2021 End of Year Bonuses Forum

[Anonymous User]

Do we think it’s going to be a V10 or non-V10 that sets the bar? My money is on non-V10 and I hope they get quality recruiting classes for years to come.

This would follow the Millbank precedent and it worked for them. But I'm not sure bonus is as public as raises, so I'd guess it will follow the special bonuses and retention/hiring, which mostly came from the top.

[BottomOfTotem]

My guess is a slight increase (e.g., ~ $10k for co 2019) with a promise that there will retention bonuses structured similarly to this past year. I’d be pissed, but something tells me these firms are going to bet on power of these spread-out retention bonuses.

[Anonymous User]

For those who “only” care about EOY, how do you think about Skadden only paying part of its covid bonus this year as part of its EOY bonus? For example class of 2016 is going to have an extra 26k on top of the “base scale.”

Surely this will lead every firm to increase their bonus by 26k, but then skadden will match so also have to pay their 26k on top of that, leading to a spiral upwards that will only stop once scale has doubled (maybe tripled).

[Anonymous User]

For those who “only” care about EOY, how do you think about Skadden only paying part of its covid bonus this year as part of its EOY bonus? For example class of 2016 is going to have an extra 26k on top of the “base scale.”

Surely this will lead every firm to increase their bonus by 26k, but then skadden will match so also have to pay their 26k on top of that, leading to a spiral upwards that will only stop once scale has doubled (maybe tripled).

I believe we've made our demands very clear.

[Anonymous User]

For those who “only” care about EOY, how do you think about Skadden only paying part of its covid bonus this year as part of its EOY bonus? For example class of 2016 is going to have an extra 26k on top of the “base scale.”

Surely this will lead every firm to increase their bonus by 26k, but then skadden will match so also have to pay their 26k on top of that, leading to a spiral upwards that will only stop once scale has doubled (maybe tripled).

Oh no! Anything but this. Please don't throw me into the briar patch.

[showusyourtorts]

Good morning, team. Checking in for the morning shift. Today could be a good day.

[NoLongerALurker]

Meanwhile on the IB side: https://www.cnbc.com/2021/11/16/wall-st ... eport.html

[Anonymous User]

Meanwhile on the IB side: https://www.cnbc.com/2021/11/16/wall-st ... eport.html

Were bankers paid mid-year special bonuses? I know that, like BL, their salary scale went up in 2021

[Anonymous User]

Meanwhile on the IB side: https://www.cnbc.com/2021/11/16/wall-st ... eport.html

Were bankers paid mid-year special bonuses? I know that, like BL, their salary scale went up in 2021

I'm not really sure it matters honestly. Our compensation doesn't really track IB, so I'm not sure why it's used as guidance. Their structure is just completely different (ie actual difference in pay between banks, lower base higher bonus, bonus actually tied to performance and not just seniority, bonus paid in stock vesting/subject to clawback, etc.)

[Anonymous User]

I'm also at a firm that split the special mid year bonus into two 50/50 payments and the second payment is paid in December. I'm sure they won't but they better not try to call that part of this year's EOY bonus.

[showusyourtorts]

Meanwhile on the IB side: https://www.cnbc.com/2021/11/16/wall-st ... eport.html

Were bankers paid mid-year special bonuses? I know that, like BL, their salary scale went up in 2021

I'm not really sure it matters honestly. Our compensation doesn't really track IB, so I'm not sure why it's used as guidance. Their structure is just completely different (ie actual difference in pay between banks, lower base higher bonus, bonus actually tied to performance and not just seniority, bonus paid in stock vesting/subject to clawback, etc.)

I guess it's got to be a good signaling device, if nothing else. It makes intuitive sense that corporate biglaw shops and investment banking groups would have banner years at the same time (i.e., booming market, more deals, etc.). It also probably makes it a bit easier PR-wise for biglaw firms to announce over-the-top associate bonuses if the banks already recently gave over-the-top bonuses in acknowledgment of their similar workload. Not sure how much either of these points really matter, though. Firms will obviously do what they deem appropriate to retain associates, regardless of what their clients may think.

[UncleKirk]

First announcement will come Tuesday the 16th. You heard it here first.

Let’s see if this anon is legit…

[peoplearehungry]

An additional fact to consider while everyone sits on their hands, Wells Fargo is saying that for the first 3/4 of 2021, the revenue of AmLaw top 50 firms increased by 17% https://www.reuters.com/legal/legalindu ... 021-11-15/.

A 17% bump over last year's scale would look like this:

Class of 2021: $17,550 (pro rated)
Class of 2020: $17,550
Class of 2019: $29,250
Class of 2018: $58,500
Class of 2017: $76,050
Class of 2016: $93,600
Class of 2015: $105,300
Class of 2014 and later: $117,000

[Anonymous User]

An additional fact to consider while everyone sits on their hands, Wells Fargo is saying that for the first 3/4 of 2021, the revenue of AmLaw top 50 firms increased by 17% https://www.reuters.com/legal/legalindu ... 021-11-15/.

A 17% bump over last year's scale would look like this:

Class of 2021: $17,550 (pro rated)
Class of 2020: $17,550
Class of 2019: $29,250
Class of 2018: $58,500
Class of 2017: $76,050
Class of 2016: $93,600
Class of 2015: $105,300
Class of 2014 and later: $117,000

Revenue up 17% with overhead unchanged or even reduced (shrinking office spaces, no increase in hires commensurate with the increase in work/revenue) means net profits are up much more than 17%.

[Rowseat2]

An additional fact to consider while everyone sits on their hands, Wells Fargo is saying that for the first 3/4 of 2021, the revenue of AmLaw top 50 firms increased by 17% https://www.reuters.com/legal/legalindu ... 021-11-15/.

A 17% bump over last year's scale would look like this:

Class of 2021: $17,550 (pro rated)
Class of 2020: $17,550
Class of 2019: $29,250
Class of 2018: $58,500
Class of 2017: $76,050
Class of 2016: $93,600
Class of 2015: $105,300
Class of 2014 and later: $117,000

Revenue up 17% with overhead unchanged or even reduced (shrinking office spaces, no increase in hires commensurate with the increase in work/revenue) means net profits are up much more than 17%.

I don't think that's entirely true - with increased compensation costs (both in base pay raises + special bonuses), costs are arguably up this year. And for many firms, the office space cost is locked in with long-term leases, coupled with (possibly) increased IT costs, although theoretically those IT costs should have been baked in.

[Anonymous User]

An additional fact to consider while everyone sits on their hands, Wells Fargo is saying that for the first 3/4 of 2021, the revenue of AmLaw top 50 firms increased by 17% https://www.reuters.com/legal/legalindu ... 021-11-15/.

A 17% bump over last year's scale would look like this:

Class of 2021: $17,550 (pro rated)
Class of 2020: $17,550
Class of 2019: $29,250
Class of 2018: $58,500
Class of 2017: $76,050
Class of 2016: $93,600
Class of 2015: $105,300
Class of 2014 and later: $117,000

Revenue up 17% with overhead unchanged or even reduced (shrinking office spaces, no increase in hires commensurate with the increase in work/revenue) means net profits are up much more than 17%.

I don't think that's entirely true - with increased compensation costs (both in base pay raises + special bonuses), costs are arguably up this year. And for many firms, the office space cost is locked in with long-term leases, coupled with (possibly) increased IT costs, although theoretically those IT costs should have been baked in.

Our V20 firm announced in a town hall that expenses were flat vs. 2020…

[Anonymous User]

An additional fact to consider while everyone sits on their hands, Wells Fargo is saying that for the first 3/4 of 2021, the revenue of AmLaw top 50 firms increased by 17% https://www.reuters.com/legal/legalindu ... 021-11-15/.

A 17% bump over last year's scale would look like this:

Class of 2021: $17,550 (pro rated)
Class of 2020: $17,550
Class of 2019: $29,250
Class of 2018: $58,500
Class of 2017: $76,050
Class of 2016: $93,600
Class of 2015: $105,300
Class of 2014 and later: $117,000

Revenue up 17% with overhead unchanged or even reduced (shrinking office spaces, no increase in hires commensurate with the increase in work/revenue) means net profits are up much more than 17%.

I don't think that's entirely true - with increased compensation costs (both in base pay raises + special bonuses), costs are arguably up this year. And for many firms, the office space cost is locked in with long-term leases, coupled with (possibly) increased IT costs, although theoretically those IT costs should have been baked in.

Anecdotal but my firm said in 2020 they had big drop in revenue but still had best year ever on net income due to decreased cost as a result of working from home. My take was why the fuck are we trying to work harder if that's possible but that's just me.

Same firm last year didn't give/announce the covid bonus until part of end of year bonus (matched both, without prorating covid bonus for hours, which was nice). If they do that again and match the other regular (though increased for this year) bonuses, fine, but then if additional special bonuses are announced it better be added (hopefully this time on the timeline of other firms but don't think waiting to the end of the year is too terrible, as I plan to make it one more time around the sun).

My guess is we'll have a small increase in the standard year end bonus across the market with announcement of future additional retention bonuses, but it's utter BS and not a good plan for the partners wanting to keep associates around (especially if my firm again delays payout of covid bonus).

Anyway, here's to hoping for more.

[Anonymous User]

The lack of news is getting painful. Our firms have to be trolling us at this point.

[fmrez]

The lack of news is getting painful. Our firms have to be trolling us at this point.

More likely they're trolling each other.

[Anonymous User]

The lack of news is getting painful. Our firms have to be trolling us at this point.

More likely they're trolling each other.

Poor Above the Law-you know someone over there is waiting with baited breath to start their 50 or so posts on bonuses.

[objctnyrhnr]

Do we think there’s a crew of top brass at a handful of v15s who are actively discussing strategy on this amongst one another (maybe even coordinating/negotiating to some degree), or do we think it’s only discussed internally at each firm and it’s a big secret to the others until it’s literally revealed to the public?

[Anonymous User]

Do we think there’s a crew of top brass at a handful of v15s who are actively discussing strategy on this amongst one another (maybe even coordinating/negotiating to some degree), or do we think it’s only discussed internally at each firm and it’s a big secret to the others until it’s literally revealed to the public?

For what it's worth: our firm had a town hall today and all that we were told was that we would meet or exceed market year-end bonuses (we already got our second COVID bonus for the year).

I guess now we play the waiting game? But I doubt there is any express collusion between the firms - seems like it would violate some antitrust law or something (but I'm not an antitrust lawyer - can anyone with knowledge of the area weigh in?).

[Anonymous User]

Do we think there’s a crew of top brass at a handful of v15s who are actively discussing strategy on this amongst one another (maybe even coordinating/negotiating to some degree), or do we think it’s only discussed internally at each firm and it’s a big secret to the others until it’s literally revealed to the public?

For what it's worth: our firm had a town hall today and all that we were told was that we would meet or exceed market year-end bonuses (we already got our second COVID bonus for the year).

I guess now we play the waiting game? But I doubt there is any express collusion between the firms - seems like it would violate some antitrust law or something (but I'm not an antitrust lawyer - can anyone with knowledge of the area weigh in?).

FWIW, the firm above is Proskauer. Never has been, nor will be, a first mover, but will certainly follow whatever the market does.

[Anonymous User]

The lack of news is getting painful. Our firms have to be trolling us at this point.

More likely they're trolling each other.

Poor Above the Law-you know someone over there is waiting with baited breath to start their 50 or so posts on bonuses.

I am in no way endorsing this idea, just musing, but I wonder if ATL received a fake memo from one firm, it would prompt enough firms to act that they couldn't take it back, or does ATL actually get confirmation before publication?

[cfcm]

The lack of news is getting painful. Our firms have to be trolling us at this point.

More likely they're trolling each other.

Poor Above the Law-you know someone over there is waiting with baited breath to start their 50 or so posts on bonuses.

I am in no way endorsing this idea, just musing, but I wonder if ATL received a fake memo from one firm, it would prompt enough firms to act that they couldn't take it back, or does ATL actually get confirmation before publication?

Sort of related, someone tried that with a fake slide deck announcing a salary raise a few years ago. Didn’t work sadly.

https://abovethelaw.com/2015/10/ny-to-1 ... -salaries/