DOJ Honors 2015-16 Megathread Forum

[Anonymous User]

what happens after being named a finalist? offers via phone only?

and if we're not getting an offer, we just stay at finalist forever like people stay at selected for interview forever?

[Nebby]

For the components that don't have a commitment requirement, does anyone have a sense of how long attorneys stay? Is transitioning out in 1-2 years not looked upon kindly?

Yeah, you probably don't want to do that. The only person I know that left after one year did so for a clerkship, and then went right back to their office.

[Anonymous User]

Has anyone who was designated as a finalist gotten an offer yet? I know OCIJ takes a while but I'm wondering how quickly others actually make calls. Probably staring at my phone for no reason.

I don't expect oral offers until after turkey break

is this for all components or just OCIJ?

[Anonymous User]

what happens after being named a finalist? offers via phone only?

and if we're not getting an offer, we just stay at finalist forever like people stay at selected for interview forever?

I think that's right. Except that once you become a finalist but don't get an offer right away (i.e. you're an alternate), then you could possibly get one 2 weeks later (the time at which offerees who have been out of law school 1 year or more have to respond to offers) or 29 days later (the time at which law school grads have to respond to offers). In other words, because "primaries" can only hold onto their offer for so long, there's a relatively limited amount of time before alternates would hear back if one of the primaries rejects an offer.

[Anonymous User]

finalists for criminal division trial attorneys are out. anyone get an offer yet? or am i misunderstanding how this works?

[Anonymous User]

Re: commitment - mine was a permanent position (wasn't designated as a two-year term or the like) and I was asked to commit 2 years. They can't enforce that (the other honors person hired when I was left after a year), but that's what they asked.

But I guess I'm not sure what the point of trying to lateral after 1-2 years is - you're still not going to know a ton about how to do your job at that point (certainly not at 1 year, still tons to learn at 2). So if you want to go somewhere related to your gov experience you'd probably want to stay somewhat longer. I guess it might depend on where you want to go and why?

(Re the other honors person who left - no one stopped her obv but I don't think anyone was at all impressed and I don't think she could draw on much goodwill from this office. Whether that matters in the future will totally depend on what else she wants to do.)

[Anonymous User]

what happens after being named a finalist? offers via phone only?

and if we're not getting an offer, we just stay at finalist forever like people stay at selected for interview forever?

I think that's right. Except that once you become a finalist but don't get an offer right away (i.e. you're an alternate), then you could possibly get one 2 weeks later (the time at which offerees who have been out of law school 1 year or more have to respond to offers) or 29 days later (the time at which law school grads have to respond to offers). In other words, because "primaries" can only hold onto their offer for so long, there's a relatively limited amount of time before alternates would hear back if one of the primaries rejects an offer.

Any phone calls for Civil/Fed Programs yet?

[Anonymous User]

what happens after being named a finalist? offers via phone only?

and if we're not getting an offer, we just stay at finalist forever like people stay at selected for interview forever?

I think that's right. Except that once you become a finalist but don't get an offer right away (i.e. you're an alternate), then you could possibly get one 2 weeks later (the time at which offerees who have been out of law school 1 year or more have to respond to offers) or 29 days later (the time at which law school grads have to respond to offers). In other words, because "primaries" can only hold onto their offer for so long, there's a relatively limited amount of time before alternates would hear back if one of the primaries rejects an offer.

She will also eventually post when each division has met their hiring goals, so if you were an alternate but the first rounds accepted you'll know.

[zor]

Re: commitment - mine was a permanent position (wasn't designated as a two-year term or the like) and I was asked to commit 2 years. They can't enforce that (the other honors person hired when I was left after a year), but that's what they asked.

But I guess I'm not sure what the point of trying to lateral after 1-2 years is - you're still not going to know a ton about how to do your job at that point (certainly not at 1 year, still tons to learn at 2). So if you want to go somewhere related to your gov experience you'd probably want to stay somewhat longer. I guess it might depend on where you want to go and why?

(Re the other honors person who left - no one stopped her obv but I don't think anyone was at all impressed and I don't think she could draw on much goodwill from this office. Whether that matters in the future will totally depend on what else she wants to do.)

Hmm. That's disappointing. I ask as part of a personal compromise scenario. My partner wants to go to grad school, which could be anywhere, so as much as I want to stay and learn at DOJ, I don't want my partner to have to put their career on hold for 4 years or whatever.

[Anonymous User]

what happens after being named a finalist? offers via phone only?

and if we're not getting an offer, we just stay at finalist forever like people stay at selected for interview forever?

I think that's right. Except that once you become a finalist but don't get an offer right away (i.e. you're an alternate), then you could possibly get one 2 weeks later (the time at which offerees who have been out of law school 1 year or more have to respond to offers) or 29 days later (the time at which law school grads have to respond to offers). In other words, because "primaries" can only hold onto their offer for so long, there's a relatively limited amount of time before alternates would hear back if one of the primaries rejects an offer.

She will also eventually post when each division has met their hiring goals, so if you were an alternate but the first rounds accepted you'll know.

got ya. but still a bit confused about when phone calls would come. i went to "finalist" this afternoon. when should i expect/not expect a call? like, no call today = worry? or does that vary by component?

[Anonymous User]

what happens after being named a finalist? offers via phone only?

and if we're not getting an offer, we just stay at finalist forever like people stay at selected for interview forever?

I think that's right. Except that once you become a finalist but don't get an offer right away (i.e. you're an alternate), then you could possibly get one 2 weeks later (the time at which offerees who have been out of law school 1 year or more have to respond to offers) or 29 days later (the time at which law school grads have to respond to offers). In other words, because "primaries" can only hold onto their offer for so long, there's a relatively limited amount of time before alternates would hear back if one of the primaries rejects an offer.

She will also eventually post when each division has met their hiring goals, so if you were an alternate but the first rounds accepted you'll know.

got ya. but still a bit confused about when phone calls would come. i went to "finalist" this afternoon. when should i expect/not expect a call? like, no call today = worry? or does that vary by component?

It varies by component for sure. If you are a finalist for a smaller component, then you might expect to hear sooner. They also need to contact references ideally first before they extend offers. I think with Thanksgiving next week it is going to push everything back a little.

[Anonymous User]

Re: finalists and timelines - I think in past years some OCIJ people ended up getting offers as late as January? Just because of the number of offers they make, and the geographical issues - you can get an offer for a location you didn't rank (I think) and people may be a bit likelier to turn those down, so it can all be in flux for a bit longer than the other components.

At least, I think that's how it worked in past years. No guarantee that will happen again.

[Anonymous User]

Re: commitment - mine was a permanent position (wasn't designated as a two-year term or the like) and I was asked to commit 2 years. They can't enforce that (the other honors person hired when I was left after a year), but that's what they asked.

But I guess I'm not sure what the point of trying to lateral after 1-2 years is - you're still not going to know a ton about how to do your job at that point (certainly not at 1 year, still tons to learn at 2). So if you want to go somewhere related to your gov experience you'd probably want to stay somewhat longer. I guess it might depend on where you want to go and why?

(Re the other honors person who left - no one stopped her obv but I don't think anyone was at all impressed and I don't think she could draw on much goodwill from this office. Whether that matters in the future will totally depend on what else she wants to do.)

Hmm. That's disappointing. I ask as part of a personal compromise scenario. My partner wants to go to grad school, which could be anywhere, so as much as I want to stay and learn at DOJ, I don't want my partner to have to put their career on hold for 4 years or whatever.

I think a lot would depend on what you transitioned to and how you presented it to your office. I think the honors positions are intended to be a pipeline into permanent gov work. If you had a compelling personal reason for a move, though, that's different from just wanting to try something else (or go make money at a firm). The person I spoke about who left just hated the job and did something else in the same city, and I think people were a just kind of disappointed in them - they don't wish them ill or anything like that, I think they just feel like they couldn't hack it or didn't have very good judgment about what they wanted.

But honestly I think lateraling anywhere after a year would be hard. There's a decently steep learning curve to being the person running your own cases, and a year is really not a long time. I've just done 2 years and I know a ton more than I did, but still feel pretty unqualified for other jobs.

[Anonymous User]

Re: finalists and timelines - I think in past years some OCIJ people ended up getting offers as late as January? Just because of the number of offers they make, and the geographical issues - you can get an offer for a location you didn't rank (I think) and people may be a bit likelier to turn those down, so it can all be in flux for a bit longer than the other components.

At least, I think that's how it worked in past years. No guarantee that will happen again.

That's what happened two years ago, but the government shutdown played a part.

[Anonymous User]

Re: finalists and timelines - I think in past years some OCIJ people ended up getting offers as late as January? Just because of the number of offers they make, and the geographical issues - you can get an offer for a location you didn't rank (I think) and people may be a bit likelier to turn those down, so it can all be in flux for a bit longer than the other components.

At least, I think that's how it worked in past years. No guarantee that will happen again.

That's what happened two years ago, but the government shutdown played a part.

No pretty sure that has how it has been every year. If you go back and look through Avue you can see when a component finished hiring and met it's goals. OCIJ is always going to be the last.

[Anonymous User]

any other crim finalists here? if so, anyone get a call yet?

[zor]

Re: commitment - mine was a permanent position (wasn't designated as a two-year term or the like) and I was asked to commit 2 years. They can't enforce that (the other honors person hired when I was left after a year), but that's what they asked.

But I guess I'm not sure what the point of trying to lateral after 1-2 years is - you're still not going to know a ton about how to do your job at that point (certainly not at 1 year, still tons to learn at 2). So if you want to go somewhere related to your gov experience you'd probably want to stay somewhat longer. I guess it might depend on where you want to go and why?

(Re the other honors person who left - no one stopped her obv but I don't think anyone was at all impressed and I don't think she could draw on much goodwill from this office. Whether that matters in the future will totally depend on what else she wants to do.)

Hmm. That's disappointing. I ask as part of a personal compromise scenario. My partner wants to go to grad school, which could be anywhere, so as much as I want to stay and learn at DOJ, I don't want my partner to have to put their career on hold for 4 years or whatever.

I think a lot would depend on what you transitioned to and how you presented it to your office. I think the honors positions are intended to be a pipeline into permanent gov work. If you had a compelling personal reason for a move, though, that's different from just wanting to try something else (or go make money at a firm). The person I spoke about who left just hated the job and did something else in the same city, and I think people were a just kind of disappointed in them - they don't wish them ill or anything like that, I think they just feel like they couldn't hack it or didn't have very good judgment about what they wanted.

But honestly I think lateraling anywhere after a year would be hard. There's a decently steep learning curve to being the person running your own cases, and a year is really not a long time. I've just done 2 years and I know a ton more than I did, but still feel pretty unqualified for other jobs.

Interesting. I am not worried about experience (I weirdly have a ton of it, both before and during law school, plus clerking), and would only take another job out of state for personal reasons.

Would you say that 3-4 years is more normal?

[Anonymous User]

Co-clerk just got an offer... Civil, not sure which component (she's still on phone)

[Anonymous User]

Co-clerk just got an offer... Civil, not sure which component (she's still on phone)

SWEET JESUS THANK YOU FOR THE UPDATE! Any other offers keep us posted!

And obviously congrats to your co-clerk!

[Anonymous User]

Co-clerk just got an offer... Civil, not sure which component (she's still on phone)

SWEET JESUS THANK YOU FOR THE UPDATE! Any other offers keep us posted!

Good to know. My phone is still dark and silent. Haha.

[Anonymous User]

Co-clerk just got an offer... Civil, not sure which component (she's still on phone)

oh, woah. you two have dueling HP applications? that sounds stressful

[Anonymous User]

Co-clerk just got an offer... Civil, not sure which component (she's still on phone)

SWEET JESUS THANK YOU FOR THE UPDATE! Any other offers keep us posted!

Good to know. My phone is still dark and silent. Haha.

My status changed yesterday and I accomplished nothing today. My Mom called and I almost lost it. It's brutal. My SLIP offer last year came on a Saturday so the weekend doesn't even give me peace. Sorry, just needed to vent.

[Anonymous User]

Co-clerk just got an offer... Civil, not sure which component (she's still on phone)

SWEET JESUS THANK YOU FOR THE UPDATE! Any other offers keep us posted!

Good to know. My phone is still dark and silent. Haha.

My status changed yesterday and I accomplished nothing today. My Mom called and I almost lost it. It's brutal. My SLIP offer last year came on a Saturday so the weekend doesn't even give me peace. Sorry, just needed to vent.

noooooo, why'd you tell us that about the weeeeeekend?!?!?!

[Anonymous User]

Co-clerk just got an offer... Civil, not sure which component (she's still on phone)

SWEET JESUS THANK YOU FOR THE UPDATE! Any other offers keep us posted!

Good to know. My phone is still dark and silent. Haha.

My status changed yesterday and I accomplished nothing today. My Mom called and I almost lost it. It's brutal. My SLIP offer last year came on a Saturday so the weekend doesn't even give me peace. Sorry, just needed to vent.

noooooo, why'd you tell us that about the weeeeeekend?!?!?!

GAHHH I'M SORRY! It was BOP I doubt that applies anywhere else.

[Anonymous User]

Co-clerk just got an offer... Civil, not sure which component (she's still on phone)

SWEET JESUS THANK YOU FOR THE UPDATE! Any other offers keep us posted!

Good to know. My phone is still dark and silent. Haha.

My status changed yesterday and I accomplished nothing today. My Mom called and I almost lost it. It's brutal. My SLIP offer last year came on a Saturday so the weekend doesn't even give me peace. Sorry, just needed to vent.

noooooo, why'd you tell us that about the weeeeeekend?!?!?!

GAHHH I'M SORRY! It was BOP I doubt that applies anywhere else.

haha, good save! thanks, and good luck to everyone.