How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month? Forum

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by Anonymous User » Wed May 27, 2020 11:01 pm

Sackboy wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 10:27 pm
lawlo wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 9:18 pm


Further, why do you all do BK? Was it just that it was the job available? Seems unlikely considering those at top shops likely had other options at some point, or atleast the chance to transfer practice areas.

This is the question I always wanted to know the answer to. I work in a practice that is notorious for having bad hours compared to almost every other practice area, but they pale in comparison to what the folks on our BK team do. BK always intrigued me, but I just can't imagine that many hours. Are you all just S tier masochists?
Non-OP, anon bk associate.

Hours are always "bad", but a lot of this is just crisis related. Pre-COVID, I had a few months north of 300, but most busy months were more 200-250. And plenty of months, if not most, well below that. Overall, hours probably are generally in the upper end of bad, but not really that different than M&A. I put up with those hours because I like the practice, honestly don't think I'd be interested in doing anything else.

We are just in a situation where several sectors of the economy completely crashed with little notice. Bankruptcy associates don't just spring out of the air. So it makes sense many of them are completely crushed right now.

s1m4

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by s1m4 » Thu May 28, 2020 12:31 am

Logistically, what do you guys do about food/meals? Is it primarily ordering out, or do you have time to cook also?

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by Anonymous User » Thu May 28, 2020 4:24 am

OP here - finally managed to catch up on entering my time at 4 am. Currently sitting at 409 billables for the month with 4 days to go. Damn I feel like death.

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by Anonymous User » Thu May 28, 2020 7:36 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 11:01 pm
Sackboy wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 10:27 pm
lawlo wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 9:18 pm


Further, why do you all do BK? Was it just that it was the job available? Seems unlikely considering those at top shops likely had other options at some point, or atleast the chance to transfer practice areas.

This is the question I always wanted to know the answer to. I work in a practice that is notorious for having bad hours compared to almost every other practice area, but they pale in comparison to what the folks on our BK team do. BK always intrigued me, but I just can't imagine that many hours. Are you all just S tier masochists?
Non-OP, anon bk associate.

Hours are always "bad", but a lot of this is just crisis related. Pre-COVID, I had a few months north of 300, but most busy months were more 200-250. And plenty of months, if not most, well below that. Overall, hours probably are generally in the upper end of bad, but not really that different than M&A. I put up with those hours because I like the practice, honestly don't think I'd be interested in doing anything else.

We are just in a situation where several sectors of the economy completely crashed with little notice. Bankruptcy associates don't just spring out of the air. So it makes sense many of them are completely crushed right now.
I’m the anon BK mid level. It’s not always like this. I’m generally over 200 hours each month, but pre-COVID, there was a fair amount of travel involved, and we technically bill all travel time (half when it goes to client). I didn’t mind it, and it was a nice way to catch up on Netflix or just read/sleep. Occasionally I’d have to work on the plane.

Most days pre-COVID, I’m done by 530-6 and wouldn’t have to work at home, mostly because I wasn’t on four debtor matters and two creditor matters. Like someone earlier said, the whole economy tanked at once, at a time when retail and oil & gas were already going down.

As for why I do this, I enjoy the variety. I do a ton of deal making, I’ve appeared in court, I’ve worked on several sale transactions, two spin offs, been involved in a few real trials (tho lead by real litigators), read a ton of debt docs, deal with tax, employment, and IP issues, and get a ton of client contact. You can really spin that experience into an in-house role—I’ve had a few interviews and had one offer (was too much of a financial hit).

Not sure how much longer I’ll do this. I’ve been told I’m on the “right path,” for whatever that’s worth.

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by Anonymous User » Thu May 28, 2020 8:13 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 7:36 am
Anonymous User wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 11:01 pm
Sackboy wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 10:27 pm
lawlo wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 9:18 pm


Further, why do you all do BK? Was it just that it was the job available? Seems unlikely considering those at top shops likely had other options at some point, or atleast the chance to transfer practice areas.

This is the question I always wanted to know the answer to. I work in a practice that is notorious for having bad hours compared to almost every other practice area, but they pale in comparison to what the folks on our BK team do. BK always intrigued me, but I just can't imagine that many hours. Are you all just S tier masochists?
Non-OP, anon bk associate.

Hours are always "bad", but a lot of this is just crisis related. Pre-COVID, I had a few months north of 300, but most busy months were more 200-250. And plenty of months, if not most, well below that. Overall, hours probably are generally in the upper end of bad, but not really that different than M&A. I put up with those hours because I like the practice, honestly don't think I'd be interested in doing anything else.

We are just in a situation where several sectors of the economy completely crashed with little notice. Bankruptcy associates don't just spring out of the air. So it makes sense many of them are completely crushed right now.
I’m the anon BK mid level. It’s not always like this. I’m generally over 200 hours each month, but pre-COVID, there was a fair amount of travel involved, and we technically bill all travel time (half when it goes to client). I didn’t mind it, and it was a nice way to catch up on Netflix or just read/sleep. Occasionally I’d have to work on the plane.

Most days pre-COVID, I’m done by 530-6 and wouldn’t have to work at home, mostly because I wasn’t on four debtor matters and two creditor matters. Like someone earlier said, the whole economy tanked at once, at a time when retail and oil & gas were already going down.

As for why I do this, I enjoy the variety. I do a ton of deal making, I’ve appeared in court, I’ve worked on several sale transactions, two spin offs, been involved in a few real trials (tho lead by real litigators), read a ton of debt docs, deal with tax, employment, and IP issues, and get a ton of client contact. You can really spin that experience into an in-house role—I’ve had a few interviews and had one offer (was too much of a financial hit).

Not sure how much longer I’ll do this. I’ve been told I’m on the “right path,” for whatever that’s worth.
This is why I do it also. I do interesting stuff and I enjoy a lot of the work I do.

Unfortunately the hours now are becoming nearly unbearable. Gonna hit 675 for combined April May with no signs of letting up.

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sms18

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by sms18 » Thu May 28, 2020 1:01 pm

s1m4 wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 12:31 am
Logistically, what do you guys do about food/meals? Is it primarily ordering out, or do you have time to cook also?
also, are BK attorneys allowed to bill meals to a debtor client generally? is this something that needs to be eventually approved by a BK court judge, along with other billing entries?

Anonymous User
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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by Anonymous User » Thu May 28, 2020 1:39 pm

Anon because I dont want to out myself as a bk associate.

Everything is billed the same way (except in .1 increments, and no block billing), but yes, everything has to ultimately be approved by the court.

Downside of WFH is working these hours, and not being able to bill any food (pretty sure every firm requires you to be in the office past a certain time to qualify). Would be a drop in the bucket for clients, but a huge benefit to associates to alter that to just like a total hours worked in a day construct during this time.

Excellent117

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by Excellent117 » Thu May 28, 2020 1:43 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 4:24 am
OP here - finally managed to catch up on entering my time at 4 am. Currently sitting at 409 billables for the month with 4 days to go. Damn I feel like death.
To be frank, this is simply unacceptable.

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by Anonymous User » Thu May 28, 2020 8:21 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 4:24 am
OP here - finally managed to catch up on entering my time at 4 am. Currently sitting at 409 billables for the month with 4 days to go. Damn I feel like death.
Don't have any advice, but I'm sorry. That is really tough. I hope you are able to slow down and take some time for mental and physical health soon.

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JusticeSquee

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by JusticeSquee » Thu May 28, 2020 9:52 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 8:21 pm
Anonymous User wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 4:24 am
OP here - finally managed to catch up on entering my time at 4 am. Currently sitting at 409 billables for the month with 4 days to go. Damn I feel like death.
Don't have any advice, but I'm sorry. That is really tough. I hope you are able to slow down and take some time for mental and physical health soon.
Yeah dude this is fucked. If you have a mentor or something I would reach out. Take a long vacation once this is over. Everything we do in practice (in biglaw) is ultimately meaningless and not ever worth billing 400 hours a month over.

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by Sackboy » Thu May 28, 2020 10:52 pm

JusticeSquee wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 9:52 pm

Yeah dude this is fucked. If you have a mentor or something I would reach out. Take a long vacation once this is over. Everything we do in practice (in biglaw) is ultimately meaningless and not ever worth billing 400 hours a month over.
While this is super fucked up, I don't think this is good rhetoric to spread online. Thinking of your job as meaningless is a great way to slide into depression. A lot of people, me included, find meaning in biglaw, despite its hardships.

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by umichman » Thu May 28, 2020 11:28 pm

Sackboy wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 10:52 pm
JusticeSquee wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 9:52 pm

Yeah dude this is fucked. If you have a mentor or something I would reach out. Take a long vacation once this is over. Everything we do in practice (in biglaw) is ultimately meaningless and not ever worth billing 400 hours a month over.
While this is super fucked up, I don't think this is good rhetoric to spread online. Thinking of your job as meaningless is a great way to slide into depression. A lot of people, me included, find meaning in biglaw, despite its hardships.
I also believe that if this person didn't find at least some meaning in it, he wouldn't be at 400. Billing 400 requires at least some modicum of desire to continue and do the work itself, you can always always always leave. So if you are staying at 400, it is a choice.

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by Anonymous User » Fri May 29, 2020 12:55 am

umichman wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 11:28 pm
Sackboy wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 10:52 pm
JusticeSquee wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 9:52 pm

Yeah dude this is fucked. If you have a mentor or something I would reach out. Take a long vacation once this is over. Everything we do in practice (in biglaw) is ultimately meaningless and not ever worth billing 400 hours a month over.
While this is super fucked up, I don't think this is good rhetoric to spread online. Thinking of your job as meaningless is a great way to slide into depression. A lot of people, me included, find meaning in biglaw, despite its hardships.
I also believe that if this person didn't find at least some meaning in it, he wouldn't be at 400. Billing 400 requires at least some modicum of desire to continue and do the work itself, you can always always always leave. So if you are staying at 400, it is a choice.
OP here - this is semi fair. Today was another brutal 21 billable hour day, and I can barely walk, but we had a very positive outcome in one of the big names in distress right now, and I played a pivotal role in that success, so that’s really cool. Ok going to go pass out because I pulled an all nighter yesterday, sigh

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by LBJ's Hair » Fri May 29, 2020 2:11 am

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri May 29, 2020 12:55 am

OP here - this is semi fair. Today was another brutal 21 billable hour day, and I can barely walk, but we had a very positive outcome in one of the big names in distress right now, and I played a pivotal role in that success, so that’s really cool. Ok going to go pass out because I pulled an all nighter yesterday, sigh
Wooooof. Been there, always a blur. Feel for you, guy/gal. And take care of yourself -- if you need take a nap, tell 'em. Better for you to take two hours than snap, or pass out at your desk... I've done both

Anonymous User
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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by Anonymous User » Fri May 29, 2020 4:53 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Fri May 29, 2020 12:55 am
umichman wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 11:28 pm
Sackboy wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 10:52 pm
JusticeSquee wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 9:52 pm

Yeah dude this is fucked. If you have a mentor or something I would reach out. Take a long vacation once this is over. Everything we do in practice (in biglaw) is ultimately meaningless and not ever worth billing 400 hours a month over.
While this is super fucked up, I don't think this is good rhetoric to spread online. Thinking of your job as meaningless is a great way to slide into depression. A lot of people, me included, find meaning in biglaw, despite its hardships.
I also believe that if this person didn't find at least some meaning in it, he wouldn't be at 400. Billing 400 requires at least some modicum of desire to continue and do the work itself, you can always always always leave. So if you are staying at 400, it is a choice.
OP here - this is semi fair. Today was another brutal 21 billable hour day, and I can barely walk, but we had a very positive outcome in one of the big names in distress right now, and I played a pivotal role in that success, so that’s really cool. Ok going to go pass out because I pulled an all nighter yesterday, sigh
So, I've been at Weil BFR for a while (no pun intended). Hours can be rough. I know several of the most respected associates in BFR who've been there for a good number of years. None of them EVER billed 400+ in a month (granted this wasn't during 2008-10). Op, if you're being serious, then you're being screwed big time. Weil is known to have long hours, but not 400+. If you bill that or anywhere near that consistently you are really underpaid. Like one of the most underpaid associates in biglaw.

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by Tbell247 » Fri May 29, 2020 6:00 pm

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karoshi

Please take a month off at some point.

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by jigiwo1898jupiter » Fri May 29, 2020 8:03 pm

I am at least a bit skeptical that after a 400+ hour month OP is still posting on TLS...

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Joachim2017

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by Joachim2017 » Fri May 29, 2020 9:09 pm

jigiwo1898jupiter wrote:
Fri May 29, 2020 8:03 pm
I am at least a bit skeptical that after a 400+ hour month OP is still posting on TLS...
Same. And to the extent the OP really is billing at 400+, these posts on TLS are a plea for companionship/need to share, or a humblebrag (however little sense that actually makes).

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by Anonymous User » Sat May 30, 2020 4:11 pm

Joachim2017 wrote:
Fri May 29, 2020 9:09 pm
jigiwo1898jupiter wrote:
Fri May 29, 2020 8:03 pm
I am at least a bit skeptical that after a 400+ hour month OP is still posting on TLS...
Same. And to the extent the OP really is billing at 400+, these posts on TLS are a plea for companionship/need to share, or a humblebrag (however little sense that actually makes).

OP here - you and the guy you replied to are real clowns. There are 168 hours in a week - you’re saying that because I’ve made roughly 8 posts in this thread, each taking roughly 45 seconds to write, that that is proof I’m lying? Makes no sense. And bragging about what? There’s nothing to brag about, clown.

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by cheaptilts » Sat May 30, 2020 4:33 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Sat May 30, 2020 4:11 pm
Joachim2017 wrote:
Fri May 29, 2020 9:09 pm
jigiwo1898jupiter wrote:
Fri May 29, 2020 8:03 pm
I am at least a bit skeptical that after a 400+ hour month OP is still posting on TLS...
Same. And to the extent the OP really is billing at 400+, these posts on TLS are a plea for companionship/need to share, or a humblebrag (however little sense that actually makes).

OP here - you and the guy you replied to are real clowns. There are 168 hours in a week - you’re saying that because I’ve made roughly 8 posts in this thread, each taking roughly 45 seconds to write, that that is proof I’m lying? Makes no sense. And bragging about what? There’s nothing to brag about, clown.
My suggestion: Get some sleep and take a break from everything law related. Get outside. Ride a bike. You’ll feel better once you do.

jigiwo1898jupiter

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Re: How many other restructuring associates hitting 400 this month?

Post by jigiwo1898jupiter » Sat May 30, 2020 5:13 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Sat May 30, 2020 4:11 pm
Joachim2017 wrote:
Fri May 29, 2020 9:09 pm
jigiwo1898jupiter wrote:
Fri May 29, 2020 8:03 pm
I am at least a bit skeptical that after a 400+ hour month OP is still posting on TLS...
Same. And to the extent the OP really is billing at 400+, these posts on TLS are a plea for companionship/need to share, or a humblebrag (however little sense that actually makes).

OP here - you and the guy you replied to are real clowns. There are 168 hours in a week - you’re saying that because I’ve made roughly 8 posts in this thread, each taking roughly 45 seconds to write, that that is proof I’m lying? Makes no sense. And bragging about what? There’s nothing to brag about, clown.
Skepticism intensifies

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