2012 UVA OGI Thread Forum

[Anonymous User]

As others have noted, I don't think order is particularly important for you. I would be a little surprised if you actually got 23 preselects right off the bat, however. What is more likely is that enough of your alternates will turn into preselects to put you close to 20-23 such that your order matters little.

A distinction, but an important one to try to reduce widespread panic when they release preselects initially.

Ty. How many alternates does a firm generally select?

[Law Sauce]

Can anyone confirm if Sidley's offices make hiring decisions independent of each other, like Skadden's offices do?

[5ky]

As others have noted, I don't think order is particularly important for you. I would be a little surprised if you actually got 23 preselects right off the bat, however. What is more likely is that enough of your alternates will turn into preselects to put you close to 20-23 such that your order matters little.

A distinction, but an important one to try to reduce widespread panic when they release preselects initially.

Ty. How many alternates does a firm generally select?

I actually am not really sure. Quite a few, I would think.

[Anonymous User]

For firms with multiple offices where the recruiting contact is not in the market you bid on, are the preselect decisions made by one office or does the firm confer with the other offices before deciding on who to pick?

[Anonymous User]

"Firms that only have one room can only preselect like 12 students (not sure what preselect:lottery ratio UVA is using this year), so if there are any firms that you have a special desire to interview with that have only one or two rooms, put them high since you may not be preselected despite your grades. Other than that, bidding order basically doesn't matter. I'd say the only NYC firms that are reaches are Cravath and S&C. You probably don't have a chance at Cravath, but if S&C is what you really want, they're still worth using an interview on."

How do we determine how many students any one particular firm is able to preselect?

[dixon02]

"Firms that only have one room can only preselect like 12 students (not sure what preselect:lottery ratio UVA is using this year), so if there are any firms that you have a special desire to interview with that have only one or two rooms, put them high since you may not be preselected despite your grades. Other than that, bidding order basically doesn't matter. I'd say the only NYC firms that are reaches are Cravath and S&C. You probably don't have a chance at Cravath, but if S&C is what you really want, they're still worth using an interview on."

How do we determine how many students any one particular firm is able to preselect?

Pretty sure the OGI doc that CSO sent out has this. I believe it's 70% of slots can be pre-selected (which would obviously mean 14 out of 20 slots). Not positive, but check the OGI doc.

[Gecko of Doom]

"Firms that only have one room can only preselect like 12 students (not sure what preselect:lottery ratio UVA is using this year), so if there are any firms that you have a special desire to interview with that have only one or two rooms, put them high since you may not be preselected despite your grades. Other than that, bidding order basically doesn't matter. I'd say the only NYC firms that are reaches are Cravath and S&C. You probably don't have a chance at Cravath, but if S&C is what you really want, they're still worth using an interview on."

How do we determine how many students any one particular firm is able to preselect?

Look at the firm chart Career Services sent out. It says how many interview slots each firm has. Firms get to preselect 70% of interviewees. So firms with 20 slots get to preselect 14 students.

Edit: looks like dixon beat me to it.

[Anonymous User]

Ok, tentative bidlist here. 3.45-3.46, K-JD. More interested in Dallas and LA than NY, but limited ties. My concern is that my top 20 may be a bit overly ambitious, but I'd appreciate any thoughts. All offices are NY unless otherwise specified.

1. Sidley Austin
2. Chadbourne & Parke
3. Kasowitz
4. Fried Frank
5. Milbank
6. Weil
7. Latham (LA)
8. Haynes & Boone (Dallas)
9. Willkie
10. Baker Botts (Dallas)
11. MoFo (LA)
12. Schulte, Roth & Zabel
13. O'Melveny (Century City)
14. Cadwalader
15. Akin Gump
16. Skadden
17. DPW
18. K&L Gates (Dallas)
19. Fulbright & Jaworski (Dallas)
20. Stroock
21. Simpson, Thacher & Bartlett
22. Vinson & Elkins (Dallas)
23. Cahill
24. White & Case
25. Winston & Strawn (LA)
26. Dechert
27. Proskauer
28. Shearman & Sterling
29. King & Spalding
30. Katten Muchin Rosenman
31. Orrick
32. Pillsbury
33. Paul Hastings
34. WilmerHale
35. Alston & Bird
36. Baker Hostetler
37. Andrews Kurth (Dallas)
38. Morgan Lewis
39. Seward & Kissel
40. Curtis, Mallet-Prevost, Colt & Mosle
41. Venable
42. Mayer Brown
43. Brown Rudnick
44. Carrington Coleman (Dallas)

Bumping this one last time before the deadline.

[5ky]

I suspect you will initially not have a ton of preselects*, so you will want to make sure that your top 10 have the greatest overlap of (1) firms you are interested in, and (2) firms you have a decent shot at. I think it looks pretty good in terms of (2), but obviously it is up to you as to whether (1) applies as well. If so,

* (i.e. not close to hitting the 23 limit). You will benefit from (x) the trickle-down, where alternates turn into preselects, (y) the lottery and (z) special requests/hospitality suites. You should have plenty of interviews after that whole process. But it will not happen all at once, and will take a while to fully develop.

I keep harping on this just so people don't flip out when preselects are released like we all did last year.

[Anonymous User]

3.52 GPA, Law Review, and some relevant work experience. I'm interested in litigation. I'll probably put a few of the firms more in line with my GPA in the top 10 (in case I do end up needing the lottery for some interviews), but I want to get the right 50 worrying about that.

Listed in rough order of reach-safety.
Davis, Polk, Wardwell NYC
Debovoise & Plimpton NYC
Gibson Dunn DC
Latham Watkins DC
Simpson Thatcher Bartlett NYC
hogan lovells DC
Skadden DC

Sutherland Asbill & Brennan DC
Cahill Gordon Reindel NYC
Alston Bird DC
K & L Gates DC
Winston & Stawn DC

Allen & Overy DC
Weil, Goshal, and Manges NYC
Paul Hastings DC
Patton Boggs DC
clifford chance NYC
Crowell & Moring DC
Dechert DC
Jones Day Atlanta

Venable DC
White & Case NYC
Baker Botts DC
Dickstein Shapiro DC
Bingham McCutchen DC
McKenna Long & Aldridge DC
Kasowitz, Benson, Torres, & Friedman NYC
dla piper DC
Foley & Lardner DC
Kilpatrick, Townsend Atlanta
King & Spalding NYC
Sidley Austin NYC
Akin Gump NYC
Katten Muchin Rosenman NYC
Orrick DC
Troutman Sanders DC

Baker Hostetler DC
Mayer Brown NYC
Bracewell Giuliani DC
Drinker Biddle & Reath DC
Hunton & Williams NYC
Keller and Heckman DC
Linklaters NYC
Morgan Lewis Bockius NYC
Pillsbury Winthrow Shaw Pittman DC
Reed Smith DC
Seward DC
+1 in my hometown

Insufficient info- Jenner & Block DC

[Anonymous User]

I don't want to doubt your information, but are you sure about Jenner & Block DC having a less than 3.4 GPA. Very, very few UVA people have ever gone to Jenner DC and, in general, Jenner DC attracts high in the class liberals.

Also, I noticed some Atlanta firms - do you have a connection/are you from the south?

-'12 Grad

[Anonymous User]

Sorry, Jenner & Block was an accident. That is a firm for which CS has insufficient GPA info.

[Anonymous User]

Also, no ties to Atlanta/the South. I thought I might try with two bids because I'd like to work in ATL.

[Anonymous User]

Your reaches are mostly inaccurate. I know a VLR write-on with grades lower than yours who got offers at Latham and Hogan (DC) last year, and I know multiple students with 3.5ish GPAs who weren't on VLR and ended up at Skadden and Simpson (NY). DPW is a slight reach but certainly worth a bid. Cravath and S&C are probably the only NY firms you shouldn't bother with, and Covington, GDC, and W&C are probably the only DC firms to avoid (but you might consider GDC's NY office).

Career service's info on NY firms with huge summer classes that make lots of callbacks and offers is probably reliable, but for DC firms, which generally have much smaller classes and thus make fewer callbacks and offers, there's way too small a sample size for the data to be of much use. Likewise for the smaller NYC offices. I'm almost positive that the four DC "slight reaches" are not reaches at all.

[Anonymous User]

3.62 poster from above... curious what TLS's thoughts are on my current bid list. For what it's worth, KD has described my WE as "above average."

NY unless otherwise noted. Thanks for any feedback.

Latham & Watkins
Cleary, Gottlieb, Steen & Hamilton
Ropes & Gray
Weil, Gotshal & Manges
Gibson, Dunn & Crutcher
hogan lovells US LLP (McLean, VA)
Reed Smith (Falls Church, VA)
Holland & Knight (McLean, VA)
Alston & Bird
Chadbourne & Parke
Davis Polk & Wardwell
Debevoise & Plimpton
Hunton & Williams (Richmond, VA)
Akin Gump Strauss Hauer & Feld
Allen & Overy
Baker & McKenzie
Baker Hostetler
Boies, Schiller & Flexner
Cadwalader, Wickersham & Taft
Cahill, Gordon & Reindel
cooley llp (Reston, VA)
Covington & Burling LLP
Foley & Lardner
Fulbright & Jaworski
Hirschler Fleischer (Richmond, VA)
Jones Day
King & Spalding
Kasowitz Benson Torres & Friedman LLP
Linklaters
mcguirewoods (Richmond, VA)
Nixon Peabody
Paul, Hastings, Janofsky & Walker
Paul, Weiss, Rifkind, Wharton & Garrison
Orrick, Herrington & Sutcliffe
Proskauer Rose
Pillsbury Winthrop Shaw Pittman (McLean, VA)
Schulte Roth & Zabel
Shearman & Sterling
Shipman & Goodwin (Stamford, CT)
Sidley Austin
Simpson Thacher & Bartlett
Skadden, Arps, Slate, Meagher & Flom
Sullivan & Cromwell LLP
Troutman Sanders (Richmond, VA)
Venable (Vienna, VA)
White & Case
williams mullen (Richmond, VA)
WilmerHale
Willkie Farr & Gallagher LLP

[Anonymous User]

3.62 poster from above... curious what TLS's thoughts are on my current bid list. For what it's worth, KD has described my WE as "above average."

NY unless otherwise noted. Thanks for any feedback.

Looks fine. Of the NY V10, you should get multiple offers unless you interview poorly. I assume you have VA ties or otherwise have a good reason for considering interviewing at all those VA firms.

[Anonymous User]

Your reaches are mostly inaccurate. I know a VLR write-on with grades lower than yours who got offers at Latham and Hogan (DC) last year, and I know multiple students with 3.5ish GPAs who weren't on VLR and ended up at Skadden and Simpson (NY). DPW is a slight reach but certainly worth a bid. Cravath and S&C are probably the only NY firms you shouldn't bother with, and Covington, GDC, and W&C are probably the only DC firms to avoid (but you might consider GDC's NY office).

Career service's info on NY firms with huge summer classes that make lots of callbacks and offers is probably reliable, but for DC firms, which generally have much smaller classes and thus make fewer callbacks and offers, there's way too small a sample size for the data to be of much use. Likewise for the smaller NYC offices. I'm almost positive that the four DC "slight reaches" are not reaches at all.

I know for a fact you are well within the range for GDC NY, however that office is very personality focused, so it's pretty random.

[PlessFightsFire]

.

[Anonymous User]

3.61, one year of average work experience and nothing else too impressive. Want corp. Is S&C NY a wasted (or practically wasted) bid? Cant decide if I want them off.

[Law Sauce]

Any helpyou would be willing to give would be much appreciated!

Call Dean Donovan during his hours tomorrow. He is the best source of info.

[Anonymous User]

3.61, one year of average work experience and nothing else too impressive. Want corp. Is S&C NY a wasted (or practically wasted) bid? Cant decide if I want them off.

Not a wasted bid. Know 2-3 people that were hired with similar GPAs last year.

[PlessFightsFire]

Any helpyou would be willing to give would be much appreciated!

Call Dean Donovan during his hours tomorrow. He is the best source of info.

I've spoken with him and will, with my accelerated timeline for putting this together I'm trying to get as much help as possible.

[Law Sauce]

Any helpyou would be willing to give would be much appreciated!

Call Dean Donovan during his hours tomorrow. He is the best source of info.

I've spoken with him and will, with my accelerated timeline for putting this together I'm trying to get as much help as possible.

Ok well, if you are like a 3.4, Sidley Chicago is a big reach (coming from Illinois it may be worth it), Cleary is also a big reach. Think about taking these two off and you look good. Also, with respect to order, you should probably move smaller markets and offices, such as your Boston firms, up to the 5-15 range because your not gonna get much in NY via the lottery below about #5 (beside more selective places like cleary). I.e. Morgan Lewis through White & Case at 10-13 have zero chance of getting the lottery (if the firm has one room, there are only 6 lottery spots, if two then 12, and those firms are heavily bid so there are going to be more than 12 people bidding then at #9 or higher).

[Anonymous User]

3.61, one year of average work experience and nothing else too impressive. Want corp. Is S&C NY a wasted (or practically wasted) bid? Cant decide if I want them off.

Not a wasted bid. Know 2-3 people that were hired with similar GPAs last year.

Great, thanks!

[Anonymous User]

Are people individualizing cover letters for Symplicity?