ITT: Summer Associates Post About Their Anxiety (2012) Forum

[Detrox]

Disagree with the above. Mention that you are in training, but do not say you cannot do the work. I know of summers at multiple firms who were pulled out during orientation to start a major project that was moving quickly. Tell your orientation advisors or staff or whatever so that they can advise the partners not to give you the work if its not urgent, but do not flat turn it down. Orientation is less important than you think.

[fl0w]

Disagree with the above. Mention that you are in training, but do not say you cannot do the work. I know of summers at multiple firms who were pulled out during orientation to start a major project that was moving quickly. Tell your orientation advisors or staff or whatever so that they can advise the partners not to give you the work if its not urgent, but do not flat turn it down. Orientation is less important than you think.

yeah, don't say "no"
in general "i'd love to and here's what's on my plate" is a response that i've been told is good.
Then partner can decide if you are too busy.

I like what detrox said about letting the orientation people know.
But hey I start on Tuesday. some of y'all are a whole week or two more experienced than I am.

[Anonymous User]

What is everyone's workload like. I'm only getting enough to take up half my day. Normal?

Interested to hear responses.

5 projects this week, maybe 3 of them being pretty substantial. I would say it takes up half of my day, but I've also been going on 90-minute lunches, and constantly get pulled out of the office for small things/trips to the watercooler/etc.

[Stanford4Me]

If my suggestion wasn't obvious that I wasn't saying no, but was letting the attorney decide whether to keep the project with me, then don't use it.

[Anonymous User]

What is everyone's workload like. I'm only getting enough to take up half my day. Normal?

Interested to hear responses.

The projects I was assigned have been killer. First one was a SEC data survey that took ~40 hours. The second one will take about 20 with about 6 hours or so just devoted to understanding the topic. I go out with attorneys at lunch, and go to all the social events after work, but during the day I'm working my ass off. Hopefully the next few assignments will be a little more chill.

I'm starting next week and I'm kind of nervous about this. I haven't taken Securities Reg or M&A yet. Would I be woefully under-qualified if I was assigned a project like that?

[fl0w]

has anyone in this thread started work at in IP firm? Seems like everyone here is M&A, SecReg, etc.

[fatduck]

has anyone in this thread started work at in IP firm? Seems like everyone here is M&A, SecReg, etc.

i'm at an IP firm. not a big one, though. <100 attorneys.

[Stanford4Me]

What is everyone's workload like. I'm only getting enough to take up half my day. Normal?

Interested to hear responses.

The projects I was assigned have been killer. First one was a SEC data survey that took ~40 hours. The second one will take about 20 with about 6 hours or so just devoted to understanding the topic. I go out with attorneys at lunch, and go to all the social events after work, but during the day I'm working my ass off. Hopefully the next few assignments will be a little more chill.

I'm starting next week and I'm kind of nervous about this. I haven't taken Securities Reg or M&A yet. Would I be woefully under-qualified if I was assigned a project like that?

You'll just have to do background research. If the partner/assigning attorney is a decent human being they'll give you some assistance on where to look.

I got an SEC Lit assignment today involving new legislation, and the first thin the partner did was hand me a huge stack of paperwork to read through.

[fl0w]

has anyone in this thread started work at in IP firm? Seems like everyone here is M&A, SecReg, etc.

i'm at an IP firm. not a big one, though. <100 attorneys.

so at IP firm i can expect to say yes to offers of daytime booze and not using westlaw at all?
What do I bill that under in the excel spreadsheet?

Srsly though, you been pretty busy? What the days been like, etc.?

[fatduck]

has anyone in this thread started work at in IP firm? Seems like everyone here is M&A, SecReg, etc.

i'm at an IP firm. not a big one, though. <100 attorneys.

so at IP firm i can expect to say yes to offers of daytime booze and not using westlaw at all?
What do I bill that under in the excel spreadsheet?

Srsly though, you been pretty busy? What the days been like, etc.?

working 9-6, pretty busy. billing about 7 hrs a day. i'm the only SA so i'm definitely not hurting for work. so far i've just done prosecution - mostly office actions, though i am doing one app from scratch and one conversion from provisional.

usually they'll give me an office action and tell me to draft an amendment, and then do a telephone interview w/ the examiner, propose the amendments, revise based on the interview. lots of latitude on the apps - on one of them the inventor is no longer with the company so they told me to basically invent some shit myself, and the other one i've been emailing/calling the client with minimal supervision.

taking on a litigation project starting tomorrow, so maybe i'll have to crack open westlaw for the first time

[Anonymous User]

I start tuesday with a large firm, in a small office (less than 50 attorneys in the office). I'm the only SA - in fact - the first SA this office has had in several years. If anyone has any advice or insight on how this situation may be different from the experiences discussed above - I'd love to hear it.

Also, the firm is business casual, when I interviewed, most people were wearing jeans (it was a friday). I really think a suit would be overkill, I was thinking about wearing a tie and blazer though - is this the right move? (I know this issue has been beat to death, but now that many of you started your SA's, additional insight would be great).

Thanks.

[Stanford4Me]

Also, the firm is business casual, when I interviewed, most people were wearing jeans (it was a friday). I really think a suit would be overkill, I was thinking about wearing a tie and blazer though - is this the right move? (I know this issue has been beat to death, but now that many of you started you SA's, additional insight would be great).

Thanks.

E-mail your contact at the firm and ask (there's no snark in this).

[Mitch McDeere]

How many hours does a SA bill in an average day? Has anyone been told what they are expected to bill during the summer?

[Anonymous User]

I start tuesday with a large firm, in a small office (less than 50 attorneys in the office). I'm the only SA - in fact - the first SA this office has had in several years. If anyone has any advice or insight on how this situation may be different from the experiences discussed above - I'd love to hear it.

Thanks.

This is my exact situation. I posted earlier about already having 5 assignments in the first week but 2 were softballs. I love being in a smaller office with national resources - small town feel with bigger city work. My firm is also business casual and I did suit the first day and business casual the rest of the week.

The week started busy then slowed after I finished 3 of the 5 projects. As to someone earlier asking about getting assignments during orientation - I got 2 before lunch on my first day but didn't have to start on them till the next day.

My first week I billed just under 3 on Tuesday, 6.5 on Wednesday, 5.5 on Thursday, and 3 today. Went to lunch every day and did 3 "practical" experience things with attorneys heading out of the office. Did not expect, and do not expect, to have that much free time as everyone begins to realize there is an SA for the first time in like 2 years that can do projects.

Being the only SA at a smaller office for a large firm is good and bad. It is good in that you are going to do tons of (substantive) work for a bunch of different departments and will get loads of face time with all of the lawyers. It is bad in that you are going to do tons of (substantive) work and it will likely get busy. But, the good very much outweighs the bad. I get all the attention that would otherwise be parsed out between the other SAs.

[Anonymous User]

I start tuesday with a large firm, in a small office (less than 50 attorneys in the office). I'm the only SA - in fact - the first SA this office has had in several years. If anyone has any advice or insight on how this situation may be different from the experiences discussed above - I'd love to hear it.

Thanks.

This is my exact situation. I posted earlier about already having 5 assignments in the first week but 2 were softballs. I love being in a smaller office with national resources - small town feel with bigger city work. My firm is also business casual and I did suit the first day and business casual the rest of the week.

The week started busy then slowed after I finished 3 of the 5 projects. As to someone earlier asking about getting assignments during orientation - I got 2 before lunch on my first day but didn't have to start on them till the next day.

My first week I billed just under 3 on Tuesday, 6.5 on Wednesday, 5.5 on Thursday, and 3 today. Went to lunch every day and did 3 "practical" experience things with attorneys heading out of the office. Did not expect, and do not expect, to have that much free time as everyone begins to realize there is an SA for the first time in like 2 years that can do projects.

Being the only SA at a smaller office for a large firm is good and bad. It is good in that you are going to do tons of (substantive) work for a bunch of different departments and will get loads of face time with all of the lawyers. It is bad in that you are going to do tons of (substantive) work and it will likely get busy. But, the good very much outweighs the bad. I get all the attention that would otherwise be parsed out between the other SAs.

Thanks! That's very encouraging! I really appreciate it!

[Anonymous User]

What is everyone's workload like. I'm only getting enough to take up half my day. Normal?

Interested to hear responses.

The projects I was assigned have been killer. First one was a SEC data survey that took ~40 hours. The second one will take about 20 with about 6 hours or so just devoted to understanding the topic. I go out with attorneys at lunch, and go to all the social events after work, but during the day I'm working my ass off. Hopefully the next few assignments will be a little more chill.

I'm starting next week and I'm kind of nervous about this. I haven't taken Securities Reg or M&A yet. Would I be woefully under-qualified if I was assigned a project like that?

I have yet to take securities as well, so I spent the whole first day of the assignment getting comfortable with the terminology and understanding the concepts I was supposed to identify. I'm definitely behind the other SAs in terms of completed work because of my first two beastly assignments, but I figure it will eventually even out.

[Detrox]

How many hours does a SA bill in an average day? Has anyone been told what they are expected to bill during the summer?

Going to depend on the firm. One firm I know of has a 20 hr/week billable target. Others say there is no target at all but you can tell there is an unspoken one. Still others say they have no target and really mean it, as long as you are decently busy you're fine. Feel free to ask your orientation people, they won't lie to you.

[Ludo!]

Just finished my first week and basically all my anxiety is gone. I get along with all the summers, the staff is great, attorneys are nice so far and fun at social events. My firm is really laid back and I've been out by 6 every day so far. They've said there might be some late nights but said for summers they won't be often. Lunches so far have been awesome. I get my own office with my name on the door and the view is pretty decent. Feels good to finally get a little bit of a reward after two years of shit in law school.

That said, turned in my first assignment today and the real work starts next week. I might go right back to being anxious.

[Anonymous User]

Has anybody else been following the rule of referring to partners as "Mr. X" or "Ms. X" until it seems like you can do otherwise (for example, they sign off an email as "John" or "Jane," explicitly tell you to go ahead and call them "John" or "Jane," or call you and say something like "Hi Sam, this is John")? I've been doing this and one partner sort of made me look like an idiot for still referring to him as "Mr. X." (FWIW, I've been at my firm for about a week and only had a couple brief conversations with that partner before that.)

[Anonymous User]

Has anybody else been following the rule of referring to partners as "Mr. X" or "Ms. X" until it seems like you can do otherwise (for example, they sign off an email as "John" or "Jane," explicitly tell you to go ahead and call them "John" or "Jane," or call you and say something like "Hi Sam, this is John")? I've been doing this and one partner sort of made me look like an idiot for still referring to him as "Mr. X." (FWIW, I've been at my firm for about a week and only had a couple brief conversations with that partner before that.)

Dude, it's fine. Nobody is going to fault you for being conservative in this profession.

[Mitch McDeere]

Has anybody else been following the rule of referring to partners as "Mr. X" or "Ms. X" until it seems like you can do otherwise (for example, they sign off an email as "John" or "Jane," explicitly tell you to go ahead and call them "John" or "Jane," or call you and say something like "Hi Sam, this is John")? I've been doing this and one partner sort of made me look like an idiot for still referring to him as "Mr. X." (FWIW, I've been at my firm for about a week and only had a couple brief conversations with that partner before that.)

Dude, it's fine. Nobody is going to fault you for being conservative in this profession.

I had absolutely no intentions of ever calling any of the partners anything but their first names before reading this. Do people really call them Mr./Ms. X?

[DreamsInDigital]

Has anybody else been following the rule of referring to partners as "Mr. X" or "Ms. X" until it seems like you can do otherwise (for example, they sign off an email as "John" or "Jane," explicitly tell you to go ahead and call them "John" or "Jane," or call you and say something like "Hi Sam, this is John")? I've been doing this and one partner sort of made me look like an idiot for still referring to him as "Mr. X." (FWIW, I've been at my firm for about a week and only had a couple brief conversations with that partner before that.)

Dude, it's fine. Nobody is going to fault you for being conservative in this profession.

I had absolutely no intentions of ever calling any of the partners anything but their first names before reading this. Do people really call them Mr./Ms. X?

This is how I feel after reading that question.

[sparty99]

Why the hell would you call them, "Mr. _________?"

Clearly, this is your first job and they won't take you seriously. First name basis only.

[stratocophic]

Has anybody else been following the rule of referring to partners as "Mr. X" or "Ms. X" until it seems like you can do otherwise (for example, they sign off an email as "John" or "Jane," explicitly tell you to go ahead and call them "John" or "Jane," or call you and say something like "Hi Sam, this is John")? I've been doing this and one partner sort of made me look like an idiot for still referring to him as "Mr. X." (FWIW, I've been at my firm for about a week and only had a couple brief conversations with that partner before that.)

Dude, it's fine. Nobody is going to fault you for being conservative in this profession.

I had absolutely no intentions of ever calling any of the partners anything but their first names before reading this. Do people really call them Mr./Ms. X?

This is how I feel after reading that question.

If your firm is laid back, they'll think you're weird if you're overly formal. The ragging from partners I've worked with would be merciless if I was formal with them.

[Anonymous User]

I've held various white collar jobs for 15+ years and I have never, ever called anyone at work by anything other than their first name, including corporate executives, and partners at interviews and legal jobs like this SA. I don't intend to ever work at a place where that would be different, if I can help it.

I took a class last semester thought by a local superstar attorney. On the last day of class, he gave us some advice for our careers, and this was one of them: do not call other lawyers by Mr./Mrs. So fuck this shit.

I read this thread and I feel SO lucky to be SAing at my firm.