Milbank/Davis Polk/Cravath Scale: NYC to 215-415k Forum

[Anonymous User]

I'll throw my story in too -- was working at dumb dead end jobs. Last salary before law school was 55k. No career progression. But I'm good at tests and I was sitting on a good GPA so I took the LSAT (twice, thanks to all the "retake" people, really!) and got into a T14 on scholarship and now I'm making 205k so it's cool. If I could have made it in fancy banking I would have, but I couldn't and I didn't.

Also as a non trad I really could use the extra 10k or whatever special bonus happens, please and thank you. It's nice to be able to not worry about paying my mortgage anymore, but it'd be even nicer if I could remodel my ugly kitchen.

[NoLongerALurker]

So how are the retroactive payments being applied? One lump sum on the following paycheck or…?

[Anonymous User]

So how are the retroactive payments being applied? One lump sum on the following paycheck or…?

Also curious about this. It (and the speed of matches) actually affects me because I'm leaving the firm at the end of the month, and it would be nice if my final paycheck had a few thousand tacked onto it. If DPW keeps dragging its feet and my firm doesn't match for a few weeks and says it'll be applied on March paycheck I guess I might be SOL.

[bigbeau]

So how are the retroactive payments being applied? One lump sum on the following paycheck or…?

They just apply the payments to the nearest lobster vendor as credit for your future wedding or events.

[Anonymous User]

The longer DPW keeps associates distracted and in a state of uncertainty, the more it needs to do to justify the silence. DPW can easily undo its goodwill by matching or announcing something more but too weak to justify stringing everyone along. Because then it would just look like DPW had built up its influence just to flex on everyone, not to take care of associates, who are not wondering what compensation will look like over the next year, how to plan for the next year, and whether their firms will match and when.

Incredible insight from one of our precious anons, as per usual

If DPW just matches, we'll get a handful of breathless (probably anon) posts about how it's TTT and doomed forever, then everyone will forget a week later and never think about it again.

Big lols at the bolded btw

I like the part where the associates are wondering what compensation will look like over the next year. Will a 5th year make 305k or will they make 325k???? How is that person supposed to focus without knowing they have that 20k?? Are they just supposed to budget for the amount they're currently making? So many questions I need to ask DPW.

All jokes aside, it's not like we don't know that DPW is matching. DPW associates should just assume they have the Milbank scale until any news otherwise...

(1) Anon exists for a reason. Put on your big boy pants and figure it out.

(2) Every comp cycle and every bonus season, this forum fills with folks revisiting which firms have done what over the previous years. The fact that the first boomer above is lurking in this thread policing posts where so many are discussing what DPW and others have done in past cycles shows that the idea that people will "never think about it again" is objectively ignorant.

(3) People have families and life decisions to make. If you're single and billing your days away and $20k is garbage to you, that privilege is wonderful, and you should enjoy it. But others have children and significant others and responsibilities outside of employment. That means making life choices that could be influenced by things like: how much will go into retirement this year; whether there's a significant comp increase that will be spread out across the entire year or come in the form of a bonus that could at least partially be collected in the next few months; how taking leave for the birth of a child and when would affect what money is received if that money is driven by hours.

(4) I'm sorry you're so frustrated. Keep coming back.

*rolling eyes* at the notion that anyone in this thread isn't privileged. How will your family survive on 240k instead of 250k? *gasp*

[Anonymous User]

The longer DPW keeps associates distracted and in a state of uncertainty, the more it needs to do to justify the silence. DPW can easily undo its goodwill by matching or announcing something more but too weak to justify stringing everyone along. Because then it would just look like DPW had built up its influence just to flex on everyone, not to take care of associates, who are not wondering what compensation will look like over the next year, how to plan for the next year, and whether their firms will match and when.

Incredible insight from one of our precious anons, as per usual

If DPW just matches, we'll get a handful of breathless (probably anon) posts about how it's TTT and doomed forever, then everyone will forget a week later and never think about it again.

Big lols at the bolded btw

I like the part where the associates are wondering what compensation will look like over the next year. Will a 5th year make 305k or will they make 325k???? How is that person supposed to focus without knowing they have that 20k?? Are they just supposed to budget for the amount they're currently making? So many questions I need to ask DPW.

All jokes aside, it's not like we don't know that DPW is matching. DPW associates should just assume they have the Milbank scale until any news otherwise...

(1) Anon exists for a reason. Put on your big boy pants and figure it out.

(2) Every comp cycle and every bonus season, this forum fills with folks revisiting which firms have done what over the previous years. The fact that the first boomer above is lurking in this thread policing posts where so many are discussing what DPW and others have done in past cycles shows that the idea that people will "never think about it again" is objectively ignorant.

(3) People have families and life decisions to make. If you're single and billing your days away and $20k is garbage to you, that privilege is wonderful, and you should enjoy it. But others have children and significant others and responsibilities outside of employment. That means making life choices that could be influenced by things like: how much will go into retirement this year; whether there's a significant comp increase that will be spread out across the entire year or come in the form of a bonus that could at least partially be collected in the next few months; how taking leave for the birth of a child and when would affect what money is received if that money is driven by hours.

(4) I'm sorry you're so frustrated. Keep coming back.

*rolling eyes* at the notion that anyone in this thread isn't privileged. How will your family survive on 240k instead of 250k? *gasp*

On steak and not lobster. God damn, ppl are so cruel.

[Anonymous User]

Adding another story about shit tier credentialed successes.

I dropped out of undergrad with a sub 2.0 GPA as a sophomore then failed out of community college a year later. Was basically a nomad for two years, renrolled in community college, then transferred to the local state school, then did well on the LSAT and got into a t14. Starting at a v20 next year. I 100% do not feel envy toward investment bankers because I never had a shot at that after only getting my shit together at 22 or so.

However, if I were an Ivy grad who decided law over IB because of risk aversion or prestige or whatever reason, I would definitely be salty/curious about IB salaries.

[Anonymous User]

Adding another story about shit tier credentialed successes.

I dropped out of undergrad with a sub 2.0 GPA as a sophomore then failed out of community college a year later. Was basically a nomad for two years, renrolled in community college, then transferred to the local state school, then did well on the LSAT and got into a t14. Starting at a v20 next year. I 100% do not feel envy toward investment bankers because I never had a shot at that after only getting my shit together at 22 or so.

However, if I were an Ivy grad who decided law over IB because of risk aversion or prestige or whatever reason, I would definitely be salty/curious about IB salaries.

That's awesome. Kudos to you and good luck.

[NoLongerALurker]

So how are the retroactive payments being applied? One lump sum on the following paycheck or…?

They just apply the payments to the nearest lobster vendor as credit for your future wedding or events.

I appreciate the efficiencies in this approach and approve of it.

We are all on Team Lobster.

[Anonymous User]

Adding another story about shit tier credentialed successes.

I dropped out of undergrad with a sub 2.0 GPA as a sophomore then failed out of community college a year later. Was basically a nomad for two years, renrolled in community college, then transferred to the local state school, then did well on the LSAT and got into a t14. Starting at a v20 next year. I 100% do not feel envy toward investment bankers because I never had a shot at that after only getting my shit together at 22 or so.

However, if I were an Ivy grad who decided law over IB because of risk aversion or prestige or whatever reason, I would definitely be salty/curious about IB salaries.

This is familiar. I failed out of community college after a couple of semesters. Did random fun things for a few years before going back to the community college. Did well after I got the laziness out of me. Transferred to state school, killed LSAT, t14, V5. Was the first college degree in my family, and $10k still feels like a crap load of money, even after doing this for a few years now. Give me that money DPW.

[Anonymous User]

Could someone at dpw NY plz bring this to Neal’s office: https://www.amazon.com/Consider-Lobster ... 3/ref=nodl_

[Anonymous User]

Joining the chorus of underachievers.

Grew up middle class but neither of my parents have college degrees. So while college was a "must do" for me, my parents didn't really equip me with the tools needed to get there or succeed there. I left highschool with a 2.7gpa, including an F in English. Enrolled in the local unranked private college (after getting off the wait-list) and dropped out after one month. Got my shit together over a year, came back, and left summa cum laude. Then I went to work at an abusive small private law firm for two years at $11 an hour. Stayed because they let me flex time to prep for the LSAT. Ended up at a t14 with a 2/3 scholarship and now I'm at a v25.

IB was never an option for me. I got lucky and found a career that I enjoy and that didn't require an elite undergrad degree. Now I've got lobster.

[PBRonTap]

The longer DPW keeps associates distracted and in a state of uncertainty, the more it needs to do to justify the silence. DPW can easily undo its goodwill by matching or announcing something more but too weak to justify stringing everyone along. Because then it would just look like DPW had built up its influence just to flex on everyone, not to take care of associates, who are not wondering what compensation will look like over the next year, how to plan for the next year, and whether their firms will match and when.

Incredible insight from one of our precious anons, as per usual

If DPW just matches, we'll get a handful of breathless (probably anon) posts about how it's TTT and doomed forever, then everyone will forget a week later and never think about it again.

Big lols at the bolded btw

I like the part where the associates are wondering what compensation will look like over the next year. Will a 5th year make 305k or will they make 325k???? How is that person supposed to focus without knowing they have that 20k?? Are they just supposed to budget for the amount they're currently making? So many questions I need to ask DPW.

All jokes aside, it's not like we don't know that DPW is matching. DPW associates should just assume they have the Milbank scale until any news otherwise...

(1) Anon exists for a reason. Put on your big boy pants and figure it out.

(2) Every comp cycle and every bonus season, this forum fills with folks revisiting which firms have done what over the previous years. The fact that the first boomer above is lurking in this thread policing posts where so many are discussing what DPW and others have done in past cycles shows that the idea that people will "never think about it again" is objectively ignorant.

(3) People have families and life decisions to make. If you're single and billing your days away and $20k is garbage to you, that privilege is wonderful, and you should enjoy it. But others have children and significant others and responsibilities outside of employment. That means making life choices that could be influenced by things like: how much will go into retirement this year; whether there's a significant comp increase that will be spread out across the entire year or come in the form of a bonus that could at least partially be collected in the next few months; how taking leave for the birth of a child and when would affect what money is received if that money is driven by hours.

(4) I'm sorry you're so frustrated. Keep coming back.

*rolling eyes* at the notion that anyone in this thread isn't privileged. How will your family survive on 240k instead of 250k? *gasp*

MOD NOTE: POLITICAL COMMENTARY/FLAME DELETED. THIS IS NOT A FORUM TO DISCUSS POLITICS.

[tlsthrowaway1306]

I love the lobster discussion and can empathize: one of the bonuses last year was the tipping point in favor of a raw bar at my wedding.

Also, to add to the chorus of under-achievers remade: I was a low-GPA splitter who had only worked in retail and similar nonsense before law school. I’m now a 7th year associate. Never thought I’d stay this long in biglaw (or have the opportunity to) but here we are.

[bigboybob]

Team Lobster. Lets go. Can we get t-shirts for this?

[Anonymous User]

Team Lobster. Lets go. Can we get t-shirts for this?

Nobody cares about my kitchen smh

[bigboybob]

If I was a betting man, I'd say Neil cares more about lobster than your kitchen.

[Res Ipsa Loquitter]

Also LOL at anyone thinking a family making $240K in NYC is rich.

[Anonymous User]

Also LOL at anyone thinking a family making $240K in NYC is rich.

Honestly assuming you don't come from family money/already have a house, for a family in the Bay Area/NYC, 2-300k is lower middle class, 3-500k is middle class, 500k-1m is upper middle class, 1M + is rich. Below 200k is straight up poor - families that make 150k can't even dream of buying a one bed room condo within commutable distance of work.

[NoLongerALurker]

Team Lobster. Lets go. Can we get t-shirts for this?

At the very least novelty bibs.

[parkslope]

Also LOL at anyone thinking a family making $240K in NYC is rich.

Honestly assuming you don't come from family money/already have a house, for a family in the Bay Area/NYC, 2-300k is lower middle class, 3-500k is middle class, 500k-1m is upper middle class, 1M + is rich. Below 200k is straight up poor - families that make 150k can't even dream of buying a one bed room condo within commutable distance of work.

I can't tell if this is serious. Median household income in NYC is $64,000 and it's $112k in San Francisco (not Bay Area) according to the Census. How is 2-3x the 50th percentile still "lower middle class"?

[bigboybob]

Can we not get side tracked people? Do you think Neil is a tail or claw kinda lobster man?

[Anonymous User]

DPW, do you see what you've done? Do you see how you've forced us into petty squabbling and bickering while we bide the time? Free us from this prison. Neil, free us.

[Anonymous User]

Also LOL at anyone thinking a family making $240K in NYC is rich.

Honestly assuming you don't come from family money/already have a house, for a family in the Bay Area/NYC, 2-300k is lower middle class, 3-500k is middle class, 500k-1m is upper middle class, 1M + is rich. Below 200k is straight up poor - families that make 150k can't even dream of buying a one bed room condo within commutable distance of work.

I can't tell if this is serious. Median household income in NYC is $64,000 and it's $112k in San Francisco (not Bay Area) according to the Census. How is 2-3x the 50th percentile still "lower middle class"?

Most of the people making 64k in NYC have been living there forever and either have rent controlled housing or bought in cheap. Ditto for SF. The median numbers are deceptive and don't reflect the financial reality for transplants (i.e. most biglaw associates) where 1 bedroom condos are close to 1m and 1500 square foot houses (in normal neighborhoods, not Palo Alto) are 2M+. Housing is the biggest expense, and I would argue a family with 150k income but bought a house in the Bay Area 30 years ago now worth a few million is substantially better off than a biglaw transplant making 300-400k.

[Anonymous User]

Also LOL at anyone thinking a family making $240K in NYC is rich.

Honestly assuming you don't come from family money/already have a house, for a family in the Bay Area/NYC, 2-300k is lower middle class, 3-500k is middle class, 500k-1m is upper middle class, 1M + is rich. Below 200k is straight up poor - families that make 150k can't even dream of buying a one bed room condo within commutable distance of work.

I can't tell if this is serious. Median household income in NYC is $64,000 and it's $112k in San Francisco (not Bay Area) according to the Census. How is 2-3x the 50th percentile still "lower middle class"?

Most of the people making 64k in NYC have been living there forever and either have rent controlled housing or bought in cheap. Ditto for SF. The median numbers are deceptive and don't reflect the financial reality for transplants (i.e. most biglaw associates) where 1 bedroom condos are close to 1m and 1500 square foot houses (in normal neighborhoods, not Palo Alto) are 2M+. Housing is the biggest expense, and I would argue a family with 150k income but bought a house in the Bay Area 30 years ago now worth a few million is substantially better off than a biglaw transplant making 300-400k.

I grew up in NYC and my family's household income was about $80k/year. Even adjusting for inflation - get a fucking grip dude. Not everyone in NYC lives in Chelsea.