Straight Ps at Stanford Forum

[englawyer]

if grades were completely random, the median would be 33% H, which is 4.29. chances are its significantly lower because grades are not random.

[Anonymous User]

Re-run those statistics with random distribution assuming 10% with 9+ Hs and 10% with 0 Hs. That should probably give you something pretty accurate.

[englawyer]

using 10% cutoffs:

the remaining grades would be 23%H and 55%P. thus the chance of an H is 30% (.23/(.23+.55)) and P is 70%. the expected number of H in that case (and thus median) would be .3*14 or 4.2 H.

using 20% cutoffs:

remaining would be 13% H and 46%P. chance of H is (.13/(.13+.46)) or 22%. the median would be 3.08 H.

[Anonymous User]

anybody know anybody that got a district clerkship with uber-crappy grades?

[Anonymous User]

Us 1Ls are having our grades trickle in so thought I'd bump this to see if any 2Ls or 3Ls could comment on how OCI looks for those of us who starting to get Ps and thinking it might be a trend. SF but also other markets.

For the record, I'm not freaking -- most of the talk around school seems encouraging. Also curious about the clerkship question above.

[Anonymous User]

I knew multiple Straight Ps that didn't have any trouble finding jobs, though none looked in SF. DC wasn't a problem though, for those who say DC is the most competitive market. Honestly outside the top like 15%, OCI is all about personality/selling yourself.

[LawIdiot86]

I knew multiple Straight Ps that didn't have any trouble finding jobs, though none looked in SF. DC wasn't a problem though, for those who say DC is the most competitive market. Honestly outside the top like 15%, OCI is all about personality/selling yourself.

Really?! Top 20% at SLS is risky now? WTF?

[Anonymous User]

I knew multiple Straight Ps that didn't have any trouble finding jobs, though none looked in SF. DC wasn't a problem though, for those who say DC is the most competitive market. Honestly outside the top like 15%, OCI is all about personality/selling yourself.

Really?! Top 20% at SLS is risky now? WTF?

Oh no. The point is that outside of the very top of the class at SLS (Top 10-15%, 9+ Hs), there aren't many firms that will substantially differentiate between a person with 7 Hs and a person with 4-5 Hs. Most of the grade-conscious firms (MTO, Keker, W&C, Irell, etc.) will call back the same people, and then everyone else will get a good number of callbacks with reach, target, and safety firms. People in the 2L and 3L class with straight Ps had multiple V5-V20 offers (though there aren't many straight P people, probably 10%, maybe less).

[Anonymous User]

yeah. law school is fucked up. i've got a B.A phi beta kappa/summa cum laude from yale w/ awards and prizes, 177 LSAT ----> straight Ps so far at SLS in my 1L, and i worked pretty damn hard and felt like i knew the material. boom temp work!

[johansantana21]

yeah. law school is fucked up. i've got a B.A phi beta kappa/summa cum laude from yale w/ awards and prizes, 177 LSAT ----> straight Ps so far at SLS in my 1L, and i worked pretty damn hard and felt like i knew the material. boom temp work!

Not sure if serious but made me lol.

[Anonymous User]

temp work part was a joke, everything else true.

i think that SLSers will be fine. we'll all have at LEAST 1 or 2 Hs by the end of the first year (god willing), and we'll all get jobs in the markets we want just not necessarily at the firms/orgs we'd prefer, or else less prestigious fed clerkships in the less desirable markets...

[Anonymous User]

temp work part was a joke, everything else true.

i think that SLSers will be fine. we'll all have at LEAST 1 or 2 Hs by the end of the first year (god willing), and we'll all get jobs in the markets we want just not necessarily at the firms/orgs we'd prefer, or else less prestigious fed clerkships in the less desirable markets...

this is not completely true. some people will not have a single H by the end of their first year. You will still get a job that pays 160 if you want it, though. and many 1L firm jobs will hire you before they even see your grades.

[071816]

I'd give my left nut to be in OP's shoes.

[Anonymous User]

I'm doing a serious bump here to see if any SLS 2Ls or 3Ls can let a 1L know how Fed Lit grades work. Do we get them both at the end of the year? And do you get a separate grade for winter quarter and spring quarter? Or two grades (one for winter, one for spring) but based on your work over the two quarters (meaning you'd for sure get P,P or H,H)? Thanks!

[cim_can]

yeah. law school is fucked up. i've got a B.A phi beta kappa/summa cum laude from yale w/ awards and prizes, 177 LSAT ----> straight Ps so far at SLS in my 1L, and i worked pretty damn hard and felt like i knew the material. boom temp work!

Someone else asked if people got district clerkships with crappy grades.

Straight P's are hard to swallow - I graduated a few years ago and this is what my transcript looked like for OCI and clerkship applications:

1L Fall - 5 P's
1L Winter - 2H's, 2 P's, 1 MP

2L Fall - 2 P's, 2 H's
2L Winter - 3 P's, 1 MP
2L Spring - 2 H's, 2 P's

That's two quarters/semesters of only P's, with only a smattering of H's. I have no idea where that put me in my class. 2L OCI was pretty miserable, but I emerged unscathed and with a job.

Over my first two years, I got to know two professors really well that were not the usual folk that clerkship gunners try to suck up to; both of them were really helpful when I applied for clerkships.

Clerkships-wise, I stayed away from SF, NYC, LA, etc., and I only applied to federal district and state courts.
I applied broadly across the country otherwise, got three interviews, and an offer. I'm very happily clerking now at a very busy, non-SDNY/NDCA court. I love it.

SLS's grade system is great for a boom economy, because people won't nit-pick grades that they don't understand when there is a demand for SLS people. When the economy sucks, it seems to me that the grade system encourages employers to just count H's. But at the end of the day, you're still at SLS.

Ultimately, my point is that you will not suffer for law-firm jobs or clerkships. You may have to swallow your pride, work harder, and search a little further for jobs and clerkships, but it's not the end of the world, like I thought it was.

[Myself]

.

[cim_can]

What year did you graduate?

2011.

[Genki]

I'm doing a serious bump here to see if any SLS 2Ls or 3Ls can let a 1L know how Fed Lit grades work. Do we get them both at the end of the year? And do you get a separate grade for winter quarter and spring quarter? Or two grades (one for winter, one for spring) but based on your work over the two quarters (meaning you'd for sure get P,P or H,H)? Thanks!

Can anyone comment on this? I still haven't received a grade for Winter Fed Lit and I'm wondering if my professor is just slow at grading or it grades won't be given until after this next quarter.

[Anonymous User]

You get the Fed Lit grades, at the same time, sometime after spring finals based on your work over the two quarters.

[BearState]

You also get the same grade for both quarters of fed lit.