NEW final 2010 OCI results thread that are ACTUALLY FINAL Forum

[Anonymous User]

V5 in secondary market

So Skadden?

[Anonymous User]

V5 in secondary market

So Skadden?

Or DPW... or S&C...

[Anonymous User]

V5 in secondary market

So Skadden?

Or DPW... or S&C...

Either way, it was probably a fluke. At my NY school, satellite offices of V5 (e.g. DPW DC/Menlo Park, SullCrom DC/LA, Skadden DC/Chicago/LA/Boston) tended to be extremely selective - in Skadden's case, much more selective than the NY office.

[Anonymous User]

Either way, it was probably a fluke. At my NY school, satellite offices of V5 (e.g. DPW DC/Menlo Park, SullCrom DC/LA, Skadden DC/Chicago/LA/Boston) tended to be extremely selective - in Skadden's case, much more selective than the NY office.

Probably because the summer classes at those offices are probably going to be tiny when compared to the summer classes of their home offices. Just a guess.

[Anonymous User]

Either way, it was probably a fluke. At my NY school, satellite offices of V5 (e.g. DPW DC/Menlo Park, SullCrom DC/LA, Skadden DC/Chicago/LA/Boston) tended to be extremely selective - in Skadden's case, much more selective than the NY office.

Probably because the summer classes at those offices are probably going to be tiny when compared to the summer classes of their home offices. Just a guess.

Exactly right. Some of those offices didn't even hand out 1 offer.

[Anonymous User]

V5 in secondary market

So Skadden?

Or DPW... or S&C...

Silicon Valley is a secondary market? That's news to me.

SF/SV is generally recognized on TLS as a single, primary market.

[Anonymous User]

Silicon Valley is a secondary market? That's news to me.

SF/SV is generally recognized on TLS as a single, primary market.

So TLS is suddenly determinative of what primary and secondary markets are?

In the legal circle (at least the one I frequent, as I work in it, though I admit it could be different in other legal circles), "The Bay Area" is not a primary market.

[12262010]

Silicon Valley is a secondary market? That's news to me.

SF/SV is generally recognized on TLS as a single, primary market.

So TLS is suddenly determinative of what primary and secondary markets are?

In the legal circle (at least the one I frequent, as I work in it, though I admit it could be different in other legal circles), "The Bay Area" is not a primary market.

No, TLS is determinative of what is recognized as a primary market on TLS.

[Anonymous User]

Silicon Valley is a secondary market? That's news to me.

SF/SV is generally recognized on TLS as a single, primary market.

So TLS is suddenly determinative of what primary and secondary markets are?

In the legal circle (at least the one I frequent, as I work in it, though I admit it could be different in other legal circles), "The Bay Area" is not a primary market.

TLS recognizes five primary markets: NY, DC, Chicago, LA, Bay Area.

I know it's circular reasoning, but it would seem odd to deem a market that has so many V25ish main offices (MoFo, WSGR, etc.) and satellite offices (DPW, S&C, STB, etc.) a "secondary" market. Boston, Philadelphia Dallas, Houston, or Atlanta - the biggest secondary markets - don't have even close to the same caliber of firms.

Also, the Bay Area is a larger market than LA. Do you therefore consider LA a secondary market, too?

[Anonymous User]

Oh. My. God. Am I speaking with THE TLS!?!?!?! The honor!

More seriously, your own source seems to disagree with you. See for example:
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 3&t=130690

I'm boggled as to why I'm perpetuating this pointless debate, so I'll just stop.

[Veyron]

Silicon Valley is a secondary market? That's news to me.

SF/SV is generally recognized on TLS as a single, primary market.

So TLS is suddenly determinative of what primary and secondary markets are?

In the legal circle (at least the one I frequent, as I work in it, though I admit it could be different in other legal circles), "The Bay Area" is not a primary market.

TLS recognizes five primary markets: NY, DC, Chicago, LA, Bay Area.

I know it's circular reasoning, but it would seem odd to deem a market that has so many V25ish main offices (MoFo, WSGR, etc.) and satellite offices (DPW, S&C, STB, etc.) a "secondary" market. Boston, Philadelphia Dallas, Houston, or Atlanta - the biggest secondary markets - don't have even close to the same caliber of firms.

Also, the Bay Area is a larger market than LA. Do you therefore consider LA a secondary market, too?

LOL, no. TLS primary markets NY DC CHI LA. Bay area has nowhere near enough legal jobs to be in that leage. They form a 2nd rank with Boston, Charlotte, Hotlanta and the like.

[wiseowl]

Once again, a page of a useful thread has been wasted on stupid drivel.

Clearly whoever posted above meant secondary office for that particular firm, whether or not it's in a "secondary market". If you think DPW Menlo or Skadden Wilmington are anywhere near as important to that firm as NY, I have a bridge over the East River to sell you.

Also, as we've discussed previously, EVERY market other than NY is a secondary market ITE. When NY has multiples more associate positions available than any other city, who cares about the others? DC is 1A, then Chicago/LA/SF.

[RVP11]

LOL, no. TLS primary markets NY DC CHI LA. Bay area has nowhere near enough legal jobs to be in that leauge. They form a 2nd rank with Boston, Charlotte, and the like.

There are more lawyers in the Bay Area than in LA. And Charlotte is a TINY market compared to the others discussed.

[Veyron]

LOL, no. TLS primary markets NY DC CHI LA. Bay area has nowhere near enough legal jobs to be in that leauge. They form a 2nd rank with Boston, Charlotte, and the like.

There are more lawyers in the Bay Area than in LA.

Not than in the LA area, not moar biglaw hiring in general.

[RVP11]

LOL, no. TLS primary markets NY DC CHI LA. Bay area has nowhere near enough legal jobs to be in that leauge. They form a 2nd rank with Boston, Charlotte, and the like.

There are more lawyers in the Bay Area than in LA.

Not than in the LA area, not moar biglaw hiring in general.

LA area including Orange County?

There are good reasons for separating the LA and OC markets and a lot fewer for separating SF and rest of the Bay Area.

[UnTouChablE]

No I guess hiring is finished. What are things looking like for CCN (Chicago) Students? percentage wise.

[thegor1987]

School range: MVPB
Market(s): California (SD, LA, and bay area)
Approx. class rank: Bottom third
Law review: No
Work experience: Yes
IP background: Yes
Anything else that might have an impact?: Lots of IP involvement at school, patent agent
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): 8. I am generally a shy person, but can adjust based on whether I am dealing with nervous male engineers or more of the standard litigator types.
Screening Interviews: 36
Mass mails: None
Callbacks received: 8
Callbacks accepted: 8
Offers w/vault ranges: 7 (2 vault-ranked IP boutiques, another IP boutique, 2 in 20-30, 1 in the 50s, 1 large regional techy firm)

What schools are MVP, MVPB?

[Veyron]

School range: MVPB
Market(s): California (SD, LA, and bay area)
Approx. class rank: Bottom third
Law review: No
Work experience: Yes
IP background: Yes
Anything else that might have an impact?: Lots of IP involvement at school, patent agent
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): 8. I am generally a shy person, but can adjust based on whether I am dealing with nervous male engineers or more of the standard litigator types.
Screening Interviews: 36
Mass mails: None
Callbacks received: 8
Callbacks accepted: 8
Offers w/vault ranges: 7 (2 vault-ranked IP boutiques, another IP boutique, 2 in 20-30, 1 in the 50s, 1 large regional techy firm)

What schools are MVP, MVPB?

Michigan Virginia Penn (Berkeley)

[lawschoollll]

It baffles me that Boaltttt is included by some in the MVP tier.

[Veyron]

It baffles me that Boaltttt is included by some in the MVP tier.

The tiers reflected the previous economic reality. Also, no school is placed into a lower tier than the school ranked under it by U.S. News. Just the way things work. Also for CA, Boalt > all but HYS.

[RVP11]

Also for CA, Boalt > all but HYS.

Probably not. I'd much rather be at CCN, and probably even V.

[Aqualibrium]

You people and your rankings. In the end, if you can't hold a 20 minute conversation, you won't end up with a job anyway. Some of you should be afraid.

[Anonymous User]

School range: T50
Market(s): CA
Approx. class rank: Above Median
Law review: Secondary
Work experience: Engineer
IP background: EE
Anything else that might have an impact?: No
Self-assessed interview ability (1-10): 8?
Screening Interviews: 16
Mass mails: 0
Callbacks received: 4
Callbacks accepted: 4
Offers: 1 at mid-sized IP boutique (2 rejections and 1 withdrawal all from V100)

I am extremely fortunate for my mediocre grades and school.

I wish everyone out there luck if you're still looking. Hang in there.

[RVP11]

You people and your rankings. In the end, if you can't hold a 20 minute conversation, you won't end up with a job anyway. Some of you should be afraid.

Cough cough, Kurama?

[vamedic03]

Some data for the silly primary versus secondary market discussion:

(Note the large dropoff after LA)

NLJ 250 2010 was released last week. Here are the largest 18 legal markets (for large firms) with number of NLJ 250 lawyers:

1) NYC - 21250

2) DC - 13004

3) Chicago - 7247

4) LA - 5462

5) SF - 3729

6) Boston - 3699

7) Philly - 2984

Atlanta - 2974

9) Dallas - 2790

10) Houston - 2732

11) Minneapolis - 1630

12) Miami - 1278

13) Denver - 1242

14) STL - 1227

15) Kansas City - 1194

16) Phoenix - 1084

17) Seattle - 1046

17) Nashville - 749