NY GOES TO 180k! IT HAPPENED!!!! (CovingTTTon does a 180! Holder wept.) Forum

[Anonymous User]

Do ya'll think W&C moves up to $220k?

Not immediately. When firms moved to 160K, W&C went to 165K and stayed for a while - not sure when the next bump up came but it was months later at least. I think they might go 185/190 and then adjust upwards if need be.

W&C has been at $200k for over a year now. But they'd start becoming "below market" by year 3--when like half the summers actually start working. They'd have to move to 220, right? At least to retain the talent they have now

In general, associates at firms like W&C don't lateral to leveraged big law firms, so I'm not sure they'll see it like you do. W&C has paid mid-levels and senior associates slightly below market for several years.

It's funny because, while you're right, there is at least one person at my firm who moved from W&C to our "leveraged Big Law Firm."

[rpupkin]

It's funny because, while you're right, there is at least one person at my firm who moved from W&C to one of the "leveraged Big Law Firms"

Oh, it definitely happens. I know one such person myself. But I don't think it happens enough for W&C to think: "Oh, no....if we don't stay on top of the market, our mid-levels will flee to Skadden, Kirkland, and Quinn!"

[Big Shrimpin]

It's funny because, while you're right, there is at least one person at my firm who moved from W&C to one of the "leveraged Big Law Firms"

Oh, it definitely happens. I know one such person myself. But I don't think it happens enough for W&C to think: "Oh, no....if we don't stay on top of the market, our mid-levels will flee to Skadden, Kirkland, and Quinn!"

lol yeah

no firms are saying anything of the sort as we all know

[Anonymous User]

Anyone think firms like Kramer Levin will match?

[Big Shrimpin]

Anyone think firms like Kramer Levin will match?

maybe someeeedayyyyyy (in sinatra voice)

[SplitMyPants]

I can't even keep up with this thread anymore. Every time I check its jumped 10 pages

[Anonymous User]

I'm p sure Gibson and Latham will follow by Friday, and MTO will follow as soon as their democratic "voting" procedure has had its play. Boies and Wachtell are probably trying to figure out how to proportionally beat the market.

I wouldn't be surprised if Gibson was one of the last of the big PPP firms to match. They seem to relish their reputation as the tortoise that is slow moving and conservative, but always on a steady path forward. They are generally slow to react on bonus news, hesitant to expand or open new offices, not leading the legal market into new practice areas, unwilling to dramatically leverage up during boom cycles, etc, but they also have revenue growth every year since the Reagan administration, didn't have layoffs during the recession (at least overtly), etc.

They'll definitely match eventually, but I wouldn't put it past them to wait until everything is settled.

[Anonymous User]

Anyone think firms like Kramer Levin will match?

maybe someeeedayyyyyy (in sinatra voice)

Their PPP is ~1.8 and in 2007 they matched within the week so #fingerscrossed because I need that $$$

[homestyle28]

So with Jones Day at 1M, could it even afford the move? I've heard they deflate their PPP by reinvesting much of their revenue towards future endeavors -- more long term oriented.

It's not like law firms have R&D departments. If JD were a big plaintiff-side firm that were investing in cases that could bring in the big bucks I'd believe it, but I don't think that's the case.

JD doesn't report their numbers, so that 1m number is an educated guess. It's also structured different than most peer firms (single partner track, lower parter:assoc ratio etc).


I'm desperately trying to predict what they'll do for obvious reasons.

[Anonymous User]

Any predictions for other V30 firms like MoFo, O'Melveny, Akin, or Shearman?

[Anonymous User]

Have we predicted where we think the cutoff point is going to be between match all offices, match NY only, and stay the same?

[Anonymous User]

So with Jones Day at 1M, could it even afford the move? I've heard they deflate their PPP by reinvesting much of their revenue towards future endeavors -- more long term oriented.

It's not like law firms have R&D departments. If JD were a big plaintiff-side firm that were investing in cases that could bring in the big bucks I'd believe it, but I don't think that's the case.

JD doesn't report their numbers, so that 1m number is an educated guess. It's also structured different than most peer firms (single partner track, lower parter:assoc ratio etc).


I'm desperately trying to predict what they'll do for obvious reasons.

Pretty much every NY centric firm in the V100 will probably eventually match.

JD and to a lesser extent K&L will be interesting. JD probably will match in the biggest markets at least for first years, but K&L has two factors in play... They have the huge contingent fee this year that can probably allow the partnership to swallow a raise this year. They also historically matched in NY. However DC is a bigger office so how far would they have to consider they would have to take the raises if they do raise NY, DC? Boston? Pitt?

[rpupkin]

Have we predicted where we think the cutoff point is going to be between match all offices, match NY only, and stay the same?

Cutoff point?

[Anonymous User]

When will the big Boston firms do something?

Boston, unlike DC, is still very dominated by the traditional big firms there. I can't imagine Ropes not going to 180 at some point, but they're not going to feel the pressure like firms in other markets.

I'd expect Ropes to go pretty soon, maybe not immediately, but soon. Ropes definitely doesn't feel market pressure in Boston, but they do compete with a lot of NYC firms for talent and the NYC office is getting pretty big. If they want to get kids thinking NYC to the Boston HQ, they need to raise. Plus, they probably won't raise NYC and not Boston (but then again I guess Covington raised NYC and not DC, so who the heck knows).

No way Ropes raises NYC and not Boston. The revolt would be unbelievable. Almost everyone in the Boston office could have gone to one of the firm's that matched and Skadden's and Cooley's Boston offices are always trying to poach talent.

[jkpolk]

The more NY gets paid, the more TX pulls away.

I think this is exactly right. Wouldn't be surprised if NY loses some people to TX that they wouldn't otherwise have lost. Forced to RERAISE TO 190K to recruit. Skadden matches in all offices. Forced to RERAISE to 225K to recruit.

[sublime]

..

[cookiejar1]

Here it is folks. CONFIRMED.

I just can't believe that we went from THIS to where we are today. It truly is a special time to be alive.

[rpupkin]

Have we predicted where we think the cutoff point is going to be between match all offices, match NY only, and stay the same?

Cutoff point?

Roughly what PPP/vault(I know) range will stop matching all offices, and at what point we will start to see firms just say fuck it and not match at all. PPP below a million? Similar direction to where Smaug was going talking about firms with PPP of 1.7m.

Ah. I just don't think there's going to be a cutoff, as evidenced by "V10" (or whatever it is now) Covington resisting an increase outside of NYC and lower V100s (and non-ranked firms) increasing right away outside of NYC.

[Anonymous User]

DEWEY TO 180 CONFIRMED -- ALL OFFICES

[Anonymous User]

Here it is folks. CONFIRMED.

I just can't believe that we went from THIS to where we are today. It truly is a special time to be alive.

too excited to sleep


(is that your thumb? you have little thumbs)

[Serett]

everyone whose firm hasn't matched start sending pieces of paper that say 180K in size 200 to all your firm's printers

thank you

Affix said pieces of paper using a knife embedded in each partner's door

This thread moves too quickly for a "180 Theses or Disputation on the Power of Covington" follow-up.

[Anonymous User]

Anyone have info / speculation about the big patent boutiques?

[splitmuch]

Do ya'll think W&C moves up to $220k?

Not immediately. When firms moved to 160K, W&C went to 165K and stayed for a while - not sure when the next bump up came but it was months later at least. I think they might go 185/190 and then adjust upwards if need be.

W&C has been at $200k for over a year now. But they'd start becoming "below market" by year 3--when like half the summers actually start working. They'd have to move to 220, right? At least to retain the talent they have now

They have no bonuses. They are below market year 2 now
.

[Anonymous User]

Ropes will go 180 in all offices including Boston, and WH will match in all as well, and that will put enough pressure in DC on CovingTTTon to match. Maybe A&P follows WH before Cov, but either way, DC will be 180 and Cov's gambit will fail quickly.

[Big Shrimpin]

Do ya'll think W&C moves up to $220k?

Not immediately. When firms moved to 160K, W&C went to 165K and stayed for a while - not sure when the next bump up came but it was months later at least. I think they might go 185/190 and then adjust upwards if need be.

W&C has been at $200k for over a year now. But they'd start becoming "below market" by year 3--when like half the summers actually start working. They'd have to move to 220, right? At least to retain the talent they have now

They have no bonuses. They are below market year 2 now
.

i wouldn't mind having higher salary an NOBONUS

every year im so worried about hitting hours for BONUS and possibly ending up NOBONUS