OCI/callbacks/etc Men's Clothing Mega-thread Forum

[goodolgil]

Anyone had luck purchasing a suit off ebay? So many seem to have enormous waists...

Check out the seller Wizard of Aahs. Sells some NICE suits that he has to give a fake nameS TO because he is selling them under their minimum MSRP.

[Ghost]

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[TaipeiMort]

+1. Loafers as very casual.

eh whatever lol...I spoke to many recruiting attorneys and they said shoes dont make a damn difference unless they are highly noticeable(in the wrong way).

I've read the first 60 pages of this thread...I feel embarrased for some of you guys and your posts lol. Like a 20-30 page debate on whether or not button down collars? lol wtf?

Since you are from California, let me analogize this to something you understand. Have you ever been hanging out with your friends in public when you see some guy wearing a Volcom t-shirt he bought at Pac Sun and some normal-fitting jeans he got from American Eagle or something like that, and is rocking some white New Balance or huge high top basketball shoes or Nike Shocks or something?

Your first reaction when seeing his shoes is that he is a nerd/poser and does not know how to dress himself.

This might be true. It might also be that he does not like DC/Es/Etnies shoes and just enjoys wearing a good athletic shoe with a casual outfit. Your parents or older brother who graduated in 1995 or more nerdy friends probably wouldn't recognize the difference between the shoes. Likewise, people in the Midwest, South, and parts of the Mountain West probably wouldn't notice the difference either, or would think something like "wow, those Nike Shocks with the red springs on the back are sweet!" However, the guy has made a bad impression on you and lots of other people your age in the area.

The same thing is true for loafers. A lot of interviewers will look, and wont really care. Some interviewers, especially old school parters will look and have the same reaction toward you that you would have to the guy wearing the Nike Shocks. They have no idea why you wouldn't wear a pair of cap toe lace ups to an interview and think that you must be the weird, nerdy, or fashion-unconscious one.

Wait, people care that much about CASUAL shoes? I understand putting effort into a professional outfit, but I don't think I have ever judged anyone by what is on their feet when they are just walking around. Or at least, not to the fine distinction between athletic sneakers and casual sneakers.

Then again, I am from the Mountain West AND a self confessed nerd, so what do I know? If you'll excuse me, I'm gonna go put on my Keens and check the mail.



Love em!

Only on the West Coast (and by West Coast I mean everything in California south of San Jose, as well as smatterings in Seattle, Portland, Las Vegas, and small pockets in Arizona and Utah).

[09042014]

How do I fly with a suit?

[Bosque]

How do I fly with a suit?

Wings help.

--ImageRemoved--

[03121202698008]

How do I fly with a suit?

Jet pack.

[GeePee]

Trifold garment bags are cheap and convenient. A quick steam and the suit will be perfect.

http://www.target.com/Traveler-Ballisti ... ub_1_title

[Bosque]

More serious note, most planes actually have a coat closet you can hang things in if you are traveling while wearing it. Ask the flight attendant. Alternatively, get a suit bag and cary on your suit, change when you get there.

[Lady Croft]

Since this is OCI season I think this might be helpful to those of you that need to travel with suits. For those of you that prefer the Pufer method (found on pg 58) of packing a suit, here's a simpler alternative.

Suit needs to have been ironed beforehand for both methods.

Pufer method

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VDGWW7_O2sI

Cons are that you waste a lot of space by keeping the bag puffy with the air to avoid squashing the shoulder pads and wrinkling the folded up pants. Also you run the risk of the bag popping and flattening anyway while you haul it around through security and up on the overhead carry on. Also, who has a ton of garment bags laying around?

Alternative.

http://www.johnchow.com/how-to-pack-a-s ... ry-on-bag/ (scroll down, video is near bottom)

Saves space, don't need a ton of garment bags, and rolling prevents wrinkles in the pants better ime. If you do get some wrinkles in the pants, hang up the suit immediately after you get to the hotel and they should right themselves anyway.

For those that use the bathroom steaming method, just be aware that it doesn't get out major wrinkles and is usually just good for the smaller ones.

[Anonymous User]

I haven't read through this whole thread. Whoever can should just /self. But I wanted to add my two cents. I wore one medium gray suit and one dark navy suit for all of OCI. I wore a white spread collar with french cuffs and some interesting/playful cufflinks. I wore conservative ties in a four in hand knot. I wore dark brown lace up shoes and socks matching the suit. While my numbers were good (10% DCNG), I think that showing some creativity in the way I dressed helped me come off in a manner that distinguished me from my peers. You never want to be too flashy or out there, but you also don't want to just blend in with the herd and their shitty black shoes and poorly tailored pants. I have callbacks from 2 of the 4 V5s that interview at my school and another 13 CBs, most from V25s. These are conservative, white shoe firms, but they can also appreciate someone who dresses well.

[5ky]

I haven't read through this whole thread. Whoever can should just /self. But I wanted to add my two cents. I wore one medium gray suit and one dark navy suit for all of OCI. I wore a white spread collar with french cuffs and some interesting/playful cufflinks. I wore conservative ties in a four in hand knot. I wore dark brown lace up shoes and socks matching the suit. While my numbers were good (10% DCNG), I think that showing some creativity in the way I dressed helped me come off in a manner that distinguished me from my peers. You never want to be too flashy or out there, but you also don't want to just blend in with the herd and their shitty black shoes and poorly tailored pants. I have callbacks from 2 of the 4 V5s that interview at my school and another 13 CBs, most from V25s. These are conservative, white shoe firms, but they can also appreciate someone who dresses well.

Reads like a roundabout way of informing your colleagues at your school how many callbacks you have, cool bro

[Anonymous User]

Yep. That's the point. Not that everyone should think twice before accepting advice to dress as boringly as possible. You aced it.

[Pufer]

Cons are that you waste a lot of space by keeping the bag puffy with the air to avoid squashing the shoulder pads and wrinkling the folded up pants. Also you run the risk of the bag popping and flattening anyway while you haul it around through security and up on the overhead carry on. Also, who has a ton of garment bags laying around?

Bah.

Pufer method turns the jacket inside out (similar to the second video) before putting it in the bag. The rather unlikely event of the bag popping is what the dry cleaner bags are for (if you don't have any, just go to the dry cleaner and ask for a few; they don't care) - they keep everything slippery (especially against the smoother jacket liner - hence the inside out) so no real issue there.

I agree with you that folding the pants is less than optimal, so that's why I recommend rolling them (also similar to the second video), but I don't like how rolling the jacket sometimes makes your lapels wavy, thus I think the flat fold is preferable. Basically, the Pufer method combines the best features of both of those videos into one, with the addition of dry cleaning bags.

Additionally, the fact that the puffy bag takes up a lot of the space in your carry-on is actually part of the benefit, as I see it. If you roll everything up to a tiny package, you might try to bring a bunch of extra crap on your one-day callback trip - extraneous stuff that's liable to crush/rub/leak on your totally unprotected suit roll using the second video's method (I mean, all you really need is your suit and a change of shirt/underwear for the trip home; what's all the extra space for? Leave the assless chaps and coke at home.).

If you actually need more space or multiple suits, I'd say you should probably suck it up and check a proper rolling garment bag. You can get a very nice one for way under $100 at TJ Maxx.

Anyway, some experimentation is probably in order to find what works for everyone in particular. My method really is wildly over-engineered to cover any possible issue that could arise and probably won't ever actually be necessary for your suit to make it there in one piece. That said, I've never wanted to have to worry about trying to get a suit dry cleaned at 10 PM having just landed in DC for that big interview starting at 8 AM the next morning, so am generally fine with the fact that my suit basically fills my bag.

-Pufer

[03121202698008]

Cons are that you waste a lot of space by keeping the bag puffy with the air to avoid squashing the shoulder pads and wrinkling the folded up pants. Also you run the risk of the bag popping and flattening anyway while you haul it around through security and up on the overhead carry on. Also, who has a ton of garment bags laying around?

Bah.

Pufer method turns the jacket inside out (similar to the second video) before putting it in the bag. The rather unlikely event of the bag popping is what the dry cleaner bags are for (if you don't have any, just go to the dry cleaner and ask for a few; they don't care) - they keep everything slippery (especially against the smoother jacket liner - hence the inside out) so no real issue there.

I agree with you that folding the pants is less than optimal, so that's why I recommend rolling them (also similar to the second video), but I don't like how rolling the jacket sometimes makes your lapels wavy, thus I think the flat fold is preferable. Basically, the Pufer method combines the best features of both of those videos into one, with the addition of dry cleaning bags.

Additionally, the fact that the puffy bag takes up a lot of the space in your carry-on is actually part of the benefit, as I see it. If you roll everything up to a tiny package, you might try to bring a bunch of extra crap on your one-day callback trip - extraneous stuff that's liable to crush/rub/leak on your totally unprotected suit roll using the second video's method (I mean, all you really need is your suit and a change of shirt/underwear for the trip home; what's all the extra space for? Leave the assless chaps and coke at home.).

If you actually need more space or multiple suits, I'd say you should probably suck it up and check a proper rolling garment bag. You can get a very nice one for way under $100 at TJ Maxx.

Anyway, some experimentation is probably in order to find what works for everyone in particular. My method really is wildly over-engineered to cover any possible issue that could arise and probably won't ever actually be necessary for your suit to make it there in one piece. That said, I've never wanted to have to worry about trying to get a suit dry cleaned at 10 PM having just landed in DC for that big interview starting at 8 AM the next morning, so am generally fine with the fact that my suit basically fills my bag.

-Pufer

How do you fold them? No idea where that is in this thread now...

[03121202698008]

In case anyone needs one, I found a deep burgundy (cordovan) belt at Macys for $37 on sale.

[TatteredDignity]

Speaking of ties... In a few places throughout this thread, people have mentioned that a half windsor or 4 in hand should be used. I've always preferred a full windsor because of its symmetry, but then again, I don't know anything. It's just what I think looks good. I'm not a big guy by any means. Should I switch to the half or the 4, or do I even have to switch at all? And how do I get over the lopsidedness of those other knots?

[Lady Croft]

(I mean, all you really need is your suit and a change of shirt/underwear for the trip home; what's all the extra space for? Leave the assless chaps and coke at home.).

Well now I know you're crazy. Who goes to an OCI interview without their assless chaps?

Ime the wrinkles that could come from the flat fold of the jacket (should they occur) are much harder to get out than a potential wavy lapel. Bathroom steam and immediate hanging of the jacket can get out wavy lapels if they happen but a fold wrinkle is going to require actual steaming/ironing. In the unlikely event that the bag pops, nothing looks worse than weird flattened shoulder pads which the plastic won't prevent, so I still prefer the rolled up jacket.

While I agree with you that guys generally need just a shirt, suit and some clothes for the next day, girls tend to need a lot more stuff (think makeup, heels, curling/straightening iron, multiple shells etc) so a suit that fills the entire tiny carry on can be a problem.

I will say that you should probably ziploc both pieces if you're going to be carrying hair products/makeup/etc in the carry on as well. But yeah, see what works for you. Either method is fine. Just an alternative.

[Bronte]

I haven't read through this whole thread. Whoever can should just /self. But I wanted to add my two cents. I wore one medium gray suit and one dark navy suit for all of OCI. I wore a white spread collar with french cuffs and some interesting/playful cufflinks. I wore conservative ties in a four in hand knot. I wore dark brown lace up shoes and socks matching the suit. While my numbers were good (10% DCNG), I think that showing some creativity in the way I dressed helped me come off in a manner that distinguished me from my peers. You never want to be too flashy or out there, but you also don't want to just blend in with the herd and their shitty black shoes and poorly tailored pants. I have callbacks from 2 of the 4 V5s that interview at my school and another 13 CBs, most from V25s. These are conservative, white shoe firms, but they can also appreciate someone who dresses well.

Dressing conservatively does not mean dressing poorly. There is no reason to think that dressing conservatively means one will be wearing "shitty black shoes" or "poorly tailored pants." However, many in this thread are on a budget because they're law students. That's why we have recommended cheap shoes like the Bostonians (although I don't think we've ever recommended poorly tailored pants). Further, when a person is on a budget, it's even harder to dress in the relatively fashion-forward way that you described and actually pull it off.

[Bosque]

Speaking of ties... In a few places throughout this thread, people have mentioned that a half windsor or 4 in hand should be used. I've always preferred a full windsor because of its symmetry, but then again, I don't know anything. It's just what I think looks good. I'm not a big guy by any means. Should I switch to the half or the 4, or do I even have to switch at all? And how do I get over the lopsidedness of those other knots?

Type of knot really depends on your head size, the thickness of the material of your tie, and your collar type. You don't want a knot the same size as your head, and you also don't want a knot that makes your head look like a balloon with a string attached to it. I am pretty sure you shouldn't be tying a full windsor. I have a big head, and I usually stick with the half windsor. Try a four in hand, I am guessing that will work well for you.

As for how to get over the lopsidedness, I am pretty sure your collar is too wide if people are noticing.

[Pufer]

How do you fold them? No idea where that is in this thread now...

Fold what? I fold the jacket the same way as the first video Croft posted, just with the suit inside out and a dry cleaning bag for each fold. I fold the pants in half (like how I would to put them on a hangar) and then roll them from the top down.

Speaking of ties... In a few places throughout this thread, people have mentioned that a half windsor or 4 in hand should be used. I've always preferred a full windsor because of its symmetry, but then again, I don't know anything. It's just what I think looks good. I'm not a big guy by any means. Should I switch to the half or the 4, or do I even have to switch at all? And how do I get over the lopsidedness of those other knots?

A properly-tied half windsor should be as symmetrical as any full windsor. If your half windsor is lopsided, it needs to be retied. As to the four-in-hand, you should only use it with point collars narrow enough to where the asymmetry (which really only exists at the top) isn't particularly noticeable.

Well now I know you're crazy. Who goes to an OCI interview without their assless chaps?

Ime the wrinkles that could come from the flat fold of the jacket (should they occur) are much harder to get out than a potential wavy lapel. Bathroom steam and immediate hanging of the jacket can get out wavy lapels if they happen but a fold wrinkle is going to require actual steaming/ironing. In the unlikely event that the bag pops, nothing looks worse than weird flattened shoulder pads which the plastic won't prevent, so I still prefer the rolled up jacket.

While I agree with you that guys generally need just a shirt, suit and some clothes for the next day, girls tend to need a lot more stuff (think makeup, heels, curling/straightening iron, multiple shells etc) so a suit that fills the entire tiny carry on can be a problem.

I will say that you should probably ziploc both pieces if you're going to be carrying hair products/makeup/etc in the carry on as well. But yeah, see what works for you. Either method is fine. Just an alternative.

Well, this is the men's clothing thread (at least according to the title)...

Unless it's a tropical suit, the canvas that men's jackets are stuffed with generally will prevent most of the significant folding creases in the uppers (you would at least need a lot more pressure than you're going to find inside of a suitcase). The key really is keeping the back, the arms, and the lapels (the parts that are just fabric) from wrinkling. If it's inside out, flat, and with the dry cleaning bags acting as additional padding, it works great on those areas.

As to the shoulder pads, they're not crushed. If you look at the first video, they're just folded behind and left free-floating. If the whole thing is inside out, even if they do flatten a bit (which has never happened in my experience), flipping them back out fluffs them back up.

The issue really is just preventing pressure points that can cause creases. I mean, I've done five cross-country trips since I came up with the method in its current form and have never even had to use the bathroom steam, and the shoulders have been perfect each time. The space thing is a definite drawback if you need to carry more stuff, but if you don't need the extra space, I really don't see even the potential for the other drawbacks you're mentioning with my method.

-Pufer

[Lady Croft]

Your method just seems really meticulous. I've been packing suits for someone that travels all over the world and he's never had any issues. I like my method better because it's simpler and saves space but if you says yours works then cool. Again, just an alternative.

[Pufer]

Oh, absolutely. For something other than an OCI callback, I'd probably not go through that much trouble. But if there's ever a time to be meticulous, I figure that an interview is it.

-Pufer

[Heartford]

Pufer,

Is that a self-tar? If so (or, I guess, even if not), what's your stance on facial hair and professional appearance?

[AntiHuman]

+1. Loafers as very casual.

eh whatever lol...I spoke to many recruiting attorneys and they said shoes dont make a damn difference unless they are highly noticeable(in the wrong way).

I've read the first 60 pages of this thread...I feel embarrased for some of you guys and your posts lol. Like a 20-30 page debate on whether or not button down collars? lol wtf?

The thread is about the details of men's attire. You posted the attire you're planning to wear to OCI in a men's attire thread. If you're completely set on what you're wearing, why did you post it? I pointed out that loafers are not optimal. That's objectively true and common sense. They're casual shoes. Obviously, what's discussed herein is not going to make or break you in an interview.

But you and the long line of posters before you bemoaning the detail-orientation of the thread are just obnoxious. Its purpose is to get at the details and to agree on what's best to wear to an interview. If you're not interested in that discussion, go elsewhere and don't post your planned attire ITT and then lash out at constructive criticism. Also, what the "many recruiting attorneys" you've spoken to say or think really doesn't matter. We're well aware, and it's been readily acknowledged, that many interviewers don't care about what people wear. But some do, and we're thus discussing best practices.

lolz..embarassing

[Anonymous User]

I would never wear anything to a CB but a very nice charcoal or blue suit, white shirt, and nice blue or red tie (striped is fine, but I tend to stick with non-distracting patterns), with lace-up shoes and a matching belt. But my suits and shirts are tailored and slim, my ties are modern, and my shoes are pointy. I don't see the need to dress like someone twice my age. And it worked well for some of the most "stuffy" firms out there.