Consulting - the end of a legal career? Forum

[motiontodismiss]

What are the chances of getting sponsored for a JD/MBA from a foreign office of a big 4? Given ITE I'm really rethinking this law school thing...I would rant to my friend but he'd tell me to stop bitching and get that 170.

MBA sponsorship isn't uncommon, though I did read that Bain does not like its associates to stop working to go back to school...so you'd have to know the particular firm culture. Deloitte however, (not big 4, but up there) actively uses MBA sponsorship as a marketing tool.

Now, sponsoring a JD, I don't know about that one. While the consulting firms supposedly "love the way law students think," I don't see how it's in their interest to pay for a law degree that won't ultimately serve its intended end: the practice of law. Unless you are looking at joining the Tax practice at one of these firms, I'd highly doubt that they'd sponsor a law degree.

Bingo.

If no JD sponsorship do you think they'd agree to a deal where I'd pay the JD tuition and all they have to give me is extra time off work and a job offer after I graduate?

[bdubs]

Bingo.

If no JD sponsorship do you think they'd agree to a deal where I'd pay the JD tuition and all they have to give me is extra time off work and a job offer after I graduate?

Are you looking to get a job now and apply in 2-3 years? If you can get a job and do well you may get sponsored, but I wouldn't bring it up right away. You would need to be in the top of your cohort to get them to consider something unusual like this.

[motiontodismiss]

Bingo.

If no JD sponsorship do you think they'd agree to a deal where I'd pay the JD tuition and all they have to give me is extra time off work and a job offer after I graduate?

Are you looking to get a job now and apply in 2-3 years? If you can get a job and do well you may get sponsored, but I wouldn't bring it up right away. You would need to be in the top of your cohort to get them to consider something unusual like this.

Of course I wouldn't be stupid enough to bring this up at the interview stage. And yes I'm looking to do something like that.

[bdubs]

Of course I wouldn't be stupid enough to bring this up at the interview stage. And yes I'm looking to do something like that.

You will probably have to do a pretty good song and dance with some significant ROI calculations to justify the extra year, money and risk of a JD/MBA sponsorship.

If you have any desire to practice law I would probably opt for a JD straight out of UG or with 1 or 2 years of experience.

[motiontodismiss]

Of course I wouldn't be stupid enough to bring this up at the interview stage. And yes I'm looking to do something like that.

You will probably have to do a pretty good song and dance with some significant ROI calculations to justify the extra year, money and risk of a JD/MBA sponsorship.

If you have any desire to practice law I would probably opt for a JD straight out of UG or with 1 or 2 years of experience.

I'm not actually completely sure I want to do law, which is why I'm doing my due diligence, so to speak.

And rumor is that biglaw loves big consulting type WE.

[trojanfan06]

MVP person here. I'm not sure about the grades question. Perhaps YHS people not having grades suggests that the firms put greater weight on undergrad credentials and SAT/LSAT scores than law school grades, which would make sense, considering most consultants are MBAs/straight out of undergrads.

fwiw, I think my law school grades were the weakest part of my application and I was still selected to move onto the next round. (I did, however, have an econ/math background in undergrad, and I think McKinsey/Bain actively recruited from my undergrad anyway.) That said, I'm not convinced that attending HYSCN gives you a leg up beyond making it easier to submit an initial application, considering your results for the first round are pretty much based entirely on your score on the objective exam and for the latter two rounds your results are based on case studies. Perhaps certain schools' alumni seems more prevalent at consulting firms because the individuals from these schools tend to exhibit greater potential and interest in consulting than students from other schools. This shouldn't be confused with "getting a leg up" for simply attending a particular school. Additionally, consulting firms actively recruit at a ton of undergrads and other grad programs where they don't preferentially hire people. I have no reason to believe that they would treat law students differently.

Mind sending me a PM about your recruiting process??

[Anonymous User]

I'm a Penn student and know someone that interviewed with McKinsey. They made it through the first two rounds of interviews. I have no idea what percentage of people make it through each round, so that may or may not be an accomplishment, but it seems like they at least got considered. Not top LS grades or previous work experience. Have no idea about their LSAT or SAT scores.

[Anonymous User]

I'm a Penn student and know someone that interviewed with McKinsey. They made it through the first two rounds of interviews. I have no idea what percentage of people make it through each round, so that may or may not be an accomplishment, but it seems like they at least got considered. Not top LS grades or previous work experience. Have no idea about their LSAT or SAT scores.

don't consulting firms give you these hard-ass aptitude tests? Or at this stage is it just more or less routine interviewing?

It scares me to think lawyers would prefer to be consultants or bankers. I mean... I thought they had it rough

[Anonymous User]

I'm a Penn student and know someone that interviewed with McKinsey. They made it through the first two rounds of interviews. I have no idea what percentage of people make it through each round, so that may or may not be an accomplishment, but it seems like they at least got considered. Not top LS grades or previous work experience. Have no idea about their LSAT or SAT scores.

don't consulting firms give you these hard-ass aptitude tests? Or at this stage is it just more or less routine interviewing?

It scares me to think lawyers would prefer to be consultants or bankers. I mean... I thought they had it rough

At every stage (usually 3 rounds) there are tests, whether it's m/c or case studies.

It's not that hard if you are more of a math person (referencing more the way that you think rather than actually doing real math problems). The multiple choice test has basic econ/math problems. It is a very competitive process though. Something like 1% of applicants land a job with McKinsey.

[Anonymous User]

I am also a Penn person and I know two people who interviewed with McKinsey -- one of them got through the first round but not the second; the other got through two rounds but not the third. So, no, they ultimately weren't hired, but I suppose that they were definitely considered.

[motiontodismiss]

I suppose it's got a lot to do with the fact that Wharton's like right next door (literally). I hear McK is a really good line to have on one's resume, but Oliver Wyman (a division of Mercer I believe) pays the highest.

[James Bond]

McKinsey, BCG, and Bain are the gold standard in management consulting, and yes the interviews are that selective

[Anonymous User]

Regarding McKinsey, I'm a Mich 2L who got through round 1 before I withdrew from consideration. I know a Mich 3L who landed a job with McKinsey, and my Mich friend got through round one, but not round two. I definitely don't think consideration is just limited to HYSCN.

[trojanfan06]

Can anyone that went through the process as a law student or know the process really well from a law student perspective send me a PM?? Thanks!

[James Bond]

Can anyone that went through the process as a law student or know the process really well from a law student perspective send me a PM?? Thanks!

You can go onto their websites. Most have sample interview questions and a lot of details about recruiting

[motiontodismiss]

McKinsey, BCG, and Bain are the gold standard in management consulting, and yes the interviews are that selective

It really is, and after 3 years there (especially at M and BC) you can basically write your own ticket to any job you want in industry.

[James Bond]

McKinsey, BCG, and Bain are the gold standard in management consulting, and yes the interviews are that selective

It really is, and after 3 years there (especially at M and BC) you can basically write your own ticket to any job you want in industry.

I'm sure it's been said though, but getting a JD JUST to get into consulting is silly. There are really 3 routes to get a top consulting gig:

1. Go to Harvard, Princeton, Yale, Columbia, Oxford, Cambridge, or LSE for UG. I'm sure there are exceptions, but not many. These MIGHT get you in straight out of UG.

2. Get an MBA from Harvard, Sloan, Wharton, Columbia, and maybe Stern and Kellogg. Yes, there is a huge East Coast bias. No, nobody gives a shit.

3. Work in-industry for 20 years and demonstrate, somehow, how indispensable and knowledgeable to that industry you are.

They are arranged in order of likelihood. Yes, there are exceptions from time to time but those people are badasses who just happened to go to a non-prestigious school for some reason other than intelligence and drive and they have an uphill battle still. But for the top 3 gigs this is about it.

[trojanfan06]

Do the people going through this process do it during their 2L or 3L year? I have read the recruiting cycles for law firms and consulting firms are at different time periods. And I assume if you were to do consulting for 2L summer, you are pretty much done for the possibility of getting a law firm job after graduation??

*edited for clarity

[James Bond]

Do the people going through this process do it during their 2L or 3L year? I have read the recruiting cycles for law firms and consulting firms are at different time periods. And I assume if you were to do this for 2L summer, you are pretty much for getting a law firm job after graduation??

No

[Renzo]

Do the people going through this process do it during their 2L or 3L year? I have read the recruiting cycles for law firms and consulting firms are at different time periods. And I assume if you were to do this for 2L summer, you are pretty much for getting a law firm job after graduation??

No

To elaborate:
Application cycles are basically the same. You can apply at the same time as biglaw (for your 2L summer). If you summer at a consultancy, your legal career is dead right there--no firm wants you when its clear you'd rather be in business. You can also apply as a 3L, since the consultancies aren't as caught up in class-years and lockstep systems as the firms.

[motiontodismiss]

McKinsey, BCG, and Bain are the gold standard in management consulting, and yes the interviews are that selective

It really is, and after 3 years there (especially at M and BC) you can basically write your own ticket to any job you want in industry.

I'm sure it's been said though, but getting a JD JUST to get into consulting is silly. There are really 3 routes to get a top consulting gig:

1. Go to Harvard, Princeton, Yale, Columbia, Oxford, Cambridge, or LSE for UG. I'm sure there are exceptions, but not many. These MIGHT get you in straight out of UG.

2. Get an MBA from Harvard, Sloan, Wharton, Columbia, and maybe Stern and Kellogg. Yes, there is a huge East Coast bias. No, nobody gives a shit.

3. Work in-industry for 20 years and demonstrate, somehow, how indispensable and knowledgeable to that industry you are.

They are arranged in order of likelihood. Yes, there are exceptions from time to time but those people are badasses who just happened to go to a non-prestigious school for some reason other than intelligence and drive and they have an uphill battle still. But for the top 3 gigs this is about it.

Never said it wasn't.

[Seally]

McKinsey, BCG, and Bain are the gold standard in management consulting, and yes the interviews are that selective

It really is, and after 3 years there (especially at M and BC) you can basically write your own ticket to any job you want in industry.

I'm sure it's been said though, but getting a JD JUST to get into consulting is silly. There are really 3 routes to get a top consulting gig:

1. Go to Harvard, Princeton, Yale, Columbia, Oxford, Cambridge, or LSE for UG. I'm sure there are exceptions, but not many. These MIGHT get you in straight out of UG.

2. Get an MBA from Harvard, Sloan, Wharton, Columbia, and maybe Stern and Kellogg. Yes, there is a huge East Coast bias. No, nobody gives a shit.

3. Work in-industry for 20 years and demonstrate, somehow, how indispensable and knowledgeable to that industry you are.

They are arranged in order of likelihood. Yes, there are exceptions from time to time but those people are badasses who just happened to go to a non-prestigious school for some reason other than intelligence and drive and they have an uphill battle still. But for the top 3 gigs this is about it.

Never said it wasn't.

Not that silly if you have Scholarship, but i agree that going sticker at let's say Cornell just to try out for Consulting and having no real interest in Law Firms is really fucking dumb.

[XxSpyKEx]

Not that silly if you have Scholarship

Yeah it is. Unless the school is also paying you 3 years of lost opportunity costs to attend and somehow you are getting work experience elsewhere as well (since your odds of actually getting into consulting with a JD are that slim). It's basically like wasting 3 years of your life and shutting the door to other job opportunities by getting a JD (since other employers that might have hired you prior to law school are no longer going to be interested in hiring you because you are now too much of a flight risk). Obviously, it makes sense to get a JD if you actually want to practice law, but if you don't then it's just dumb.

[Blindmelon]

Not that silly if you have Scholarship

Yeah it is. Unless the school is also paying you 3 years of lost opportunity costs to attend and somehow you are getting work experience elsewhere as well (since your odds of actually getting into consulting with a JD are that slim). It's basically like wasting 3 years of your life and shutting the door to other job opportunities by getting a JD (since other employers that might have hired you prior to law school are no longer going to be interested in hiring you because you are now too much of a flight risk). Obviously, it makes sense to get a JD if you actually want to practice law, but if you don't then it's just dumb.

Agreed 100%. Especially since some management consulting firms don't recruit JDs AT ALL. Yes, the elite ones do, but thats not the only game in town, and it also happens to be the most competitive to get into.

[Seally]

Not that silly if you have Scholarship

Yeah it is. Unless the school is also paying you 3 years of lost opportunity costs to attend and somehow you are getting work experience elsewhere as well (since your odds of actually getting into consulting with a JD are that slim). It's basically like wasting 3 years of your life and shutting the door to other job opportunities by getting a JD (since other employers that might have hired you prior to law school are no longer going to be interested in hiring you because you are now too much of a flight risk). Obviously, it makes sense to get a JD if you actually want to practice law, but if you don't then it's just dumb.

That's what i meant, getting a JD for Business is dumb unless you get full-ride at a top school, but hey, many Consulting firms, Investment Banks, F500 Companies look at Lawyers for Business positions since they have a more sharp mentality than most Business grads out there.
+They are often looked at since they can use their Analytical prowess to talk to clients.

Coming from a Corporate Law background, no one will doubt that you have the required stamina to do either Management Consulting or Investment Banking + any other relevent Business job, the only thing you have to prove is that you can count.

If you did Business before Law(That's what i plan to do first hand.), you won't even have to worry about proving yourself.


In fact, many, many successful CEOs all around the world hold Law Degrees, (ex: Goldman Sachs CEO, Lazard's creator, Quebecor's CEO, just to name a few.)

You'll basically have to sell yourself if you want a job in Business, easier said than done.