Columbia Law WIP/EIP Jan 2021 Forum

[Anonymous User]

Now that the dust has settled a bit re: screeners/CBs, does anyone have a sense of how this year shook out? Did it seem like people got fewer screeners and/or CBs than normal, or was everyone worried about nothing? I have heard of people with like 1-2 CBs and others with 15+, but all of that is pure anecdata. Does anyone have a sense of the average number of CBs in prior years?

I mean, we'll only ever know when the data is published . . . but my sense from this forum + talking to 10-15 people is that it was a tough cycle in NY particularly for litigation. A v5 I got an offer with this week explicitly said they took far fewer CBs than normal this year so it does seem uncertainty surrounding COVID has an impact.

[Anonymous User]

Now that the dust has settled a bit re: screeners/CBs, does anyone have a sense of how this year shook out? Did it seem like people got fewer screeners and/or CBs than normal, or was everyone worried about nothing? I have heard of people with like 1-2 CBs and others with 15+, but all of that is pure anecdata. Does anyone have a sense of the average number of CBs in prior years?

I mean, we'll only ever know when the data is published . . . but my sense from this forum + talking to 10-15 people is that it was a tough cycle in NY particularly for litigation. A v5 I got an offer with this week explicitly said they took far fewer CBs than normal this year so it does seem uncertainty surrounding COVID has an impact.

as in the v5 extended far fewer offers to people who got CBs with them? my understanding was that it was a lot tougher to get past the screener stage this year, but that those with CBs were more likely to get offers?

[Anonymous User]

Now that the dust has settled a bit re: screeners/CBs, does anyone have a sense of how this year shook out? Did it seem like people got fewer screeners and/or CBs than normal, or was everyone worried about nothing? I have heard of people with like 1-2 CBs and others with 15+, but all of that is pure anecdata. Does anyone have a sense of the average number of CBs in prior years?

I mean, we'll only ever know when the data is published . . . but my sense from this forum + talking to 10-15 people is that it was a tough cycle in NY particularly for litigation. A v5 I got an offer with this week explicitly said they took far fewer CBs than normal this year so it does seem uncertainty surrounding COVID has an impact.

as in the v5 extended far fewer offers to people who got CBs with them? my understanding was that it was a lot tougher to get past the screener stage this year, but that those with CBs were more likely to get offers?

Ya, far fewer CBs. As for offers, no idea.

[Anonymous User]

Now that the dust has settled a bit re: screeners/CBs, does anyone have a sense of how this year shook out? Did it seem like people got fewer screeners and/or CBs than normal, or was everyone worried about nothing? I have heard of people with like 1-2 CBs and others with 15+, but all of that is pure anecdata. Does anyone have a sense of the average number of CBs in prior years?

I mean, we'll only ever know when the data is published . . . but my sense from this forum + talking to 10-15 people is that it was a tough cycle in NY particularly for litigation. A v5 I got an offer with this week explicitly said they took far fewer CBs than normal this year so it does seem uncertainty surrounding COVID has an impact.

as in the v5 extended far fewer offers to people who got CBs with them? my understanding was that it was a lot tougher to get past the screener stage this year, but that those with CBs were more likely to get offers?

Ya, far fewer CBs. As for offers, no idea.

Somebody in a good position to know at a V10 firm told me that far more people are accepting their callback invites (and actually following through by showing up to callback/not cancelling), versus what they typically see in prior years. To such an extent that this firm was already worried about hitting its numbers and was considering cancelling its upcoming recruiting programs at more regional schools in a few weeks. You can tell from prior years’ EIP data that (for most firms) there’s usually some attrition between “callback invites” and “callbacks interviews” but this person was claiming that attrition had fallen to zero.

Presumably some of that is the ease or convenience of doing callbacks. Even if you have a couple offers, it’s no sweat off your back to show up for additional virtual callbacks. This dynamic might also be contributing to the extra sense of competitiveness at the callback->offer stage.

[Anonymous User]

That makes sense. But the better offer-->callback yield could also be due to a lower number of CBs in general. If all students have fewer CBs, they are presumably much more likely to go to all their CBs. Is there in your experience more competitiveness at the CB stage? For me, it has actually been the opposite--a lot of fast dings from screeners but equally fast offers after CBs.

[Anonymous User]

Not exactly; I have done seven CBs last week and have not received any offers yet. Given the fast turn-out, I assume that CBs are not necessarily indicative of high likelihood for offers.

[Anonymous User]

That makes sense. But the better offer-->callback yield could also be due to a lower number of CBs in general. If all students have fewer CBs, they are presumably much more likely to go to all their CBs. Is there in your experience more competitiveness at the CB stage? For me, it has actually been the opposite--a lot of fast dings from screeners but equally fast offers after CBs.

Totally agree, seems plausible that a fewer average # of callbacks per candidate would lead to higher willingness to pursue each one. I guess it's hard to tease out cause and effect here, my broader point was mainly that I've heard somewhat empirical / authoritative evidence of a tougher cycle.

[Anonymous User]

Now that the dust has settled a bit re: screeners/CBs, does anyone have a sense of how this year shook out? Did it seem like people got fewer screeners and/or CBs than normal, or was everyone worried about nothing? I have heard of people with like 1-2 CBs and others with 15+, but all of that is pure anecdata. Does anyone have a sense of the average number of CBs in prior years?

I mean, we'll only ever know when the data is published . . . but my sense from this forum + talking to 10-15 people is that it was a tough cycle in NY particularly for litigation. A v5 I got an offer with this week explicitly said they took far fewer CBs than normal this year so it does seem uncertainty surrounding COVID has an impact.

as in the v5 extended far fewer offers to people who got CBs with them? my understanding was that it was a lot tougher to get past the screener stage this year, but that those with CBs were more likely to get offers?

Ya, far fewer CBs. As for offers, no idea.

Somebody in a good position to know at a V10 firm told me that far more people are accepting their callback invites (and actually following through by showing up to callback/not cancelling), versus what they typically see in prior years. To such an extent that this firm was already worried about hitting its numbers and was considering cancelling its upcoming recruiting programs at more regional schools in a few weeks. You can tell from prior years’ EIP data that (for most firms) there’s usually some attrition between “callback invites” and “callbacks interviews” but this person was claiming that attrition had fallen to zero.

Presumably some of that is the ease or convenience of doing callbacks. Even if you have a couple offers, it’s no sweat off your back to show up for additional virtual callbacks. This dynamic might also be contributing to the extra sense of competitiveness at the callback->offer stage.

firm is worried it overextended itself and will fill up its class faster than it wants?

[Anonymous User]

firm is worried it overextended itself and will fill up its class faster than it wants?

Correct, the person didn’t say that explicitly but it was certainly the subtext. Could be a smaller target class size, could be changes in candidate behavior at the callback stage, who knows?

[Anonymous User]

People who had a CB to Debevoise: did you interview with 6 people during the CB including the person you did your screener with?

[Anonymous User]

People who had a CB to Debevoise: did you interview with 6 people during the CB including the person you did your screener with?

Haven't done it yet, but yeah, that's what I have in the schedule they sent me

[Anonymous User]

Anyone else feel somewhat misled by how challenging OCI would be this year? Would you have done things differently knowing what you know now?

[Anonymous User]

Now that the dust has settled a bit re: screeners/CBs, does anyone have a sense of how this year shook out? Did it seem like people got fewer screeners and/or CBs than normal, or was everyone worried about nothing? I have heard of people with like 1-2 CBs and others with 15+, but all of that is pure anecdata. Does anyone have a sense of the average number of CBs in prior years?

I mean, we'll only ever know when the data is published . . . but my sense from this forum + talking to 10-15 people is that it was a tough cycle in NY particularly for litigation. A v5 I got an offer with this week explicitly said they took far fewer CBs than normal this year so it does seem uncertainty surrounding COVID has an impact.

as in the v5 extended far fewer offers to people who got CBs with them? my understanding was that it was a lot tougher to get past the screener stage this year, but that those with CBs were more likely to get offers?

Ya, far fewer CBs. As for offers, no idea.

Somebody in a good position to know at a V10 firm told me that far more people are accepting their callback invites (and actually following through by showing up to callback/not cancelling), versus what they typically see in prior years. To such an extent that this firm was already worried about hitting its numbers and was considering cancelling its upcoming recruiting programs at more regional schools in a few weeks. You can tell from prior years’ EIP data that (for most firms) there’s usually some attrition between “callback invites” and “callbacks interviews” but this person was claiming that attrition had fallen to zero.

Presumably some of that is the ease or convenience of doing callbacks. Even if you have a couple offers, it’s no sweat off your back to show up for additional virtual callbacks. This dynamic might also be contributing to the extra sense of competitiveness at the callback->offer stage.

firm is worried it overextended itself and will fill up its class faster than it wants?

Summered at a V30 last summer, recruiter told me that they're seeing people withdraw from the process a lot sooner this year too. So it seems like all around this is just going to be a very weird year, and it wouldn't be too crazy to see callbacks come back from some firms later than usual as they have people pull out of the process earlier.

[Anonymous User]

For those of you with expiring pre-OCI offers, are there any stories of successful extension requests?

[Anonymous User]

People who had a CB to Debevoise: did you interview with 6 people during the CB including the person you did your screener with?

Yes.

Anyone know the typical time between Deb CB -> offer?

[Anonymous User]

Anyone know the typical time between Deb CB -> offer?

Idk how typical this is, but I had CB Fri, offer Tues (long weekend in between)

[Anonymous User]

For those of you with expiring pre-OCI offers, are there any stories of successful extension requests?

I’m the anon who was talking about Weil a page or two back. I lobbied for a deadline extension on their pre OCI offer, and even referred them to the CLS 21-day policy, but had no luck. Straight-up DGAF reaction to the 21-day policy. Reached out to OCS for advice and they never got back to me (lol). So I’m giving up on that offer and will be releasing it soon.

Depends on the firm and how much time you have left, but I think the best strategy is to first schedule 2nd looks (as a way of demonstrating interest), and only then request the extension. A phone call to recruiting might be more effective than an email. Good luck!

[Anonymous User]

For those of you with expiring pre-OCI offers, are there any stories of successful extension requests?

I’m the anon who was talking about Weil a page or two back. I lobbied for a deadline extension on their pre OCI offer, and even referred them to the CLS 21-day policy, but had no luck. Straight-up DGAF reaction to the 21-day policy. Reached out to OCS for advice and they never got back to me (lol). So I’m giving up on that offer and will be releasing it soon.

Depends on the firm and how much time you have left, but I think the best strategy is to first schedule 2nd looks (as a way of demonstrating interest), and only then request the extension. A phone call to recruiting might be more effective than an email. Good luck!

Wow. have we heard of any other firms refusing to budge on extension requests?

[Anonymous User]

Has anybody else gotten an extremely low number of callbacks, no offers, and are thinking they won't get a job? If we don't get firm jobs this summer, does anybody know how that will affect the job search after graduation?

[Anonymous User]

Perkins Coie Palo Alto CB invitation

[Anonymous User]

Anyone receive any offers from CA firms?

Peer school. Got an offer at Irell. Dinged at Kirkland and Simpson post CB.

How long after Simpson callback did you get a ding?

[Anonymous User]

For those of you with expiring pre-OCI offers, are there any stories of successful extension requests?

I’m the anon who was talking about Weil a page or two back. I lobbied for a deadline extension on their pre OCI offer, and even referred them to the CLS 21-day policy, but had no luck. Straight-up DGAF reaction to the 21-day policy. Reached out to OCS for advice and they never got back to me (lol). So I’m giving up on that offer and will be releasing it soon.

Depends on the firm and how much time you have left, but I think the best strategy is to first schedule 2nd looks (as a way of demonstrating interest), and only then request the extension. A phone call to recruiting might be more effective than an email. Good luck!

Scheduling a second look vs. going silent while you are attending to other callbacks is the way to go. There is a fear of recession looming and where you have some hesitation, there are other candidates more than eager to accept an offer. Firms seem much more focused on the right combination of candidate's competitiveness/fit/desire to join the firm. They may axe you quickly during screeners at the slightest incline that you are not committed if you also happen to only marginally meet the other two. May be we will see more firms crawl back later on as people start withdrawing.

[Anonymous User]

Scheduling a second look vs. going silent while you are attending to other callbacks is the way to go. There is a fear of recession looming and where you have some hesitation, there are other candidates more than eager to accept an offer. Firms seem much more focused on the right combination of candidate's competitiveness/fit/desire to join the firm. They may axe you quickly at the slightest incline that you are not committed if you also happen to only marginally meet the other two. May be we will see more firms crawl back later on as people start withdrawing.

Is that in the context of refusal to extend pre-WIP offers? Or are you suggesting that firms will rescind offers before their deadlines?

[Anonymous User]

Any chance with how the market is looking, and how stingy firms are being with callbacks/offers, that firms will renege/rescind outstanding offers? I currently only have 2 offers outstanding and paranoid that I should jump on one now.

Is that crazy? I'm reading horror stories on TLS where people had offers rescinded (though this does not seem common, lest I start a panic here)...

[Anonymous User]

Has anybody else gotten an extremely low number of callbacks, no offers, and are thinking they won't get a job? If we don't get firm jobs this summer, does anybody know how that will affect the job search after graduation?

Talk to Marta now and start mass mailing firms. You have time to get a job, but you need to be proactive.