HLS EIP 2013 Forum

[Anonymous User]

what is a reasonable amount of CBs someone should have out of the NY market to feel somewhat comfortable?

[Anonymous User]

what is a reasonable amount of CBs someone should have out of the NY market to feel somewhat comfortable?

Depends on the offer rate of the firms and also whether you were under or over-performing screener-->CB in the first place.

[Anonymous User]

what is a reasonable amount of CBs someone should have out of the NY market to feel somewhat comfortable?

Depends on the offer rate of the firms and also whether you were under or over-performing screener-->CB in the first place.

Worst worst case scenario? Think 10-15 is safe?

[Anonymous User]

what is a reasonable amount of CBs someone should have out of the NY market to feel somewhat comfortable?

Depends on the offer rate of the firms and also whether you were under or over-performing screener-->CB in the first place.

Worst worst case scenario? Think 10-15 is safe?

Depends. I know people outside of HLS who struck out after 20+ callbacks. Are these firms where there CB-->offer ratio is less than 50%? If so, no. Are these firms where they give offers to like 80% of callbacks? Sure. If you're worried, prepare real hard for those CBs and start developing a back-up plan. 0 offers after 10-15 NYC callbacks sounds unlikely, but I wouldn't rule it out as a "worst worst case scenario."

[Anonymous User]

what is a reasonable amount of CBs someone should have out of the NY market to feel somewhat comfortable?

Depends on the offer rate of the firms and also whether you were under or over-performing screener-->CB in the first place.

Worst worst case scenario? Think 10-15 is safe?

3-6 is prob safe for HLS.

[Anonymous User]

Anyone else with 1 LP and straight Ps? Only 1 CB and seriously freaking out. I also have nothing special on my resume in terms of softs. I think I may be a case where my grades really did shut me out.

Rising 3L here. Yes, 1LP and straight Ps is an almost certain recipe to strike out unless you have amazing softs or connections. You need to be sending out cover letter & resume everywhere you can right. now. Your home market and NYC. I'm a huge advocate on here of "grades aren't important", there's an important caveat to that--unless you have an LP with straight Ps. I can't believe OCS didn't warn you to start looking outside of EIP before EIP.

Yeah I'm sorry man, OCS is not always such a great resource. I think they told me I was safe with a bid list that ended up being too aggressive (I'm the anon from above with 3 CBs), and I think they generally drink the "it's HLS; you're fine" kool aid. That said, I wish I had been a bit more proactive before EIP, but here we are. I'm starting my mass mail, and I'm wondering how necessary a generic cover letter is? That other guide to people in our situation said it'd be okay to omit them, and if the goal is to get out as many error-free emails as possible, it makes sense (particularly because my generic cover letter doesn't do a lot more than my resume already does).

[pupshaw]

I know people outside of HLS who struck out after 20+ callbacks.

[Anonymous User]

I know people outside of HLS who struck out after 20+ callbacks.

To be fair, this was at a school where the screener was more of a grades & resume screener. This is less likely at HLS since they do more of interview interview screening at the screener.

[Anonymous User]

Yeah I'm sorry man, OCS is not always such a great resource. I think they told me I was safe with a bid list that ended up being too aggressive (I'm the anon from above with 3 CBs), and I think they generally drink the "it's HLS; you're fine" kool aid. That said, I wish I had been a bit more proactive before EIP, but here we are. I'm starting my mass mail, and I'm wondering how necessary a generic cover letter is? That other guide to people in our situation said it'd be okay to omit them, and if the goal is to get out as many error-free emails as possible, it makes sense (particularly because my generic cover letter doesn't do a lot more than my resume already does).

Ditch the cover letter. If there is something targeted for you to say for a particular firm, just say it in the e-mail.

[Anonymous User]

Yeah I'm sorry man, OCS is not always such a great resource. I think they told me I was safe with a bid list that ended up being too aggressive (I'm the anon from above with 3 CBs), and I think they generally drink the "it's HLS; you're fine" kool aid. That said, I wish I had been a bit more proactive before EIP, but here we are. I'm starting my mass mail, and I'm wondering how necessary a generic cover letter is? That other guide to people in our situation said it'd be okay to omit them, and if the goal is to get out as many error-free emails as possible, it makes sense (particularly because my generic cover letter doesn't do a lot more than my resume already does).

Ditch the cover letter. If there is something targeted for you to say for a particular firm, just say it in the e-mail.

Great, thanks. I have some ties to a few regions, and I might throw a sentence in the email about that (although they're pretty evident from my resume). Guess we'll see how it goes, if I can snag a few more CBs from either the firms that haven't responded from EIP/this mass mail I'll feel ok (and hope that the high offer rates from my firms in the past 2 years stay that way).

[Anonymous User]

what is a reasonable amount of CBs someone should have out of the NY market to feel somewhat comfortable?

Depends on the offer rate of the firms and also whether you were under or over-performing screener-->CB in the first place.

Worst worst case scenario? Think 10-15 is safe?

3-6 is prob safe for HLS.

Curiosity--what are you basing this on? I say as someone who's copped 4 nyc cbs and is fluctuating between freaking out and calming down on an hourly basis.

[Anonymous User]

Curiosity--what are you basing this on? I say as someone who's copped 4 nyc cbs and is fluctuating between freaking out and calming down on an hourly basis.

4 wouldnt be bad if one was S&C

[Anonymous User]

Is S&C done? Seems like there hasn't been THAT much S&C activity, at least according to posts on this forum...

[Anonymous User]

Curiosity--what are you basing this on? I say as someone who's copped 4 nyc cbs and is fluctuating between freaking out and calming down on an hourly basis.

4 wouldnt be bad if one was S&C

Exactly. As mentioned earlier it also depends on the firms that have called you back. Having only one CB at S&C may be better than having 3 at some other firms. Look at the EIP stats data on OCS' website before you start freaking out.

[Anonymous User]

Is S&C done? Seems like there hasn't been THAT much S&C activity, at least according to posts on this forum...

Remember this thread is not very representative. For example DPW usually calls back about 100 people but you wouldn't think that if you looked at this thread.

[Anonymous User]

what is a reasonable amount of CBs someone should have out of the NY market to feel somewhat comfortable?

Depends on the offer rate of the firms and also whether you were under or over-performing screener-->CB in the first place.

Worst worst case scenario? Think 10-15 is safe?

Depends. I know people outside of HLS who struck out after 20+ callbacks. Are these firms where there CB-->offer ratio is less than 50%? If so, no. Are these firms where they give offers to like 80% of callbacks? Sure. If you're worried, prepare real hard for those CBs and start developing a back-up plan. 0 offers after 10-15 NYC callbacks sounds unlikely, but I wouldn't rule it out as a "worst worst case scenario."

Don't mean to sound excessively optimistic, but I don't think this is a reasonable assessment. Looking at last year's EIP statistics, you would have to be extraordinarily unlucky to get 10-15 callbacks without several of those firms having high callback/offer ratios. You must have competent interview skills if you got that many callbacks in the first place, and the prospect of somehow failing to succeed in literally all of your subsequent interviews seems extremely unlikely. Among the HLSers who strike out each year, my guess is that close to 0% of them started out with 10-15 callbacks.

[Anonymous User]

Don't mean to sound excessively optimistic, but I don't think this is a reasonable assessment. Looking at last year's EIP statistics, you would have to be extraordinarily unlucky to get 10-15 callbacks without several of those firms having high callback/offer ratios. You must have competent interview skills if you got that many callbacks in the first place, and the prospect of somehow failing to succeed in literally all of your subsequent interviews seems extremely unlikely. Among the HLSers who strike out each year, my guess is that close to 0% of them started out with 10-15 callbacks.

I said it was unlikely, but their year is worse than ours and it's not clear yet how much worse. I didn't do NYC, but I know in my market several of the major firms slashed their summer classes in half for this upcoming recruiting system, and these numbers don't match with what they reported to NALP. I guess I'll modify it--if after 10-15 NYC callbacks, you get no offer, then we'll know just how badly legal hiring is imploding right now. It would be catastrophic. But catastrophic things have happened in the last few years. Based off of last year, you should breath easy. This year probably isn't catastrophic, either. I wouldn't start scrambling to mass mail at 10-15 callbacks, though feel free to do the "hey I'm going to be in the area" e-mail to a few firms. Can't hurt.

Also, seconding whoever said not to use this thread as a barometer for movement. Also, ppl rarely make "yeah me too" posts after a firm's callbacks have been announced, so a firm that issues 100 callbacks might just have one post, or ppl might not bother to post because if a bunch of ppl they know IRL know, why bother posting.

[Anonymous User]

Has anyone heard from Simpson (LL) or S&C (JM)?

bump

[Anonymous User]

where can I go to lookup the callback to offer rate of a given firm?

[Anonymous User]

where can I go to lookup the callback to offer rate of a given firm?

https://www.law.harvard.edu/current/car ... index.html

[Anonymous User]

Rejection from OMM SF!

[Anonymous User]

Has anyone heard anything from Munger one way or the other?

[Anonymous User]

Has anyone heard anything from Munger one way or the other?

Some CBs have gone out.

[Anonymous User]

Has anyone heard anything from Munger one way or the other?

Some CBs have gone out.

Not what I'd hoped to hear but still good to know, thanks

[Anonymous User]

They did warn me and I've done mass mailings already. I'm starting to think that I should also branch out and try to apply for non-law jobs as well? Big law was my goal coming to HLS, but the outlook is not great right now. Maybe if I pull up my grades this year I'll have better luck with EIP as a 3L, but not holding my breath.

I was no-offered by my summer firm, so I'm in an even worse boat than you. 3L hiring is sparse, down, and fiercely competitive. There's a sharp uptick in no-offers this year--my section alone has the same # that the entire class had in previous years. So, if you're biglaw or bust, I'm not sure you should have enough hope to do 2L and try 3L OCI.

I'm sorry, that is really disappointing. What are you/other people that strike out with big law thinking of doing instead of law? I'm also open to do something else (e.g. consulting) if I don't get a big law offer.

Not to get you guys down.. but getting a consulting job from HLS is significantly harder than getting biglaw. Everyone I know who swung a consulting offer was either JD/MBA or had V10 or equivalent options.

Appreciate the reality check, but what do you suggest we do instead? I would really prefer not to work at a small firm (just because I've done that sort of internship before and it wasn't my thing). At this point, my big law back-up plan is to try to leverage the Harvard brand to get into another field. If that is possible...