Down to Final Two: Quinn Emanuel VS. Kirkland Ellis. Forum

[Anonymous User]

yale kiddies tend to go into academia or government work. and there's fewer of them to start out with anyway.

Good point.
Chart on Left for Quinn. Right for Kirkland.
Attorneys | % of T-14 | % of Firm

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Fordham guy here. Gotta plug the school whenever I can...

25 Fordham grads at K&E - one less than Penn and more than Duke, Yale, Berkeley, Cornell, Stanford, and Texas.

25 Fordham grads at Quinn - more than Mich, N'West, UVA, Yale, Texas, Chicago, Cornell, Duke, and Penn.

Not too shabby.

Oh yeah...and make it 26 at Quinn for me next year

I am assuming you are a Fordham 2L with an offer at Quinn.
I'm a Fordham 1L gauging how selective Quinn is for Fordham people. Do you mind giving general stats? If not, thats fine.

[Anonymous User]

I am assuming you are a Fordham 2L with an offer at Quinn*.
I'm a Fordham 1L gauging how selective Quinn is for Fordham people. Do you mind giving general stats? If not, thats fine.

*Accepted offer at Quinn. Top 5%, LR.

It seems (based on last year stats and for those I've spoken to this year), if you get a callback at Quinn, you get an offer.

[Anonymous User]

I am assuming you are a Fordham 2L with an offer at Quinn*.
I'm a Fordham 1L gauging how selective Quinn is for Fordham people. Do you mind giving general stats? If not, thats fine.

*Accepted offer at Quinn. Top 5%, LR.

It seems (based on last year stats and for those I've spoken to this year), if you get a callback at Quinn, you get an offer.

did they accept lower stats than yours too, like top 15% or 20%? if not, then Quinn seems very selective for fordham!

[Anonymous User]

I am assuming you are a Fordham 2L with an offer at Quinn*.
I'm a Fordham 1L gauging how selective Quinn is for Fordham people. Do you mind giving general stats? If not, thats fine.

*Accepted offer at Quinn. Top 5%, LR.

It seems (based on last year stats and for those I've spoken to this year), if you get a callback at Quinn, you get an offer.

did they accept lower stats than yours too, like top 15% or 20%? if not, then Quinn seems very selective for fordham!

Quinn cares a lot about grades and LR.

[Renne Walker]

25 Fordham grads at Quinn - more than Mich, N'West, UVA, Yale, Texas, Chicago, Cornell, Duke, and Penn.

Unless I am missing something. . . with 25 grads, you have more grads at Quinn than anyone, with the exception of Harvard and NYU.

[existenz]

Nvm, checked the Quinn website. It seems he's right. The NY office does have a lot of Fordham folks. Makes sense since Urquhart went to Fordham.

[YourCaptain]

I'd like to know where Fordham guy is getting this stat. There are no Fordham grads in Quinn's CA offices, so this would mean that basically 1/4 of the NY office is Fordham grads. I find that hard to believe.

NALP reports 217 attorneys in Quinn NY. A search on quinn's site shows 25 (could be wrong) Fordham grads total, 23 of which are in NY.

So I have no clue what he's on about

[Anonymous User]

MARKET SHATTERING BONUSES

Why are you talking about Boies on a Quinn thread

[Anonymous User]

I am assuming you are a Fordham 2L with an offer at Quinn*.
I'm a Fordham 1L gauging how selective Quinn is for Fordham people. Do you mind giving general stats? If not, thats fine.

*Accepted offer at Quinn. Top 5%, LR.

It seems (based on last year stats and for those I've spoken to this year), if you get a callback at Quinn, you get an offer.

did they accept lower stats than yours too, like top 15% or 20%? if not, then Quinn seems very selective for fordham!

nope...unless on LR, you basically have no shot at quinn. and chances are slimmer that you'll make LR with 15-20% (only 30 write on spots for LR).

there was an article on ATL where a Fordham kid was complaining about Quinn's hiring process...was only a month ago or so.

[Anonymous User]

As somebody in the know:

They're both great firms. Congrats on the choices. Here are the facts:

- Kirkland's bonuses are bigger, but Quinn does pay better than most other firms.
- Quinn has a more casual dress code, but their atmosphere is not necessarily "more casual".
- Its a trade off, but generally Quinn attorneys seem to work longer (and more painful) hours.
- Kirkland is the recognized go-to shop for major lit, they just have the depth and entrenched position; but Quinn is definitely deserved of a 2nd place finish or in some instances a tie for 1st. Kirkland did just recently destroy Quinn in the Apple/HTC case, FYIW.
- None of what is posted above about how many kids from each law school went to each law firm has any bearing on the real world. Once you're in a top 14, you're pretty much getting equal consideration at these law firms; and if you're doing well at a top30-40, you'll occasionally get lucky if you click with people. The charts made above were a waste of time.

In the end, frankly: go with the people you liked the most. There's enough equal between the two firms to be a wash when looking at metrics, so go with the non-quants. Ultimately, what leads to high or low associate morale are the relationships those associates form with each other, and if you got a good vibe from one place, go there. You'll probably fit in.

- Actual Practicing Attorney

[Anonymous User]

Quinn seems to be the go to place for litigators in NYC these days. They have been stealing some big partners from other major lit players (not massive rainmakers, moreso just really skilled litigators) who might have been a little lower on the totem pole at their old firm and now get to star a bit more (plus probably make more $$$) at Quinn. I am guessing there are more opportunities for junior level people at Quinn but I could be wrong about that. I am certain that both firms will be a grindhouse, Quinn reminds me of Boies a little and I know that people there work like sled dogs.

If NYC, I'd pick Quinn. If Chicago, I'd pick Kirkland. If I had offers from both and didn't care about location, I would pick Quinn because I think I'd do more faster and I will never give one scintilla of a care for the corporate side so it is appealing to me that it is a litigation-only firm. Kirkland is a behemoth in both areas but I like the specialty factor of a lit-only firm.

Plus the firm sounds like it's the Governor of Illinois and the Mayor of Chicago COMBINED into some sort of super political firm which is probably not how it really is.

[Anonymous User]

Kirkland did just recently destroy Quinn in the Apple/HTC case, FYIW.

Quinn and Keker.

[Old Gregg]

They have been stealing some big partners from other major lit players (not massive rainmakers, moreso just really skilled litigators)

With a $3mm+ PPP, you can bet your left ball they've been bringing in massive rainmakers. And the moment they stop making it rain, you can bet your right ball they'll get pushed out.

[Anonymous User]

Is it just me or is Quinn more IP focused in Chicago?

[Anonymous User]

I would pick Quinn because I think I'd do more faster and I will never give one scintilla of a care for the corporate side so it is appealing to me that it is a litigation-only firm. Kirkland is a behemoth in both areas but I like the specialty factor of a lit-only firm..

My understanding is that you have this wrong, on two accounts. I'm a junior associate at a major lit firm, and I have law school friends at both Kirkland and Quinn. We talk about this stuff a lot.

1) My Kirkland friends seem to be getting more experience and working (shockingly) less than my Quinn friends, but maybe they are just better at hiding it. For instance, most of my Kirkland friends my year (second year) have already taken and defended numerous deps; I only know one Quinn guy my year who has defended a dep, maybe two.

2) From what I understand, Kirkland is heavily compartmentalized. You're either doing lit, IP lit, or corporate-type work. And they're obviously known for their litigation/IP lit prestige. I hear you don't mess with other people in other departments much, and so I don't know that it matters that Quinn is "lit-only" while Kirkland has strong lit and strong corp. Hell, in this economy, I'd rather be at a firm that had a full practice... I'm sure Kirkland's bankruptcy practice did pretty well over the last few years and who knows if that helped maintain profits rather than suffer the downturn.

[Anonymous User]

2) From what I understand, Kirkland is heavily compartmentalized. You're either doing lit, IP lit, or corporate-type work. And they're obviously known for their litigation/IP lit prestige. I hear you don't mess with other people in other departments much, and so I don't know that it matters that Quinn is "lit-only" while Kirkland has strong lit and strong corp. Hell, in this economy, I'd rather be at a firm that had a full practice... I'm sure Kirkland's bankruptcy practice did pretty well over the last few years and who knows if that helped maintain profits rather than suffer the downturn.

Yep, absolutely right. I was this close to accepting K&E Chicago. I was talking to a few partners about this, and corporate is cyclical, bankruptcy counter-cyclical, and, at least for K&E, litigation is flat (meaning it does not move with the economy). Kirkland's practice therefore is very robust and explains why they have been doing so well.

[Anonymous User]

Quinn has been growing at an amazing pace. Their profit per capita outshines that of kirklands. That's why it's attracting many talented people, whom young associates will be learning from.
I don't see Quinn slowing down in the near future either.

[Old Gregg]

Quinn has been growing at an amazing pace.

Yes. It's not hard for a small firm to grow quickly. Kind of unfair to ask a 1,500 lawyer firm to grow at the same pace, wouldn't you say?

Their profit per capita outshines that of kirklands. That's why it's attracting many talented people, whom young associates will be learning from.

There's no way in which the difference between a $3.8mm and a $3mm PPP accrues to a difference in learning experience for a junior associate. If anything, it probably means that the junior associate works harder at the former firm than at the latter.

[Anonymous User]

Quinn has been growing at an amazing pace.

Yes. It's not hard for a small firm to grow quickly. Kind of unfair to ask a 1,500 lawyer firm to grow at the same pace, wouldn't you say?

Their profit per capita outshines that of kirklands. That's why it's attracting many talented people, whom young associates will be learning from.

There's no way in which the difference between a $3.8mm and a $3mm PPP accrues to a difference in learning experience for a junior associate. If anything, it probably means that the junior associate works harder at the former firm than at the latter.

when did I ever compare the growth of quinn and kirkland's?
and if its "not so hard," show me another firm that is 25 years old, and has grown as much as quinn (in number and in profits).

[Anonymous User]

Quinn has been growing at an amazing pace. Their profit per capita outshines that of kirklands. That's why it's attracting many talented people, whom young associates will be learning from.
I don't see Quinn slowing down in the near future either.

don't buy the hype. From complaints I hear from Quinn associates interviewing as laterals at my firm, Quinn is already showing signs of slowing down and not knowing how to manage a larger practice.

[Anonymous User]

Quinn has been growing at an amazing pace. Their profit per capita outshines that of kirklands. That's why it's attracting many talented people, whom young associates will be learning from.
I don't see Quinn slowing down in the near future either.

don't buy the hype. From complaints I hear from Quinn associates interviewing as laterals at my firm, Quinn is already showing signs of slowing down and not knowing how to manage a larger practice.

Seems to me that associates interviewing for lateral may have a particular perspective.

[Anonymous User]

Quinn has been growing at an amazing pace. Their profit per capita outshines that of kirklands. That's why it's attracting many talented people, whom young associates will be learning from.
I don't see Quinn slowing down in the near future either.

don't buy the hype. From complaints I hear from Quinn associates interviewing as laterals at my firm, Quinn is already showing signs of slowing down and not knowing how to manage a larger practice.

Seems to me that associates interviewing for lateral may have a particular perspective.

probably a more informed one.

[Anonymous User]

Any new thoughts to add to this conversation, ~7 years later?

[Anonymous User]

I am assuming you are a Fordham 2L with an offer at Quinn*.
I'm a Fordham 1L gauging how selective Quinn is for Fordham people. Do you mind giving general stats? If not, thats fine.

*Accepted offer at Quinn. Top 5%, LR.

It seems (based on last year stats and for those I've spoken to this year), if you get a callback at Quinn, you get an offer.

I saw this a lot on TLS before my Quinn callback.. Not at Fordham, but FWIW a Quinn callback does not guarantee a Quinn offer.

[malibustacy]

Why the hell would you necro this thread?