UChicago OCI 2014 Forum

[Anonymous User]

Here's my preliminary one, go easy on me, no idea what I'm doing

Grades: 179.5-179.7
URM/Female: URM
Work Exp: 2 yrs average work exp
Preferred Market: LA/OC, but willing to go to NY. Also wondering if I'm competitive for any DC firms.
Practice Area: Litigation, but open to corporate
Misc: Below median interviewer
Bid list:

Why do your top 10 firms all have more interview slots than the next ten? You need to reorganize here. NYC offices with 40-60 slots do not need to be top 5 bids.

[2014]

Yeah you need to get 21 slot firms higher and save the 42+ slot ones for the early teens. S&C and Cravath can go down to 20 easily. With your GPA + URM you can and should bid aggressively, I think all firms are in play. Bid wachtell at the very end it's worth an interview for you.

[Anonymous User]

poof

[gchatbrah]

Your guys' info sheet that just went out is waaayyyy more helpful than last years.

e- makes NY seem more brutal than it was last year but data is data.

e2 - CB percentages explains part of it. NY just gives a lot more CBs so there are a lot of median people in the 0-25% range.

It also reflects students with high grades interviewing in NY "just in case." I wouldn't put a ton of stock in the NY numbers -- [at risk of a humble-brag] I received 10+ offers in NY and was below that 25th percentile number at almost of these with a mid 177. So grades clearly can't be everything if it happened that often.

[Anonymous User]

Well now I'm a lot more worried.

PSA regarding the Callback Report from someone below their current SA firm's 25th percentile:

The report gives you numbers for who the firm gives CB offers to. Not who accepted SA offers or even accept the CB. This means it well inherently skew high, as firms give the majority of those 180+ a CB just because. Lesser firms could make their 25th 180 if they wanted to, but it would say little about the people they actually hire. This is a good guideline (much better than ours last year), but just understand that the 25th is probably closer to the average of those working there.

[Anonymous User]

Rising 2Ls: Please take those numbers in stride. Both my big sib and s/o (well, more like fuck buddy) are well below the 25th percentiles for their firms as well. These numbers are helpful but systematically skewed upward. That's because people with 180 181 have dozens of firms to bid for, and so are going to bid for a lot of firms that they don't go to, which will automatically accept them. If you have 50% of a firm's bids in the 179-180 range, and 85% are accepted, and 50% around 178, with 33% accepted, the median and 25th percentiles will make it look anyone below 179 has no chance. Instead, they have a very viable chance. (And if they bid for a bunch of similar firms, they'll be almost certain to score a few)

tldr version= If you're around the 25th percentile, it doesn't mean your chances of getting the firm are 25%. And if you're below the 25th percentile, you still may have a viable (probably not great, but reasonable) chance. And remember: We have lots of bids. So a bunch of 15 to 20% chances will add up!

[Anonymous User]

Also below cb % at 75 percent of callbacks (bid mostly v15 NY), 12 CBs.

I'd say if you have above average interviewing, stick to the notion that above median means competitive for all v15 NY (cutoffs are lower than the 25%). If average or below average, might make sense to be between the 25 and 75.

[2014]

Both my big sib and s/o (well, more like fuck buddy)

Lol'd

[gchatbrah]

Also below cb % at 75 percent of callbacks (bid mostly v15 NY), 12 CBs.

I'd say if you have above average interviewing, stick to the notion that above median means competitive for all v15 NY (cutoffs are lower than the 25%). If average or below average, might make sense to be between the 25 and 75.

+1. NYC felt very much like one long "airport bar at 2 am" test. I think this applies generally to law firm interviews, but when comparing my experience to friends who spent most of OCI focusing on other markets, it seemed to matter even more with new york.

[WheninLaw]

I'm so glad they are providing that data for everyone. Would be nicer if it was bands, but still. While they are helpful guidelines, nobody should be worried. As others have pointed out, they skew high because firms don't care much about their yield - even if you have no shot at snagging the person with a 181, you give them a CB anyways. I had mid 180's grades, did 30 interviews, and was in the range of 26-27 CBs. I know a few others that were similar.

[elterrible78]

All this exciting OCI talk is almost making me rethink my decision to skip it.

Almost. Good luck, dudes.

[Anonymous User]

Anybody willing to review bid lists over PM? Would prefer it to posting anon.

[WheninLaw]

Anybody willing to review bid lists over PM? Would prefer it to posting anon.

Sure, though 2014 is more helpful if you're NY/Chi specific. I'm better with CA/Chi.

[gchatbrah]

Anybody willing to review bid lists over PM? Would prefer it to posting anon.

Really knowledgeable re: NYC -- bid the market exclusively. In general, Paul Woo is actually pretty good at single-market bid list structuring, so don't be afraid to at least take one meeting with him to look at it. He has better data on who goes when than our collection of anecdotes will.

For every other bit of advice, come here!

[elterrible78]

If any U of Chicago students want a copy of that callback report in Excel (for sorting or whatever), PM me.

[Neal Patrick Harris]

Anybody willing to review bid lists over PM? Would prefer it to posting anon.

Happy to help NY/Chi

[Anonymous User]

excuse my noobness

How come people don't generally have bid lists that extend past 20-30? Is it because the bids that come after that point are so unlikely that it doesn't matter what you bid?

[Neal Patrick Harris]

excuse my noobness :cry:

How come people don't generally have bid lists that extend past 20-30? Is it because the bids that come after that point are so unlikely that it doesn't matter what you bid?

yup

[2014]

You should still fill those firms in because why not, but don't spend any time worrying about it. I did mine alphabetically.

[Anonymous User]

First attempt at a bidlist; please don't be gentle. I pulled as much as I could from previous years' threads, but I wasn't sure how much of the ordering was because X person really wanted Y firm rather than, you absolutely need to bid firm Y in Z slot or you won't get it. Goals are LA=DC > NY, lit, and trying to maximize screeners. Two years unrelated work experience, K&E scholar and did writeon.

1. Jones Day DC (21)
2. Cleary DC (38)
3. GDC LA (12)
4. K&E NY (21)
5. Boies Lit (21)
6. K&E DC (21)
7. MoFo LA (21)
8. Cleary NY (42)
9. Skadden NY (42)
10. Latham LA (21)
11. W&C (38)
12. Covington (21)
13. Irell LA (42)
14. MTO (42)
15. Sullcrom (42)
16. DPW NY (42)
17. Grippo (21)
18. STB NY (57)
19. Proskauer NY (21)
20. Skadden DC (21)
21. Sidley DC (21)
22. OMM LA (21)
23. Cravath (38)
24. A&P DC (21)
25. Steptoe (18)
26. Debevoise (63)
27. K&E LA (21)
28. Sidley CA (21)
29. Susman Houston (19)
30. WLRK (42)

- Any wasted bids? Any DC/LA firms that I should be including and am not? Any firms on that list that don't mesh with general lit goals? I threw Grippo/Susman in even though I'm not interested in Chi/TX overall because I would be interested for those particular firms, if that makes sense.

- Is it too aggressive, even with K&E?

- How suicidal is it to focus DC/LA with zero ties? Midwestern kid wanting to get out, and wanting to avoid landing in an NYC sweatshop if possible. But wanting to avoid being jobless above all, hence the NYC firms.

[2014]

Grippo (probably), Williams and Connolly, MTO, Irell (all definitely) can be put lower. I'm all but certain the latter three didn't fill last year. Proskauer NY is a wasted bid down there, even if you bump it to 15 or w/e after demoting the 4 I said. Given your preferences, I would consider moving up some of the 21 slot firms of your choosing in LA/DC. Any reason for no WilmerHale or White and Case DC?

Other than those comments, I think your list is reasonable objectively and in light of your grades you will do more than fine. Our class has several in Cali/DC with no ties.

[Neal Patrick Harris]

Grippo (probably), Williams and Connolly, MTO, Irell (all definitely) can be put lower. I'm all but certain the latter three didn't fill last year. Proskauer NY is a wasted bid down there, even if you bump it to 15 or w/e after demoting the 4 I said. Given your preferences, I would consider moving up some of the 21 slot firms of your choosing in LA/DC. Any reason for no WilmerHale or White and Case DC?

Other than those comments, I think your list is reasonable objectively and in light of your grades you will do more than fine. Our class has several in Cali/DC with no ties.

You're not going to go to Proskauer with those grades. Delete it.

Splitting between Kirkland offices means both have to like you (a recent grad told me that they communicate).

Deb might be too late. Despite it going late last year, I think people won't go that late again. Who knows, though. IMO it matches the archetypal Chicago personality so I'm surprised its so unpopular.

Maybe bump CSM if you really want it.

Work on creating a story for ties with each. With no background, match it to practice area.

[Anonymous User]

You're not going to go to Proskauer with those grades. Delete it

Dead wrong. Proskauer NY offered a transfer student last OCI (clearly not K&E Scholar/LR) and called back two people at median.

Poster, you can bid Irell lower for sure--same with Munger.

[Mal Reynolds]

You're not going to go to Proskauer with those grades. Delete it

Dead wrong. Proskauer NY offered a transfer student last OCI (clearly not K&E Scholar/LR) and called back two people at median.

I read this wrong too at first. He's saying his grades are too good for the firm/will have better offers. Not that his grades are insufficient.

[20141023]

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