from family support for other reasons, such as abuse or homophobia. To tell people who're at risk of homelessness "you're LUCKY to have extra vacay time!" is breathtakingly callous.

No one is assuming that everyone comes from an upper middle class background. If they did, a 5 month deferral wouldn't be an issue. They'd stay with their family, or their parents would pay their rent. It's obvious to everyone that not all law students have rich families.

I also don't agree with your conception of "entitlement." Entitlement means thinking I deserve something. I neither deserve nor expect anything, and nothing in my posts suggested otherwise.

To the extent people think they deserve anything, that's entitlement.

[2020Graduate]

I know for a fact that a bunch of v10 firms haven't told their incoming classes a damn thing since this all started. We're rightly worried about how uncertain the situation is.

(emphasis added)

Say something, Cravath, Wachtell, Skadden, Sullivan, Latham, Kirkland, Davis Polk, Simpson, Gibson, Paul Weiss. Latham distributing stipends is the best we have. Sullivan saying they're monitoring the situation is useless. We know you're all monitoring it, and silent for strategic reasons. But one of you has to move, confirm that we have jobs, maybe even say if you'll defer, and set the standard for other firms with large classes. Or is that too much? Would you prefer your incoming associates die from the anxiety of waiting? Maybe that's your plan to save money. It's working... *cough* I don't know... how... *hoarse coughing* much... longer I... *cough* can... *cough* ... (the blood is on your hands)

[Monochromatic Oeuvre]

The advice *has* been posted. It's not to pay one more dime of NYC rent until your start date if you don't have the money to make it that far. Yeah, it's gonna cost piles to move somewhere else and it's gonna be a massive pain in the ass. But for most people who got deferred until January, it would save them money. Whether it's worth the hassle is up to you; I wouldn't have bothered bringing it up if some dude hadn't said he was gonna be homeless otherwise.

So your position is that someone at risk of homelessness has the "piles" of money required to move out of the city? Have you considered that they're at risk of homelessness precisely because they don't have a pile of savings sitting around?

Yes, my position is that anyone who has the money to pay NYC rent through September has the money to rent a U-Haul.

And my point was that someone who would be unable to cover NYC rent between September and January should be making a plan to move someone cheaper while they had nothing binding them to the city if they weren't gonna get any financial help from anyone until they started working.

I cannot imagine a scenario in which that does not help alleviate a financial burden. If you know of one, please tell me.

Look, I'm not chiding anyone here. This whole thing sucks and it'll be suckier if law firms don't do right by the people they deferred. This is just a basic "cut every expense possible while you're broke" strategy, and nothing more.

[jm2819]

The advice *has* been posted. It's not to pay one more dime of NYC rent until your start date if you don't have the money to make it that far. Yeah, it's gonna cost piles to move somewhere else and it's gonna be a massive pain in the ass. But for most people who got deferred until January, it would save them money. Whether it's worth the hassle is up to you; I wouldn't have bothered bringing it up if some dude hadn't said he was gonna be homeless otherwise.

So your position is that someone at risk of homelessness has the "piles" of money required to move out of the city? Have you considered that they're at risk of homelessness precisely because they don't have a pile of savings sitting around?

Yes, my position is that anyone who has the money to pay NYC rent through September has the money to rent a U-Haul.

And my point was that someone who would be unable to cover NYC rent between September and January should be making a plan to move someone cheaper while they had nothing binding them to the city if they weren't gonna get any financial help from anyone until they started working.

I cannot imagine a scenario in which that does not help alleviate a financial burden. If you know of one, please tell me.

Look, I'm not chiding anyone here. This whole thing sucks and it'll be suckier if law firms don't do right by the people they deferred. This is just a basic "cut every expense possible while you're broke" strategy, and nothing more.

Well, how about someone who is currently splitting their rent in the NYC area with a significant other and is under lease? There's no way someone can just pick up and move to a cheaper area then without leaving their SO high and dry. I understand that people should weather the storm, but deferring without a significant stipend can lead to major issues for the incoming associate. I'm in a similar situation and do not have wealthy parents who can cover my rent for months.

[Anonymous User]

What I think many posters here fail to grasp is this: for the class of 2020, whether at a t1 or t4 school, they must feel that their futures have been all but ripped out from under them in ways that frankly lawyers in the practice do not understand. Not only have many of them been faced with the prospect of abandoning their home to return to uncertain home-living arrangements IF THEY ARE LUCKY, just to finish a school semester they paid close to 35,000 in (many in just debt) for. Now, they are faced with the added pressure of wondering if they will even be able to enter the profession to earn a living. There are no alternate jobs because the everything bubble is popping.

There's no restaurant work, there is no retail work, there is no flight attendant job, there is no newly emerging field with potential growth in a total economic shutdown. What are we supposed to do? compete for in-house counsel at Purrell? Can't do that unless they license us which all relevant and competent authorities are dragging their feet about doing because they're selfish fucking assholes who don't care how we live.

This is a highly indebted generation, a generation of mid-twenties/thirties students who have worked their entire life only to be told that "if you can't take the bar because we won't let you, then you can't enter the profession because we just haven't made sure you are exactly equal to everyone we pointlessly hazed for financial-corporate greed. Too bad if you have to pay rent, and eat, and go to work. We don't care." Can we even take out loans to get us from point A to point B if some of us are lucky enough to get deferred? Hmm...I wouldn't count on that possibility four months from now.

For those of us who have heard NOTHING from our firms (or NOTHING GOOD) which we have spent so much blood and sweat and tears to even enter the future feels totally gone and irretrievable, even if it may not be factually the case. How can you sit on your computers at least ABLE to earn a living and compare yourself to a generation of law graduates who only one month ago, for the most part, had a relatively safe prospect of earning decent livelihoods? Check your fucking blessings.

If this keeps going on what do we have to look forward to? What makes us wake up every day? How will we support ourselves? how will we survive? Should I just go buy a tent and some seeds and try to farm some federal land in some state to subsist? If the economic depression doesn't kill me, the depression of having a highly successful future ripped from me and basically being made to feel obsolete might after working so hard to get anywhere better than where I came from. I walked ten miles a day living in manhattan to go to and from law school classes because I just didn't have $5.50 to waste on the Metro every day and you think I can survive a deferment AT BEST?

Some of you would come onto a forum, to put people down, where these same people are only asking for the scraps of any information that they can get, in abject fear for not just tomorrow but the rest of their lives. Students are mourning a future, a present they are being robbed of and some are even mourning people they loved and lost.

Classic boomer-esq bullshit, go pull yourself up by your bootstraps and let people find some fucking support in what is a dark, dark time for them.

[nixy]

I’m lucky enough not to have to worry and I totally get why you are. But no one has ripped your future out from under you yet. Everyone in your year is in the same boat re: the bar exam; I’m sure workarounds for that are going to be developed. No one has had offers rescinded yet. Again, I get why you’re worried that that might happen. But the worst hasn’t yet occurred. There is no need to mourn a future yet.

[trusk13]

I’m lucky enough not to have to worry and I totally get why you are. But no one has ripped your future out from under you yet. Everyone in your year is in the same boat re: the bar exam; I’m sure workarounds for that are going to be developed. No one has had offers rescinded yet. Again, I get why you’re worried that that might happen. But the worst hasn’t yet occurred. There is no need to mourn a future yet.

^ This. Also, “blood, sweat and tears”? Come on, now. You went to law school. Everyone on this forum went to law school. I’m sure you worked hard, but you aren’t a soldier or law enforcement or an (underpaid) healthcare worker in a pandemic. You read a lot of books, wrote a bunch of essays, sat through many stultifying classes and likely worked a night/weekend job. In this crushed economy you (particularly at a t4) are still more educated and employable than 95% of the rest of the country and the world. You are understandably bummed that you will not be getting rich quite as quickly as you thought. That is surely unfortunate. But please, breathe. And get off your sanctimonious soapbox. You will be fine. Maybe just not a millionaire by 33. What about the t30 or t50 folks? Get some perspective.

[LBJ's Hair]

What I think many posters here fail to grasp is this: for the class of 2020, whether at a t1 or t4 school, they must feel that their futures have been all but ripped out from under them in ways that frankly lawyers in the practice do not understand. Not only have many of them been faced with the prospect of abandoning their home to return to uncertain home-living arrangements IF THEY ARE LUCKY, just to finish a school semester they paid close to 35,000 in (many in just debt) for. Now, they are faced with the added pressure of wondering if they will even be able to enter the profession to earn a living. There are no alternate jobs because the everything bubble is popping.

...

Classic boomer-esq bullshit, go pull yourself up by your bootstraps and let people find some fucking support in what is a dark, dark time for them.

I am deeply sympathetic. These are challenging times. But please remember that you are young, healthy, a graduate of (it sounds like) a prestigious law school, and most importantly ... have a very, very well-paying job waiting for you. You will be ok.

For perspective: My boomer father just lost his job. It sucks; no one's hiring, so who knows when he'll get another one. But all he can do is stay safe and remain positive.

I don't say this to make light of your situation, just to remind you that we're all making sacrifices. For now, yours is psychic: You're stuck at home, fearful and uncertain. Others have been more concrete: Spending eighteen hours a day treating sick people, involuntarily leaving jobs.

[layoffslayoffs]

For perspective: My boomer father just lost his job. It sucks; no one's hiring, so who knows when he'll get another one. But all he can do is stay safe and remain positive.

Can you share the industry? It's hard to figure out what's going on in the economy. Stock market is temporarily disconnected from the real economy due to Trump's crew tries to save his rich cronies from the pain. https://zh-prod-1cc738ca-7d3b-4a72-b792 ... k=5zB4MIc1 and https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/wall- ... ge-factory

[layoffslayoffs]

FYI law firms are doing PPP to get $20,000 per employee. Link here https://bit.ly/34udtHa

[2013]

What I think many posters here fail to grasp is this: for the class of 2020, whether at a t1 or t4 school, they must feel that their futures have been all but ripped out from under them in ways that frankly lawyers in the practice do not understand. Not only have many of them been faced with the prospect of abandoning their home to return to uncertain home-living arrangements IF THEY ARE LUCKY, just to finish a school semester they paid close to 35,000 in (many in just debt) for. Now, they are faced with the added pressure of wondering if they will even be able to enter the profession to earn a living. There are no alternate jobs because the everything bubble is popping.

There's no restaurant work, there is no retail work, there is no flight attendant job, there is no newly emerging field with potential growth in a total economic shutdown. What are we supposed to do? compete for in-house counsel at Purrell? Can't do that unless they license us which all relevant and competent authorities are dragging their feet about doing because they're selfish fucking assholes who don't care how we live.

This is a highly indebted generation, a generation of mid-twenties/thirties students who have worked their entire life only to be told that "if you can't take the bar because we won't let you, then you can't enter the profession because we just haven't made sure you are exactly equal to everyone we pointlessly hazed for financial-corporate greed. Too bad if you have to pay rent, and eat, and go to work. We don't care." Can we even take out loans to get us from point A to point B if some of us are lucky enough to get deferred? Hmm...I wouldn't count on that possibility four months from now.

For those of us who have heard NOTHING from our firms (or NOTHING GOOD) which we have spent so much blood and sweat and tears to even enter the future feels totally gone and irretrievable, even if it may not be factually the case. How can you sit on your computers at least ABLE to earn a living and compare yourself to a generation of law graduates who only one month ago, for the most part, had a relatively safe prospect of earning decent livelihoods? Check your fucking blessings.

If this keeps going on what do we have to look forward to? What makes us wake up every day? How will we support ourselves? how will we survive? Should I just go buy a tent and some seeds and try to farm some federal land in some state to subsist? If the economic depression doesn't kill me, the depression of having a highly successful future ripped from me and basically being made to feel obsolete might after working so hard to get anywhere better than where I came from. I walked ten miles a day living in manhattan to go to and from law school classes because I just didn't have $5.50 to waste on the Metro every day and you think I can survive a deferment AT BEST?

Some of you would come onto a forum, to put people down, where these same people are only asking for the scraps of any information that they can get, in abject fear for not just tomorrow but the rest of their lives. Students are mourning a future, a present they are being robbed of and some are even mourning people they loved and lost.

Classic boomer-esq bullshit, go pull yourself up by your bootstraps and let people find some fucking support in what is a dark, dark time for them.

So, let’s assume you are going to graduate from NYU (because I don’t think you can live 5 miles from Columbia and still be in an affordable part of Manhattan) and will start at a V10 in the fall. I understand the uncertainty of not knowing what will happen. But, your anxiety is just not really justified at this point. Has any V10 deferred its start date? You need to just relax. I know it’s hard, but, for now, just focus on finishing school.

I doubt firms are even thinking about incoming associates at this point. The rest of us are terrified of losing our jobs currently since that’s also a real possibility. I can empathize with your concern and fear. Am I worried about losing my job? Of course. But, at the end of the day, it’s just a job. As a previous poster mentioned, you have your health.

[2013]

FYI law firms are doing PPP to get $20,000 per employee. Link here https://bit.ly/34udtHa

This will mostly only apply to mid law firms. Many (most) biglaw firms have over 500 employees.

[layoffslayoffs]

This will mostly only apply to mid law firms. Many (most) biglaw firms have over 500 employees.

Aren't there talks to expand the employee cutoff in the next round of stimulus?

[2020Graduate]

I doubt firms are even thinking about incoming associates at this point.

Firms (and others) are undoubtedly thinking about incoming associates:

https://www.law360.com/legalindustry/ar ... tart-dates ("The firm has also postponed the start of its 2020 associate class to January 2021, or after postponed bar exams.")

https://www.ipwatchdog.com/2020/04/06/s ... s-of-2020/ ("[T]here is a class of lawyers, actually lawyers-to-be, that we should have sympathy and empathy for: incoming first year associates. The Class of 2020 will have a very tough time, even tougher than the Classes of the last downturn in 2008 and 2009.")

https://www.bizjournals.com/dallas/news ... -hits.html ("After the last financial crisis, several law firms rescinded offers to first year associates and curtailed their summer clerkship programs.")

at the end of the day, it’s just a job.

Understatement of the century. A $190,000 salary job, which puts one in the top 3% of U.S. income-earners and which less than 1% of people ever get is "just a job." "Just go to jobs.com and click 'give me a 190K biglaw job' bro, it's easy, you'll have another one in no time." And if they run out, just make 45-60K/yr like most lawyers, not big deal. And don't worry if you made that much before law school. At least you can say you went to law school.

I get that you're trying to calm people down. But let's be real. There's a lot on the line here.

[Anonymous User]

I doubt firms are even thinking about incoming associates at this point.

Understatement of the century. A $190,000 salary job, which puts one in the top 3% of U.S. income-earners and which less than 1% of people ever get is "just a job." "Just go to jobs.com and click 'give me a 190K biglaw job' bro, it's easy, you'll have another one in no time." And if they run out, just make 45-60K/yr like most lawyers, not big deal. And don't worry if you made that much before law school. At least you can say you went to law school.

I get that you're trying to calm people down. But let's be real. There's a lot on the line here.

Everyone is hurting. What an entitled way to put it. Are you implying your job is more important than your peers at smaller firms because you will make 190k instead of say, 100k?

[addie1412]

I doubt firms are even thinking about incoming associates at this point.

Firms (and others) are undoubtedly thinking about incoming associates:

https://www.law360.com/legalindustry/ar ... tart-dates ("The firm has also postponed the start of its 2020 associate class to January 2021, or after postponed bar exams.")

https://www.ipwatchdog.com/2020/04/06/s ... s-of-2020/ ("[T]here is a class of lawyers, actually lawyers-to-be, that we should have sympathy and empathy for: incoming first year associates. The Class of 2020 will have a very tough time, even tougher than the Classes of the last downturn in 2008 and 2009.")

https://www.bizjournals.com/dallas/news ... -hits.html ("After the last financial crisis, several law firms rescinded offers to first year associates and curtailed their summer clerkship programs.")

at the end of the day, it’s just a job.

Understatement of the century. A $190,000 salary job, which puts one in the top 3% of U.S. income-earners and which less than 1% of people ever get is "just a job." "Just go to jobs.com and click 'give me a 190K biglaw job' bro, it's easy, you'll have another one in no time." And if they run out, just make 45-60K/yr like most lawyers, not big deal. And don't worry if you made that much before law school. At least you can say you went to law school.

I get that you're trying to calm people down. But let's be real. There's a lot on the line here.

How does posting an article about Orrick, which is the sole big firm we know of that's deferred start dates so far (and the subject of this very thread), prove that firms are en masse thinking as far ahead as what to do about incoming associates? Can we stop the fear-mongering when basically nothing has happened yet? Offers have not been rescinded.

[2020Graduate]

How does posting an article about Orrick, which is the sole big firm we know of that's deferred start dates so far (and the subject of this very thread), prove that firms are en masse thinking as far ahead as what to do about incoming associates? Can we stop the fear-mongering when basically nothing has happened yet? Offers have not been rescinded.

Peak brainlet-posting today, huh?

Just because Orrick is the only one that acted doesn't mean other firms haven't contemplated it. The other articles are evidence of it.

I doubt firms are even thinking about incoming associates at this point.

Understatement of the century. A $190,000 salary job, which puts one in the top 3% of U.S. income-earners and which less than 1% of people ever get is "just a job." "Just go to jobs.com and click 'give me a 190K biglaw job' bro, it's easy, you'll have another one in no time." And if they run out, just make 45-60K/yr like most lawyers, not big deal. And don't worry if you made that much before law school. At least you can say you went to law school.

I get that you're trying to calm people down. But let's be real. There's a lot on the line here.

Everyone is hurting. What an entitled way to put it. Are you implying your job is more important than your peers at smaller firms because you will make 190k instead of say, 100k?

This is a joke, right? If the number is 100K, a six figure salary, the point still stands. There are not millions of 100K jobs just waiting to be plucked from a tree.

[2013]

I doubt firms are even thinking about incoming associates at this point.

Understatement of the century. A $190,000 salary job, which puts one in the top 3% of U.S. income-earners and which less than 1% of people ever get is "just a job." "Just go to jobs.com and click 'give me a 190K biglaw job' bro, it's easy, you'll have another one in no time." And if they run out, just make 45-60K/yr like most lawyers, not big deal. And don't worry if you made that much before law school. At least you can say you went to law school.

I get that you're trying to calm people down. But let's be real. There's a lot on the line here.

Everyone is hurting. What an entitled way to put it. Are you implying your job is more important than your peers at smaller firms because you will make 190k instead of say, 100k?

2020Graduate, I think you’re misinterpreting what I meant. I don’t mean that your coveted job is just another job. I meant that, at the end of the day, any job, whatever it is, is just a job. There are more important things than a job.

I get that you may come from a background where that amount of money is not just life altering for you, but many others you care about, but it is just a job. Just be optimistic and take care of yourself. Maybe go see a therapist to deal with your (apparent) anxiety if you think that could help.

[addie1412]

How does posting an article about Orrick, which is the sole big firm we know of that's deferred start dates so far (and the subject of this very thread), prove that firms are en masse thinking as far ahead as what to do about incoming associates? Can we stop the fear-mongering when basically nothing has happened yet? Offers have not been rescinded.

Peak brainlet-posting today, huh?

Just because Orrick is the only one that acted doesn't mean other firms haven't contemplated it. The other articles are evidence of it.

The other links you posted do not contain mention of what any other large firms are doing or contemplating doing at the moment.* That's because we don't know what's being contemplated. And even if deferrals will happen at a large scale, it's still a jump from that to rescinded offers.

*The second article says "most firms" have rescinded offers but doesn't say which firms. I've only heard of this happening at small or mid-sized firms so far. To say most firms have rescinded offers just goes to show that the author, a solo practitioner, has no idea what's going on with 2020 graduates.

[LHand1993]

While most firms have left incoming associates in the dark, summer advances at many firms (including mine) were set to be distributed next month. I'm not sure about other firms, but I needed to sign a loan agreement for mine. Are the terms of that loan agreement binding given the circumstances? Can we be sure that we're still going to receive the advance we were promised?

I also think when/if the advances are distributed, the firms will need to actually acknowledge the situation and hopefully provide some clarity on their thinking. But maybe not--maybe we just get a check in the mail and nothing else.

[Anonymous User]

While most firms have left incoming associates in the dark, summer advances at many firms (including mine) were set to be distributed next month. I'm not sure about other firms, but I needed to sign a loan agreement for mine. Are the terms of that loan agreement binding given the circumstances? Can we be sure that we're still going to receive the advance we were promised?

I also think when/if the advances are distributed, the firms will need to actually acknowledge the situation and hopefully provide some clarity on their thinking. But maybe not--maybe we just get a check in the mail and nothing else.

LW told us about three weeks ago that our stipends would be processed April 3 and hitting around April 15 via direct deposit. No further updates on April 3, though.

[LHand1993]

While most firms have left incoming associates in the dark, summer advances at many firms (including mine) were set to be distributed next month. I'm not sure about other firms, but I needed to sign a loan agreement for mine. Are the terms of that loan agreement binding given the circumstances? Can we be sure that we're still going to receive the advance we were promised?

I also think when/if the advances are distributed, the firms will need to actually acknowledge the situation and hopefully provide some clarity on their thinking. But maybe not--maybe we just get a check in the mail and nothing else.

LW told us about three weeks ago that our stipends would be processed April 3 and hitting around April 15 via direct deposit. No further updates on April 3, though.

I guess that's good news assuming you get the deposit.

Thinking it through though, even assuming the terms of these agreements are "binding," no incoming associate is suing their firm or even making a fuss over this. They can pretty much do whatever they want and tell us were lucky to be getting anything/still have jobs.

[LHand1993]

FWIW, there's a reddit thread tracking firms' communications with their incoming class. I do not have first-hand knowledge of any of the firms listed, but none of the firms that I know have not contacted incoming associates are listed--so nothing I can verify as false is listed. Also, based on a previous post in this thread, LW has not yet distributed its stipends, but has confirmed they would be distributed (the thread says they have already been distributed.

The list:


Sullivan & Cromwell (V4): Email on 4/3 stated “We are closely monitoring the situation and will come back to you once we have clarity about the timing of the [bar] exam and the related start date delay.” 4/5

Latham (V5): Distributed summer stipends on time, no information about whether they’re pushing the start date. 4/5

Weil, Gotshal & Manges (V11): Email 3/25 confirmed first years still have jobs. Said information to be forthcoming on an office-specific basis regarding bar exams and expenses, moving, and other general administrative matters. 4/6

Jones Day (V16): No current plans to change the fall start date for new lawyers. 4/5

Ropes & Gray (V20): Ambiguous email sent on 4/3 seems to confirm jobs. Relevant portion reads: "Unfortunately, the circumstances under which we are operating will likely affect our summer program and could even stretch to affect our fall associate onboarding. Although I am not yet in a position to give you definitive word, we understand how urgent this is for you. We are closely monitoring and in touch with our law school career services colleagues and watching developments with respect to the bar exams. We are also considering contingency plans and ways in which we could adjust our normal procedures to accommodate our future colleagues." 4/5

Morrison & Foerster (V23): Bar Stipend paid on time in late March. Email from recruiter saying the offices have been closed and everyone is working remotely but they are still available if we have any questions. 4/5

Milbank (V25): Email on 4/3. No change to incoming associate job status. Stated that a decision about delaying start date has not yet been made. 4/5

O'Melveny & Myers (V26): Confirmed incoming associates still have jobs but no info on start date. Said that they weren’t selecting a start date yet because of uncertainty about the bar exam in CA or return to in office work. (Info for Orange County & LA offices). 4/11

Orrick (V34): "To ensure the dangers associated with COVID-19 have passed and to work around delayed bar exams, the firm will postpone the start of its 2020 associate class to January 2021." Announced 10% salary cut for associates for remainder of 2020, but not sure how this impacts the incoming class salary. Note: info for this came from an ATL article. 4/8

Mayer Brown (V35): Asked for information to pay summer stipends. No word yet on anything else. 4/6

Goodwin Procter (V37): Sent ambiguous email. Confirmed first years still have jobs but otherwise no info. 4/5

Winston & Strawn (V43): Partner distributions cut 50%; but associate salaries and staff salaries not cut. No layoffs. Anticipated same start date for the fall but may push to later depending on the situation. Welcomed the incoming 3L's into the Winston Family (confirmed jobs) 4/7

Dechert (V50): Positive email sent out on April 9 stated "we continue to be excited about your arrival" and "you are part of our community." Summer stipend expected to be paid on time. No set start date. Firm is monitoring the bar exam situation to coordinate onboarding. 4/10

McDermott Will & Emery (V57): Summer stipend is being distributed at normally scheduled date and bar/relocation expenses are still being reimbursed. No comment yet on start date. The firm stated they will “monitor the situation” and let incoming associates know of any planned changes. 4/8

Reed Smith (V61): Mid-March phone call for Midwest office to first years assured them that the firm had no plans to alter the incoming associate start date. 4/7

Fish & Richardson (V73): Seemed to confirm jobs, but little else. Sent vague email that says "We continue to be excited about having you join us this fall and will be in touch later this spring with additional details." In the same e-mail, the firm also offered access to the Resource Guidance Program to the incoming associates 4/6

Hughes, Hubbard, & Reed (V86): Intends for first years to still start on normal start date (late October) but said they would have to reconsider if the bar exam is pushed back to “October or later” 4/5

Kramer Levin (V89): Firm indicated that it is waiting for guidance regarding the bar exam and not sure if COVID will push the start date back

https://www.reddit.com/r/LawSchool/comm ... rst_years/

[Anonymous User]

FWIW, there's a reddit thread tracking firms' communications with their incoming class. I do not have first-hand knowledge of any of the firms listed, but none of the firms that I know have not contacted incoming associates are listed--so nothing I can verify as false is listed. Also, based on a previous post in this thread, LW has not yet distributed its stipends, but has confirmed they would be distributed (the thread says they have already been distributed.

The list:


Sullivan & Cromwell (V4): Email on 4/3 stated “We are closely monitoring the situation and will come back to you once we have clarity about the timing of the [bar] exam and the related start date delay.” 4/5

Latham (V5): Distributed summer stipends on time, no information about whether they’re pushing the start date. 4/5

Weil, Gotshal & Manges (V11): Email 3/25 confirmed first years still have jobs. Said information to be forthcoming on an office-specific basis regarding bar exams and expenses, moving, and other general administrative matters. 4/6

Jones Day (V16): No current plans to change the fall start date for new lawyers. 4/5

Ropes & Gray (V20): Ambiguous email sent on 4/3 seems to confirm jobs. Relevant portion reads: "Unfortunately, the circumstances under which we are operating will likely affect our summer program and could even stretch to affect our fall associate onboarding. Although I am not yet in a position to give you definitive word, we understand how urgent this is for you. We are closely monitoring and in touch with our law school career services colleagues and watching developments with respect to the bar exams. We are also considering contingency plans and ways in which we could adjust our normal procedures to accommodate our future colleagues." 4/5

Morrison & Foerster (V23): Bar Stipend paid on time in late March. Email from recruiter saying the offices have been closed and everyone is working remotely but they are still available if we have any questions. 4/5

Milbank (V25): Email on 4/3. No change to incoming associate job status. Stated that a decision about delaying start date has not yet been made. 4/5

O'Melveny & Myers (V26): Confirmed incoming associates still have jobs but no info on start date. Said that they weren’t selecting a start date yet because of uncertainty about the bar exam in CA or return to in office work. (Info for Orange County & LA offices). 4/11

Orrick (V34): "To ensure the dangers associated with COVID-19 have passed and to work around delayed bar exams, the firm will postpone the start of its 2020 associate class to January 2021." Announced 10% salary cut for associates for remainder of 2020, but not sure how this impacts the incoming class salary. Note: info for this came from an ATL article. 4/8

Mayer Brown (V35): Asked for information to pay summer stipends. No word yet on anything else. 4/6

Goodwin Procter (V37): Sent ambiguous email. Confirmed first years still have jobs but otherwise no info. 4/5

Winston & Strawn (V43): Partner distributions cut 50%; but associate salaries and staff salaries not cut. No layoffs. Anticipated same start date for the fall but may push to later depending on the situation. Welcomed the incoming 3L's into the Winston Family (confirmed jobs) 4/7

Dechert (V50): Positive email sent out on April 9 stated "we continue to be excited about your arrival" and "you are part of our community." Summer stipend expected to be paid on time. No set start date. Firm is monitoring the bar exam situation to coordinate onboarding. 4/10

McDermott Will & Emery (V57): Summer stipend is being distributed at normally scheduled date and bar/relocation expenses are still being reimbursed. No comment yet on start date. The firm stated they will “monitor the situation” and let incoming associates know of any planned changes. 4/8

Reed Smith (V61): Mid-March phone call for Midwest office to first years assured them that the firm had no plans to alter the incoming associate start date. 4/7

Fish & Richardson (V73): Seemed to confirm jobs, but little else. Sent vague email that says "We continue to be excited about having you join us this fall and will be in touch later this spring with additional details." In the same e-mail, the firm also offered access to the Resource Guidance Program to the incoming associates 4/6

Hughes, Hubbard, & Reed (V86): Intends for first years to still start on normal start date (late October) but said they would have to reconsider if the bar exam is pushed back to “October or later” 4/5

Kramer Levin (V89): Firm indicated that it is waiting for guidance regarding the bar exam and not sure if COVID will push the start date back

https://www.reddit.com/r/LawSchool/comm ... rst_years/

This is a fair characterization of what Weil said, though that message was sent before the July NY Bar was canceled.

[Pomeranian]

FYI law firms are doing PPP to get $20,000 per employee. Link here https://bit.ly/34udtHa

Threw up in my mouth a little. Rather more of this money go to small mom and pop shops and restaurants that actually can't do any work remotely and are on the verge of being wiped out.