The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls) Forum

[mr. wednesday]

PAYE is a lifesaver. My payments will be like $100 a month for the first few months, which should help offset the not being employed thing.

Why is it anything? If you're not making over 150% of the poverty level, you shouldn't have any payment due.

[kalvano]

Married filing jointly. We end up saving money that way with mortgage interest and whatnot.

[mr. wednesday]

Oh that makes sense.

[Lwoods]

Any Spanish-speaking do-gooders who are admitted to a bar and want to move to SoCal? I just came across this posting:

The Immigration Center for Women and Children (ICWC) seeks a full-time staff attorney in the San Diego office. ICWC is a non-profit legal organization providing affordable immigration services to underrepresented women and children in California. ICWC strives to provide security and stability for children who are abused, abandoned or neglected and for women and children who are victims of domestic violence, sexual assault and other violent crimes.

Duties and Responsibilities:

The attorney will work with other attorneys and legal assistants in a small, busy non-profit. The attorney will be responsible for providing direct immigration legal services, outreach and education to victims of domestic violence, sexual assault and other violent crimes. Duties include: conducting client intake, case assessment, ongoing case management, researching and drafting legal documents and attending court hearings. The attorney will work collaboratively with social service and law enforcement agencies and conduct outreach to the community about ICWC services. The attorney will primarily work with providing relief under the Violence Against Women Act (VAWA), the U visa, Special Immigrant Juvenile Status (SIJS) and Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA). The attorney will also supervise law students and other volunteers.

Qualifications:

Juris Doctorate and active bar admission (California preferred but not required)
One to three years immigration law practice with VAWA and U visa experience preferred
Strong writing skills and a meticulous attention to detail
Oral and written Spanish language fluency required

A demonstrated interest in low-income legal services and/or a commitment to civil liberties and immigrants' rights
Ability to work effectively with victims of domestic violence and sexual assault
Ability to work effectively and communicate with law enforcement, representatives of government and English/Spanish media

[jarofsoup]

I am getting rather depressed about this entire process. Constant rejection even though I have good grades, and good work experience.

Any advice on how to keep spirits up? Just reading every weekend and working my ass off interning feels like it adds insult to injury.

[Anonymous User]

First time poster here... I am sure everyone has their sob story, but I figured I'd get mine out there. I am top 15%, LR Board at a t-35 school. I split 2L summer with a mid-law corp firm (that has a history of bringing on their summers and pays well above market) and a state court judge (b/c I wanted some court experience). I was told all throughout the summer great things about working with the firm, but, lo and behold, I just found out yesterday that firm has hit bad financial times and isn't able to extend offers to any of the summer associates. Needless to say, this has took me by surprise. I got the whole "call us for a recommendation" and "great work product" spiel, but I am irritated that they didn't tell us sooner.

I know this means it is time to hustle, and that doesn't bother me, but I just don't know where to hustle towards. I really want tax law (which has me thinking LLM as a fall back) but I also enjoy corp/ transactional work and healthcare law. I am particularly interested in working in the SE, but that isn't a requirement. I know there are things out there, I guess I am just looking for support and ideas for how to get out there... This, for lack of a better term, blows...

[Broseidon]

Is it completely unreasonable to feel a bit of, I don't know, annoyance towards 3Ls with offers deferring to do a clerkship? Not that they're taking away jobs I would have gotten, but I'm sure there are some no-offered dudes who could have gotten them and would have benefited from it much more.

[mr. wednesday]

Is it completely unreasonable to feel a bit of, I don't know, annoyance towards 3Ls with offers deferring to do a clerkship? Not that they're taking away jobs I would have gotten, but I'm sure there are some no-offered dudes who could have gotten them and would have benefited from it much more.

I think if the firm has actually need, they might hire a 3L to start in place of the clerking 3L, then reduce next year's 2L summer class by a spot. If the firm doesn't have need, deferring an offer to clerk might prevent later starting dates or additional no offers for their co-summers. Either way, I don't think someone who is clerking is taking away another 3L's spot.

[ilovesf]

Any Spanish-speaking do-gooders who are admitted to a bar and want to move to SoCal? I just came across this posting:

The Immigration Center for Women and Children (ICWC) seeks a full-time staff attorney in the San Diego office. ICWC is a non-profit legal organization providing affordable immigration services to underrepresented women and children in California. ICWC strives to provide security and stability for children who are abused, abandoned or neglected and for women and children who are victims of domestic violence, sexual assault and other violent crimes.

Duties and Responsibilities:

The attorney will work with other attorneys and legal assistants in a small, busy non-profit. The attorney will be responsible for providing direct immigration legal services, outreach and education to victims of domestic violence, sexual assault and other violent crimes. Duties include: conducting client intake, case assessment, ongoing case management, researching and drafting legal documents and attending court hearings. The attorney will work collaboratively with social service and law enforcement agencies and conduct outreach to the community about ICWC services. The attorney will primarily work with providing relief under the Violence Against Women Act (VAWA), the U visa, Special Immigrant Juvenile Status (SIJS) and Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA). The attorney will also supervise law students and other volunteers.

Qualifications:

Juris Doctorate and active bar admission (California preferred but not required)
One to three years immigration law practice with VAWA and U visa experience preferred
Strong writing skills and a meticulous attention to detail
Oral and written Spanish language fluency required

A demonstrated interest in low-income legal services and/or a commitment to civil liberties and immigrants' rights
Ability to work effectively with victims of domestic violence and sexual assault
Ability to work effectively and communicate with law enforcement, representatives of government and English/Spanish media

Thanks for posting this! This is exactly the kind of job I want and I've been seeing so many postings like this, but they are all for people who already have 1 year of experience.

I keep seeing job postings in the Bay Area, which is super encouraging, but they are all in totally different practice areas. There are actually a ton for things like tax, ugh.

[rad lulz]

First time poster here... I am sure everyone has their sob story, but I figured I'd get mine out there. I am top 15%, LR Board at a t-35 school. I split 2L summer with a mid-law corp firm (that has a history of bringing on their summers and pays well above market) and a state court judge (b/c I wanted some court experience). I was told all throughout the summer great things about working with the firm, but, lo and behold, I just found out yesterday that firm has hit bad financial times and isn't able to extend offers to any of the summer associates. Needless to say, this has took me by surprise. I got the whole "call us for a recommendation" and "great work product" spiel, but I am irritated that they didn't tell us sooner.

I know this means it is time to hustle, and that doesn't bother me, but I just don't know where to hustle towards. I really want tax law (which has me thinking LLM as a fall back) but I also enjoy corp/ transactional work and healthcare law. I am particularly interested in working in the SE, but that isn't a requirement. I know there are things out there, I guess I am just looking for support and ideas for how to get out there... This, for lack of a better term, blows...

First thing id do is get some people you know at your old firm to make some introductions around town at firms with similar practices

[AllTheLawz]

Is it completely unreasonable to feel a bit of, I don't know, annoyance towards 3Ls with offers deferring to do a clerkship? Not that they're taking away jobs I would have gotten, but I'm sure there are some no-offered dudes who could have gotten them and would have benefited from it much more.

Yes, it is completely unreasonable. Firms take deferring for clerkships into account when they predict their hiring needs. Often, they even encourage litigation SAs to pursue clerkships and have clerkship panels throughout the summer.

In fact, if a number of people who were expected didn't get clerkships it would actually reduce immediate hiring need for the next year (although over time it would smooth out).

[Anonymous User]

Is it completely unreasonable to feel a bit of, I don't know, annoyance towards 3Ls with offers deferring to do a clerkship? Not that they're taking away jobs I would have gotten, but I'm sure there are some no-offered dudes who could have gotten them and would have benefited from it much more.

People who got no offered would, for most fed clerkships but of course not all, had to have been pursuing them prior to knowing whether they got an offer or not. So both people with offers and those without were in competition for clerkships before anybody knew who got a clerkship and who got an offer. That said, most people who do biglaw (whether they get an offer or not) don't have a great shot at clerkships.

[Pokemon]

Is it completely unreasonable to feel a bit of, I don't know, annoyance towards 3Ls with offers deferring to do a clerkship? Not that they're taking away jobs I would have gotten, but I'm sure there are some no-offered dudes who could have gotten them and would have benefited from it much more.

Unreasonable bro...

[typ3]

First time poster here... I am sure everyone has their sob story, but I figured I'd get mine out there. I am top 15%, LR Board at a t-35 school. I split 2L summer with a mid-law corp firm (that has a history of bringing on their summers and pays well above market) and a state court judge (b/c I wanted some court experience). I was told all throughout the summer great things about working with the firm, but, lo and behold, I just found out yesterday that firm has hit bad financial times and isn't able to extend offers to any of the summer associates. Needless to say, this has took me by surprise. I got the whole "call us for a recommendation" and "great work product" spiel, but I am irritated that they didn't tell us sooner.

I know this means it is time to hustle, and that doesn't bother me, but I just don't know where to hustle towards. I really want tax law (which has me thinking LLM as a fall back) but I also enjoy corp/ transactional work and healthcare law. I am particularly interested in working in the SE, but that isn't a requirement. I know there are things out there, I guess I am just looking for support and ideas for how to get out there... This, for lack of a better term, blows...

Hustle to another industry tbh :/

FWIW you can get a job in my home town doing sanitation work making mid/upper 5 figures. Take $ in a different industry with a 40 hr week and just accept that law school was a bad choice IMO.

[a male human]

First time poster here... I am sure everyone has their sob story, but I figured I'd get mine out there. I am top 15%, LR Board at a t-35 school. I split 2L summer with a mid-law corp firm (that has a history of bringing on their summers and pays well above market) and a state court judge (b/c I wanted some court experience). I was told all throughout the summer great things about working with the firm, but, lo and behold, I just found out yesterday that firm has hit bad financial times and isn't able to extend offers to any of the summer associates. Needless to say, this has took me by surprise. I got the whole "call us for a recommendation" and "great work product" spiel, but I am irritated that they didn't tell us sooner.

I know this means it is time to hustle, and that doesn't bother me, but I just don't know where to hustle towards. I really want tax law (which has me thinking LLM as a fall back) but I also enjoy corp/ transactional work and healthcare law. I am particularly interested in working in the SE, but that isn't a requirement. I know there are things out there, I guess I am just looking for support and ideas for how to get out there... This, for lack of a better term, blows...

Hustle to another industry tbh :/

FWIW you can get a job in my home town doing sanitation work making mid/upper 5 figures. Take $ in a different industry with a 40 hr week and just accept that law school was a bad choice IMO.

Seems like he has a good fighting chance. If someone with his credentials should hustle to another industry, what about the rest of us... unless I'm missing something here (besides the fact that legal market is poop).

[oasis87]

Any Spanish-speaking do-gooders who are admitted to a bar and want to move to SoCal? I just came across this posting:

The Immigration Center for Women and Children (ICWC) seeks a full-time staff attorney in the San Diego office. ICWC is a non-profit legal organization providing affordable immigration services to underrepresented women and children in California. ICWC strives to provide security and stability for children who are abused, abandoned or neglected and for women and children who are victims of domestic violence, sexual assault and other violent crimes.

Duties and Responsibilities:

The attorney will work with other attorneys and legal assistants in a small, busy non-profit. The attorney will be responsible for providing direct immigration legal services, outreach and education to victims of domestic violence, sexual assault and other violent crimes. Duties include: conducting client intake, case assessment, ongoing case management, researching and drafting legal documents and attending court hearings. The attorney will work collaboratively with social service and law enforcement agencies and conduct outreach to the community about ICWC services. The attorney will primarily work with providing relief under the Violence Against Women Act (VAWA), the U visa, Special Immigrant Juvenile Status (SIJS) and Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA). The attorney will also supervise law students and other volunteers.

Qualifications:

Juris Doctorate and active bar admission (California preferred but not required)
One to three years immigration law practice with VAWA and U visa experience preferred
Strong writing skills and a meticulous attention to detail
Oral and written Spanish language fluency required

A demonstrated interest in low-income legal services and/or a commitment to civil liberties and immigrants' rights
Ability to work effectively with victims of domestic violence and sexual assault
Ability to work effectively and communicate with law enforcement, representatives of government and English/Spanish media

Thanks for posting this! This is exactly the kind of job I want and I've been seeing so many postings like this, but they are all for people who already have 1 year of experience.

I keep seeing job postings in the Bay Area, which is super encouraging, but they are all in totally different practice areas. There are actually a ton for things like tax, ugh.

mind telling me where you're finding these jobs listings? i'm a recent grad on the east coast and JUST starting looking in the Bay Area (SO got a job offer there). the CA legal market looks (especially) brutal from where i'm standing.

[Anonymous User]

TV decided not to work anymore so now not only am I jobless but I also have nothing to do when im at home while everyone else is working. Nice.

[Void]

TV decided not to work anymore so now not only am I jobless but I also have nothing to do when im at home while everyone else is working. Nice.

At least you have the internetz. Who watches TV any more anyway?

[newyorker88]

If you have the internet you can watch TV shows i.e. Hulu.com

[a male human]

yeah i haven't deliberatly watched actual TV since high school or something

[Anonymous User]

I kind of liked TV but there you go, not even a choice anymore. Going to cancel my cable today because I can't afford to repair my TV or buy a new one.

Meanwhile, still no job.

[newyorker88]

You can probably get a free TV off Craigslist. That's how I got one of my TVs.

[hiima3L]

Any Spanish-speaking do-gooders who are admitted to a bar and want to move to SoCal? I just came across this posting:

The Immigration Center for Women and Children (ICWC) seeks a full-time staff attorney in the San Diego office. ICWC is a non-profit legal organization providing affordable immigration services to underrepresented women and children in California. ICWC strives to provide security and stability for children who are abused, abandoned or neglected and for women and children who are victims of domestic violence, sexual assault and other violent crimes.

Duties and Responsibilities:

The attorney will work with other attorneys and legal assistants in a small, busy non-profit. The attorney will be responsible for providing direct immigration legal services, outreach and education to victims of domestic violence, sexual assault and other violent crimes. Duties include: conducting client intake, case assessment, ongoing case management, researching and drafting legal documents and attending court hearings. The attorney will work collaboratively with social service and law enforcement agencies and conduct outreach to the community about ICWC services. The attorney will primarily work with providing relief under the Violence Against Women Act (VAWA), the U visa, Special Immigrant Juvenile Status (SIJS) and Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA). The attorney will also supervise law students and other volunteers.

Qualifications:

Juris Doctorate and active bar admission (California preferred but not required)
One to three years immigration law practice with VAWA and U visa experience preferred
Strong writing skills and a meticulous attention to detail
Oral and written Spanish language fluency required

A demonstrated interest in low-income legal services and/or a commitment to civil liberties and immigrants' rights
Ability to work effectively with victims of domestic violence and sexual assault
Ability to work effectively and communicate with law enforcement, representatives of government and English/Spanish media

Thanks for posting this! This is exactly the kind of job I want and I've been seeing so many postings like this, but they are all for people who already have 1 year of experience.

I keep seeing job postings in the Bay Area, which is super encouraging, but they are all in totally different practice areas. There are actually a ton for things like tax, ugh.

You should apply for every job that wants one year of experience because I'm sure it's rarely a hard and fast rule. One year of experience is nothing. I think when they explicitly ask for about 3, then I would say that's a strict requirement.

If bar passage is required, it's definitely going to be a strict requirement 99% of the time, but I would not rule out an application saying something to the effect of "I really want this job and would love to do it (maybe for free) until I get my bar results." A lot of places are open to this, especially PI type places.

[Anonymous User]

Just got no offered...oh my fucking god...recommended but firm has financial reasons.

I have no idea what I'm going to do now. I'm fucked. Absolutely devastated.

[Bikeflip]

School's CSO wanted an update from me: "Zero interviews. Sent out dozens (hundreds) of resumes. "