What are some examples of lifestyle creep? Forum

[nixy]

What others have said: family and kids is the biggest increase in spending.

I am pretty frugal. Lived with roommates as a junior associate, paid off loans quickly, regularly saved 40-50% post tax money.

Now I have a spouse and kids. We moved to the burbs of a VHCOL city for more space, schools, etc. House cost $2M, property taxes are $25k a year.

Being in the burbs meant we did not have reliable public transportation and our lives were no longer walkable. A second car is $50k (mid tier SUV that can fit two kids) plus gas and insurance.

We have an infant. There is a two-year waiting list for day care. It costs $38k per year. So we needed to hire a nanny. In my area, experienced infant nannies ask for $35-40/hr. So for 40 hours of coverage, we are paying ~73k/year. You also need to buy workers comp insurance, payroll company, and pay sick days, vacation, PTO. If nanny is sick, you need to pay nanny and pay a babysitter (or stay home and watch a baby). If you do not have family nearby, the cost of raising kids in the early years is exorbitant.

As for the pre-kid lifestyle creep, not much changed for me. I am not a fancy person and prefer a burger and beer over a five course meal. The major exception is if I buy tickets to a concert or sporting event, I pay to be close to the action. My days in the nosebleed seats are over. But with work and kids, those don’t happen too often anymore.

Why does your wife work?

Maybe she actually, you know, values her career.

[Anonymous User]

What others have said: family and kids is the biggest increase in spending.

I am pretty frugal. Lived with roommates as a junior associate, paid off loans quickly, regularly saved 40-50% post tax money.

Now I have a spouse and kids. We moved to the burbs of a VHCOL city for more space, schools, etc. House cost $2M, property taxes are $25k a year.

Being in the burbs meant we did not have reliable public transportation and our lives were no longer walkable. A second car is $50k (mid tier SUV that can fit two kids) plus gas and insurance.

We have an infant. There is a two-year waiting list for day care. It costs $38k per year. So we needed to hire a nanny. In my area, experienced infant nannies ask for $35-40/hr. So for 40 hours of coverage, we are paying ~73k/year. You also need to buy workers comp insurance, payroll company, and pay sick days, vacation, PTO. If nanny is sick, you need to pay nanny and pay a babysitter (or stay home and watch a baby). If you do not have family nearby, the cost of raising kids in the early years is exorbitant.

As for the pre-kid lifestyle creep, not much changed for me. I am not a fancy person and prefer a burger and beer over a five course meal. The major exception is if I buy tickets to a concert or sporting event, I pay to be close to the action. My days in the nosebleed seats are over. But with work and kids, those don’t happen too often anymore.

Why does your wife work?

Maybe she actually, you know, values her career.

Thank you.

[njdevils2626]

What others have said: family and kids is the biggest increase in spending.

I am pretty frugal. Lived with roommates as a junior associate, paid off loans quickly, regularly saved 40-50% post tax money.

Now I have a spouse and kids. We moved to the burbs of a VHCOL city for more space, schools, etc. House cost $2M, property taxes are $25k a year.

Being in the burbs meant we did not have reliable public transportation and our lives were no longer walkable. A second car is $50k (mid tier SUV that can fit two kids) plus gas and insurance.

We have an infant. There is a two-year waiting list for day care. It costs $38k per year. So we needed to hire a nanny. In my area, experienced infant nannies ask for $35-40/hr. So for 40 hours of coverage, we are paying ~73k/year. You also need to buy workers comp insurance, payroll company, and pay sick days, vacation, PTO. If nanny is sick, you need to pay nanny and pay a babysitter (or stay home and watch a baby). If you do not have family nearby, the cost of raising kids in the early years is exorbitant.

As for the pre-kid lifestyle creep, not much changed for me. I am not a fancy person and prefer a burger and beer over a five course meal. The major exception is if I buy tickets to a concert or sporting event, I pay to be close to the action. My days in the nosebleed seats are over. But with work and kids, those don’t happen too often anymore.

Why does your wife work?

Maybe she actually, you know, values her career.

Seriously, wtf kind of question was that?

[Res Ipsa Loquitter]

Stick to examples of lifestyle creep, folks. If another person here disrespects women in any fashion, I will blow my top off and bans will be issued. Consider yourselves warned.

[Sackboy]

Stick to examples of lifestyle creep, folks. If another person here disrespects women in any fashion, I will blow my top off and bans will be issued. Consider yourselves warned.

Pretty sure you can just close the thread. The list is pretty simple:
- Fancy vacations
- Cars/boats
- Buying more expensive homes/renting more expensive apartments
- Private school
- Luxury items (e.g., watches, purses)
- Subscription services
- Buying higher quality general use items (e.g., better blender, better fridge, etc.)

That's going to be 95% of the lifestyle creep for everyone.

[Anonymous User]

Stick to examples of lifestyle creep, folks. If another person here disrespects women in any fashion, I will blow my top off and bans will be issued. Consider yourselves warned.

Are you a moderator now? I thought only people with green name badges are moderators.

[Anonymous User]

Maintaining an upper-middle class / lower-upper class lifestyle as you move from your 20s into your 30s and 40s (particularly the marriage + kids aspect) is expensive. IME that's where most of the "lifestyle creep" really comes from. You're suddenly paying $12,500 a month in mortgage + property taxes because you wanted to be close to work but have a "nice place" and "what's a few million anyway." Daycare or private school is eating $50,000 per year or more out of your budget. Well, we need two cars now and it's time to upgrade from the Toyotas to BMWs = $25,000 per year in car notes. Everyone needs a vacation to destress from biglaw = $20,000 (you had to fly business, right? Kids in Coach for 6 hours?) for a week getaway where you "only" billed 25 hours. Who even has time to think about how much we're spending eating out we're making a ton of money and don't have the bandwidth to cook = $30,000 per year on dinners. John's watch looked really cool and I haven't upgraded since the Tag I got in law school, I owe myself a gift, right? = $25,000. Etc. It's not hard for this to happen and it happens to many of us; it's frankly insidious and the long hours, stress, and natural process of moving through life and "stuff" happening all contribute to it.

Totally agree with the mortgage/childrearing comments, but in all seriousness, do people here actually spend $25K in differential for luxury car(s) or even a quarter of that on a watch? Maybe someone here and there, but these examples are thrown out so often I'm curious whether it happens more frequently than I thought.

Senior associate and can confirm that multiple midlevels in my group that I'm close with drive brand new BMW, etc. cars to work (probably cost ~$1k/mo and if you're married and your spouse drives the same, that's ~$25k/year). It seems to be more common once people get to like 4th-6th year and beyond where your salary has really started to ramp up.

I also wear a ~$10k watch that I bought with an early bonus in my career because #treatyourself. That said, I occassionally check the resale value of my watch and it's very slowly appreciated over the past ~5 years so that one I don't view as such a splurge if you can afford it and do a little brand research if you're into that sort of thing.

[ughbugchugplug]

I have a firm rule that we invest 10k post tax (ignoring 401k etc) a month and anything else can be spent on whatever. It’s basically worked, though my wife has not always been thrilled. This way, your life creeps a bit but you’re still on track to financial independence. If you’re a single big salary household just pick 5k.

For us, our creep has been going out to eat, nice presents, and throwing money at issues to fix them, mostly with childcare. I have been successful in convincing her to have only one family car (I commute by train) and we’ve kept houses rather than selling them and rent them out. We’ve also opted to live in small houses rather than bigger ones, which means we move out more often but then we have a new cash flowing investment.

I’ve started getting stitch fix which is a bit luxurious, but I dress like a college student otherwise and need to level up a bit. We also have switched to eating berries/fresh fruit/hello fresh/blue apron to be healthier and that costs money.

Our biggest silly expense is every 6 months we stick the kids with my parent and visit a city, stay in the fanciest hotel the city has, and get dinner at the most expensive restaurant we can find. You can easily blow 2-3k doing this. Occasionally it’s great, sometimes we realize we just don’t have that level of sophistication in our pallets to really enjoy it. When the kids are older maybe we’ll start going to Bali or whatever it is rich people do…

[Sad248]

What others have said: family and kids is the biggest increase in spending.

I am pretty frugal. Lived with roommates as a junior associate, paid off loans quickly, regularly saved 40-50% post tax money.

Now I have a spouse and kids. We moved to the burbs of a VHCOL city for more space, schools, etc. House cost $2M, property taxes are $25k a year.

Being in the burbs meant we did not have reliable public transportation and our lives were no longer walkable. A second car is $50k (mid tier SUV that can fit two kids) plus gas and insurance.

We have an infant. There is a two-year waiting list for day care. It costs $38k per year. So we needed to hire a nanny. In my area, experienced infant nannies ask for $35-40/hr. So for 40 hours of coverage, we are paying ~73k/year. You also need to buy workers comp insurance, payroll company, and pay sick days, vacation, PTO. If nanny is sick, you need to pay nanny and pay a babysitter (or stay home and watch a baby). If you do not have family nearby, the cost of raising kids in the early years is exorbitant.

As for the pre-kid lifestyle creep, not much changed for me. I am not a fancy person and prefer a burger and beer over a five course meal. The major exception is if I buy tickets to a concert or sporting event, I pay to be close to the action. My days in the nosebleed seats are over. But with work and kids, those don’t happen too often anymore.

Why does your wife work?

Maybe she actually, you know, values her career.

Thank you.

Kids are literally the only thing I worry about in the future. Currently my partner and I live together. They do not work a 9-5, but instead are trying to set up a business, so I am the sole earner currently. Every month I keep about half my paycheck. We rarely eat out, don't make many big expenditures, like going on vacation, but always rent the cheapest car, one of the cheaper hotels, and get the cheapest plane tickets.

But I think it is not doable to have kids in the US. The costs from day care all the way to a good high school are insane. And then you probably get the same value as from your average western European school. I am pretty set on packing up shop and moving abroad at some point in the future. Seeing stuff like spending 75k a year even before a kid has even set foot in a school is just too much.

[ughbugchugplug]

What others have said: family and kids is the biggest increase in spending.

I am pretty frugal. Lived with roommates as a junior associate, paid off loans quickly, regularly saved 40-50% post tax money.

Now I have a spouse and kids. We moved to the burbs of a VHCOL city for more space, schools, etc. House cost $2M, property taxes are $25k a year.

Being in the burbs meant we did not have reliable public transportation and our lives were no longer walkable. A second car is $50k (mid tier SUV that can fit two kids) plus gas and insurance.

We have an infant. There is a two-year waiting list for day care. It costs $38k per year. So we needed to hire a nanny. In my area, experienced infant nannies ask for $35-40/hr. So for 40 hours of coverage, we are paying ~73k/year. You also need to buy workers comp insurance, payroll company, and pay sick days, vacation, PTO. If nanny is sick, you need to pay nanny and pay a babysitter (or stay home and watch a baby). If you do not have family nearby, the cost of raising kids in the early years is exorbitant.

As for the pre-kid lifestyle creep, not much changed for me. I am not a fancy person and prefer a burger and beer over a five course meal. The major exception is if I buy tickets to a concert or sporting event, I pay to be close to the action. My days in the nosebleed seats are over. But with work and kids, those don’t happen too often anymore.

Why does your wife work?

Maybe she actually, you know, values her career.

Thank you.

Kids are literally the only thing I worry about in the future. Currently my partner and I live together. They do not work a 9-5, but instead are trying to set up a business, so I am the sole earner currently. Every month I keep about half my paycheck. We rarely eat out, don't make many big expenditures, like going on vacation, but always rent the cheapest car, one of the cheaper hotels, and get the cheapest plane tickets.

But I think it is not doable to have kids in the US. The costs from day care all the way to a good high school are insane. And then you probably get the same value as from your average western European school. I am pretty set on packing up shop and moving abroad at some point in the future. Seeing stuff like spending 75k a year even before a kid has even set foot in a school is just too much.

Not to discount the many ways the US has bad childcare, but I live within commuting distance of NYC and have two kids in daycare at about 30k a year all in. Just don’t go to the fancy places. But if you live in the city or want Montessori or whatever, that’s a different story.

[Anonymous User]

Going back to the car point because people seem to keep bringing up BMWs, Mercedes, etc., I think the luxury cars also become a time savings which becomes important in biglaw, as discussed.

We have had luxury cars and for a short period of time decided to get a Jeep because we felt like the luxury car I drove was an unnecessary expenditure. What we didn't appreciate about the luxury car was that we always got a free loaner car when the car was in for service - I could drop off my car at 7:30am and then take the loaner to the office and go pickup my car on the way home. When the Jeep required service, I either have to have my wife follow me to the dealership to drive me back home after and drop me off again when it's ready for pickup or pay for ubers to/from, which is just less convenient than having a free loaner car, especially if it's a day I needed to go into the office or run a bunch of errands because we live in the suburbs so uber costs add up.

So, I now drive a luxury car again.

[Sackboy]

Going back to the car point because people seem to keep bringing up BMWs, Mercedes, etc., I think the luxury cars also become a time savings which becomes important in biglaw, as discussed.

We have had luxury cars and for a short period of time decided to get a Jeep because we felt like the luxury car I drove was an unnecessary expenditure. What we didn't appreciate about the luxury car was that we always got a free loaner car when the car was in for service - I could drop off my car at 7:30am and then take the loaner to the office and go pickup my car on the way home. When the Jeep required service, I either have to have my wife follow me to the dealership to drive me back home after and drop me off again when it's ready for pickup or pay for ubers to/from, which is just less convenient than having a free loaner car, especially if it's a day I needed to go into the office or run a bunch of errands because we live in the suburbs so uber costs add up.

So, I now drive a luxury car again.

This is an incredible take.

Better pay a $30,000 premium on my car to save myself $100 of Uber charges a year.

[nixy]

Going back to the car point because people seem to keep bringing up BMWs, Mercedes, etc., I think the luxury cars also become a time savings which becomes important in biglaw, as discussed.

We have had luxury cars and for a short period of time decided to get a Jeep because we felt like the luxury car I drove was an unnecessary expenditure. What we didn't appreciate about the luxury car was that we always got a free loaner car when the car was in for service - I could drop off my car at 7:30am and then take the loaner to the office and go pickup my car on the way home. When the Jeep required service, I either have to have my wife follow me to the dealership to drive me back home after and drop me off again when it's ready for pickup or pay for ubers to/from, which is just less convenient than having a free loaner car, especially if it's a day I needed to go into the office or run a bunch of errands because we live in the suburbs so uber costs add up.

So, I now drive a luxury car again.

This is an incredible take.

Better pay a $30,000 premium on my car to save myself $100 of Uber charges a year.

Yeah, and I drive a base model Subaru Impreza and my dealer offers loaners on services, so this is a very weird take.

(FWIW, I’m fine with people buying luxury cars if they want them, but they don’t save any time that way - just admit you like a nice car.)

[nealric]

Going back to the car point because people seem to keep bringing up BMWs, Mercedes, etc., I think the luxury cars also become a time savings which becomes important in biglaw, as discussed.

We have had luxury cars and for a short period of time decided to get a Jeep because we felt like the luxury car I drove was an unnecessary expenditure. What we didn't appreciate about the luxury car was that we always got a free loaner car when the car was in for service - I could drop off my car at 7:30am and then take the loaner to the office and go pickup my car on the way home. When the Jeep required service, I either have to have my wife follow me to the dealership to drive me back home after and drop me off again when it's ready for pickup or pay for ubers to/from, which is just less convenient than having a free loaner car, especially if it's a day I needed to go into the office or run a bunch of errands because we live in the suburbs so uber costs add up.

So, I now drive a luxury car again.

This is an incredible take.

Better pay a $30,000 premium on my car to save myself $100 of Uber charges a year.

Not to mention you are paying for that car one way or another. Your Honda/Toyota/Chevy will probably have oil changes in the $50-$75 range. Many luxury car dealerships have no problem charging $200+ for an oil change. Those "free" service loaners aren't actually free.

[Anonymous User]

Going back to the car point because people seem to keep bringing up BMWs, Mercedes, etc., I think the luxury cars also become a time savings which becomes important in biglaw, as discussed.

We have had luxury cars and for a short period of time decided to get a Jeep because we felt like the luxury car I drove was an unnecessary expenditure. What we didn't appreciate about the luxury car was that we always got a free loaner car when the car was in for service - I could drop off my car at 7:30am and then take the loaner to the office and go pickup my car on the way home. When the Jeep required service, I either have to have my wife follow me to the dealership to drive me back home after and drop me off again when it's ready for pickup or pay for ubers to/from, which is just less convenient than having a free loaner car, especially if it's a day I needed to go into the office or run a bunch of errands because we live in the suburbs so uber costs add up.

So, I now drive a luxury car again.

This is an incredible take.

Better pay a $30,000 premium on my car to save myself $100 of Uber charges a year.

I mean I guess you can think whatever. This is a thread of lifestyle creep and I offered an example of how it happens, and at no point did I suggest it was the "right" or "smart" financial decision, just that it's how lifestyle creep happens. I think the Jeep was a fairly nice grand cherokee around $50k if I recall correctly and fortunately during the pandemic used car prices were sky high so it was fairly easy to sell it after a couple years for some decent $$ and buy a luxury car closer to like $60k (and with interest rates at all time lows).

Again, these are just justifications of spending more on a luxury car because certainly I wasn't spending $10k on ubers in the years of having the Jeep, and I did not NEED the luxury car by any means, and even by Biglaw standard my time saved with a loaner car probably wasn't even a total of $10k worth of billables, but having a loaner car is more convenient than taking ubers around town, just like it's not that difficult to clean your house, but it saves some time to hire someone else to do it. Not sure why everyone weirdly piled on to my example.

[nixy]

Going back to the car point because people seem to keep bringing up BMWs, Mercedes, etc., I think the luxury cars also become a time savings which becomes important in biglaw, as discussed.

We have had luxury cars and for a short period of time decided to get a Jeep because we felt like the luxury car I drove was an unnecessary expenditure. What we didn't appreciate about the luxury car was that we always got a free loaner car when the car was in for service - I could drop off my car at 7:30am and then take the loaner to the office and go pickup my car on the way home. When the Jeep required service, I either have to have my wife follow me to the dealership to drive me back home after and drop me off again when it's ready for pickup or pay for ubers to/from, which is just less convenient than having a free loaner car, especially if it's a day I needed to go into the office or run a bunch of errands because we live in the suburbs so uber costs add up.

So, I now drive a luxury car again.

This is an incredible take.

Better pay a $30,000 premium on my car to save myself $100 of Uber charges a year.

I mean I guess you can think whatever. This is a thread of lifestyle creep and I offered an example of how it happens, and at no point did I suggest it was the "right" or "smart" financial decision, just that it's how lifestyle creep happens. I think the Jeep was a fairly nice grand cherokee around $50k if I recall correctly and fortunately during the pandemic used car prices were sky high so it was fairly easy to sell it after a couple years for some decent $$ and buy a luxury car closer to like $60k (and with interest rates at all time lows).

Again, these are just justifications of spending more on a luxury car because certainly I wasn't spending $10k on ubers in the years of having the Jeep, and I did not NEED the luxury car by any means, and even by Biglaw standard my time saved with a loaner car probably wasn't even a total of $10k worth of billables, but having a loaner car is more convenient than taking ubers around town, just like it's not that difficult to clean your house, but it saves some time to hire someone else to do it. Not sure why everyone weirdly piled on to my example.

Because you don't need a luxury car to get loaners.

Though I do get the general idea that one reason for lifestyle creep is the willingness to pay more to save time/effort, and honestly, I'm all about that. If someone can afford the things that make life more convenient/pleasurable, go for it; there's no moral imperative to save as much as humanly possible.

[Anonymous User]

I don't think this was discussed much here, but anyone use prepared meal delivery services? How's the quality and taste? Groceries and cooking are both huge time sucks. I've been relying heavily on takeout and my body would appreciate a healthier diet.

[Monochromatic Oeuvre]

I mean I guess you can think whatever. This is a thread of lifestyle creep and I offered an example of how it happens, and at no point did I suggest it was the "right" or "smart" financial decision, just that it's how lifestyle creep happens. I think the Jeep was a fairly nice grand cherokee around $50k if I recall correctly and fortunately during the pandemic used car prices were sky high so it was fairly easy to sell it after a couple years for some decent $$ and buy a luxury car closer to like $60k (and with interest rates at all time lows).

Again, these are just justifications of spending more on a luxury car because certainly I wasn't spending $10k on ubers in the years of having the Jeep, and I did not NEED the luxury car by any means, and even by Biglaw standard my time saved with a loaner car probably wasn't even a total of $10k worth of billables, but having a loaner car is more convenient than taking ubers around town, just like it's not that difficult to clean your house, but it saves some time to hire someone else to do it. Not sure why everyone weirdly piled on to my example.

Lol, this is decidedly NOT the “shrewd financial moves I make” thread but everyone sure enjoyed shitting on your car even though they didn’t bother to do that with the Westchester McMansions and toddlers decked out in J. Crew.

[Anonymous User]

Going back to the car point because people seem to keep bringing up BMWs, Mercedes, etc., I think the luxury cars also become a time savings which becomes important in biglaw, as discussed.

We have had luxury cars and for a short period of time decided to get a Jeep because we felt like the luxury car I drove was an unnecessary expenditure. What we didn't appreciate about the luxury car was that we always got a free loaner car when the car was in for service - I could drop off my car at 7:30am and then take the loaner to the office and go pickup my car on the way home. When the Jeep required service, I either have to have my wife follow me to the dealership to drive me back home after and drop me off again when it's ready for pickup or pay for ubers to/from, which is just less convenient than having a free loaner car, especially if it's a day I needed to go into the office or run a bunch of errands because we live in the suburbs so uber costs add up.

So, I now drive a luxury car again.

This is an incredible take.

Better pay a $30,000 premium on my car to save myself $100 of Uber charges a year.

I mean I guess you can think whatever. This is a thread of lifestyle creep and I offered an example of how it happens, and at no point did I suggest it was the "right" or "smart" financial decision, just that it's how lifestyle creep happens. I think the Jeep was a fairly nice grand cherokee around $50k if I recall correctly and fortunately during the pandemic used car prices were sky high so it was fairly easy to sell it after a couple years for some decent $$ and buy a luxury car closer to like $60k (and with interest rates at all time lows).

Again, these are just justifications of spending more on a luxury car because certainly I wasn't spending $10k on ubers in the years of having the Jeep, and I did not NEED the luxury car by any means, and even by Biglaw standard my time saved with a loaner car probably wasn't even a total of $10k worth of billables, but having a loaner car is more convenient than taking ubers around town, just like it's not that difficult to clean your house, but it saves some time to hire someone else to do it. Not sure why everyone weirdly piled on to my example.

Because you don't need a luxury car to get loaners.

Though I do get the general idea that one reason for lifestyle creep is the willingness to pay more to save time/effort, and honestly, I'm all about that. If someone can afford the things that make life more convenient/pleasurable, go for it; there's no moral imperative to save as much as humanly possible.

Fine, my argument was flawed, but like, not everyone wants a Subaru, and not all non-luxury manufacturers have free loaners, whereas basically all luxury mfr's do.

[Anonymous User]

I mean I guess you can think whatever. This is a thread of lifestyle creep and I offered an example of how it happens, and at no point did I suggest it was the "right" or "smart" financial decision, just that it's how lifestyle creep happens. I think the Jeep was a fairly nice grand cherokee around $50k if I recall correctly and fortunately during the pandemic used car prices were sky high so it was fairly easy to sell it after a couple years for some decent $$ and buy a luxury car closer to like $60k (and with interest rates at all time lows).

Again, these are just justifications of spending more on a luxury car because certainly I wasn't spending $10k on ubers in the years of having the Jeep, and I did not NEED the luxury car by any means, and even by Biglaw standard my time saved with a loaner car probably wasn't even a total of $10k worth of billables, but having a loaner car is more convenient than taking ubers around town, just like it's not that difficult to clean your house, but it saves some time to hire someone else to do it. Not sure why everyone weirdly piled on to my example.

Lol, this is decidedly NOT the “shrewd financial moves I make” thread but everyone sure enjoyed shitting on your car even though they didn’t bother to do that with the Westchester McMansions and toddlers decked out in J. Crew.

Yeah, that was my point, which like is fine I guess, people can think what they want, just seemed like a weird place to make their stand.

[ughbugchugplug]

I don't think this was discussed much here, but anyone use prepared meal delivery services? How's the quality and taste? Groceries and cooking are both huge time sucks. I've been relying heavily on takeout and my body would appreciate a healthier diet.

I like blue apron/hello fresh but that involves cooking so might not work for you. They are quick meals and you get all the ingredients.

[Anonymous User]

Came across the following link on Twitter and thought it was an interesting read, at least some of it was insightful (had a laugh about upper middle class prestige): https://bowtiedbull.substack.com/p/goin ... -of-wealth

Wonder how many of us enter “No Man’s Land” and give up or go into cruise control…either by finding ourselves a cushy in-house position, or pushing hard for a NEP (or token equity) role that will realistically lead to total comp within the $500-700k range. I’ve taken the latter road if I’m lucky, leaving my sweaty V10 role for a more lifestyle friendly V50 with market pay, but none of the eye watering PEP numbers (as a side note, partner pay is generally shrouded in misconceptions except for the true rainmakers).

I’ve accepted the long odds of me running a successful startup on the side, but even as an 8th year attorney I try to keep my spending down and invest the difference. We’re spending approximately $100k a year as a household. I’m a first generation American and my mindset is I’m happy if my child is able to reap all the rewards of my efforts, which is possible with continued diligence and the wonders of compound interest (I know that parenting approach has its own hazards, but that’s another topic altogether.)

[thisismytlsuername]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pQTgLXl1qXI

[ughbugchugplug]

Came across the following link on Twitter and thought it was an interesting read, at least some of it was insightful (had a laugh about upper middle class prestige): https://bowtiedbull.substack.com/p/goin ... -of-wealth

Wonder how many of us enter “No Man’s Land” and give up or go into cruise control…either by finding ourselves a cushy in-house position, or pushing hard for a NEP (or token equity) role that will realistically lead to total comp within the $500-700k range. I’ve taken the latter road if I’m lucky, leaving my sweaty V10 role for a more lifestyle friendly V50 with market pay, but none of the eye watering PEP numbers (as a side note, partner pay is generally shrouded in misconceptions except for the true rainmakers).

I’ve accepted the long odds of me running a successful startup on the side, but even as an 8th year attorney I try to keep my spending down and invest the difference. We’re spending approximately $100k a year as a household. I’m a first generation American and my mindset is I’m happy if my child is able to reap all the rewards of my efforts, which is possible with continued diligence and the wonders of compound interest (I know that parenting approach has its own hazards, but that’s another topic altogether.)

That blog is hilarious, but it does accurately describe some pathologies among middle class and upper middle class people (just look at these forums)

[nealric]

Came across the following link on Twitter and thought it was an interesting read, at least some of it was insightful (had a laugh about upper middle class prestige): https://bowtiedbull.substack.com/p/goin ... -of-wealth

Wonder how many of us enter “No Man’s Land” and give up or go into cruise control…either by finding ourselves a cushy in-house position, or pushing hard for a NEP (or token equity) role that will realistically lead to total comp within the $500-700k range. I’ve taken the latter road if I’m lucky, leaving my sweaty V10 role for a more lifestyle friendly V50 with market pay, but none of the eye watering PEP numbers (as a side note, partner pay is generally shrouded in misconceptions except for the true rainmakers).

I’ve accepted the long odds of me running a successful startup on the side, but even as an 8th year attorney I try to keep my spending down and invest the difference. We’re spending approximately $100k a year as a household. I’m a first generation American and my mindset is I’m happy if my child is able to reap all the rewards of my efforts, which is possible with continued diligence and the wonders of compound interest (I know that parenting approach has its own hazards, but that’s another topic altogether.)

It may sound tautological, but only .1% of people are going to make it into the .1%. "No Man's land" is kind of a funny way of describing what most folks would still call rich (~$500k income and $2-5 million net worth in your 30s). It's not yacht in Monaco rich, but you've broken out of the paycheck to paycheck middle class grind and could bug out and go live simply but comfortably in a low cost of living area if you really wanted out of your professional life. If that's not enough wealth/status for you, I'm not sure any amount is going to be enough.

That blogger could hit $20MM net worth, and still be talking about being caught in the "mass affluent no-man's land" because he can't afford the UES townhouse he wants, then the "merely rich trap" at $100MM because he's priced out of the G650 and exclusive penthouses, then the "single digit billionaire grind" because he can't buy household name companies on a whim like Elon Musk, then finally complain about how insecure that status of being the richest man in the world is.