NYC to 200k Forum

[Anonymous User]

California firms need to get going. OMM, Orrick, Fenwick, MoFo, Sheppard Mullin. C’mon guys.

LOLZ at them matching or included in this group.

MoFo's PPP was 1.736m.
Orrick's was 1.863m
Fenwick's was 1.513m

Sheppard Mullin's was $1.71m

So enlighten me as to why they wouldn't be on this list.

Bc they already don’t pay market and they don’t let you progress class years if you don’t hit hours. TTT moves by a TTT firm.

Doesn't Sidley also prevent you from progressing class years if you don't hit hours? At least they still pay market though.

(In before people point out that Sidley is also a TTT firm.)

[Anonymous User]

do firms generally have policies on this? i have no idea if my firm does

[Anonymous User]

What is a Kramer Levin

[Anonymous User]

California firms need to get going. OMM, Orrick, Fenwick, MoFo, Sheppard Mullin. C’mon guys.

LOLZ at them matching or included in this group.

MoFo's PPP was 1.736m.
Orrick's was 1.863m
Fenwick's was 1.513m

Sheppard Mullin's was $1.71m

So enlighten me as to why they wouldn't be on this list.

Bc they already don’t pay market and they don’t let you progress class years if you don’t hit hours. TTT moves by a TTT firm.

They do pay market

[Anonymous User]

Kramer Levin just matched w bonus

[Anonymous User]

California firms need to get going. OMM, Orrick, Fenwick, MoFo, Sheppard Mullin. C’mon guys.

LOLZ at them matching or included in this group.

MoFo's PPP was 1.736m.
Orrick's was 1.863m
Fenwick's was 1.513m

Sheppard Mullin's was $1.71m

So enlighten me as to why they wouldn't be on this list.

Bc they already don’t pay market and they don’t let you progress class years if you don’t hit hours. TTT moves by a TTT firm.

They do pay market

This is correct. They used to have a lame bonus policy but changed it to full market bonus for associates who bill 2000.

[Anonymous User]

Kramer Levin just matched w bonus

The Wall of Shame clearly works. Please re-post hourly.

[Anonymous User]

Have never heard of anyone at Sheppard or MoFo getting held back a class year. Can someone confirm thats even true?

Can personally confirm that this is true at Sheppard and that the practice is widespread. (And that it hurts morale tremendously and pushes people out, which may be the intended effect.)

[LaLiLuLeLo]

California firms need to get going. OMM, Orrick, Fenwick, MoFo, Sheppard Mullin. C’mon guys.

LOLZ at them matching or included in this group.

MoFo's PPP was 1.736m.
Orrick's was 1.863m
Fenwick's was 1.513m

Sheppard Mullin's was $1.71m

So enlighten me as to why they wouldn't be on this list.

Bc they already don’t pay market and they don’t let you progress class years if you don’t hit hours. TTT moves by a TTT firm.

They do pay market

Only in theory. But they don’t pay by class year. They have some weird tiered system (Associate 1-3, Managing Associate 1-3, etc). In real terms they don’t pay market because this system.

[Anonymous User]

That's terrible of firms to squeeze associates by holding them back like that while revenue, billing rates, and profits all rise.

How bad do your hours have to be to get held back? What if your group just had a few show months?

Do they still bump up your billing rate?

[Anonymous User]

California firms need to get going. OMM, Orrick, Fenwick, MoFo, Sheppard Mullin. C’mon guys.

LOLZ at them matching or included in this group.

MoFo's PPP was 1.736m.
Orrick's was 1.863m
Fenwick's was 1.513m

Sheppard Mullin's was $1.71m

So enlighten me as to why they wouldn't be on this list.

Bc they already don’t pay market and they don’t let you progress class years if you don’t hit hours. TTT moves by a TTT firm.

They do pay market

Only in theory. But they don’t pay by class year. They have some weird tiered system (Associate 1-3, Managing Associate 1-3, etc). In real terms they don’t pay market because this system.

Fair enough. If people are being held back from advancing levels then they would not be getting paid market for the year they graduated.

[Anonymous User]

That's terrible of firms to squeeze associates by holding them back like that while revenue, billing rates, and profits all rise.

How bad do your hours have to be to get held back? What if your group just had a few show months?

Do they still bump up your billing rate?

Billing rate stays the same. Not sure what it takes to be held back but it’s typically between levels A3-M1 and M3-C1

[Anonymous User]

I love how ATL just shits on everybody ever there. A salty bunch. If you don't match raises/bonuses, you're greedy, cheap, and desperate; if you match bonuses, you're a tone deaf, collusive lemming.

[Anonymous User]

I love how ATL just shits on everybody ever there. A salty bunch. If you don't match raises/bonuses, you're greedy, cheap, and desperate; if you match bonuses, you're a tone deaf, collusive lemming.

Horrible headline. Only cheap associates will go work at a firm and make $180k a year?

[Anonymous User]

At King & Spalding, you get about $30-$40 per hour (depending on class, I believe) for each hour worked over 2,050 hours.

wtf so you have to bill an extra 400-500 hours just to get a FIRST YEAR market bonus?

That's not bad. If we bill an extra 400 we make less than $15 an hour. If we bill an extra 300, it's not even a guarantee that we will make anything over the market bonus. I think this system sounds pretty nice.

K&S has a firm-wide meeting tomorrow (was already on the books). Wouldn't be a bad time to announce...

[Wacked Wombat]

I love how ATL just shits on everybody ever there. A salty bunch. If you don't match raises/bonuses, you're greedy, cheap, and desperate; if you match bonuses, you're a tone deaf, collusive lemming.

Horrible headline. Only cheap associates will go work at a firm and make $180k a year?

My favorite was the in-house counsel "tone deaf" argument. What's tone deaf is the fact that this is a $1,500 raise in real terms from the last round of raises, but fuck associates amirite?

[Anonymous User]

At King & Spalding, you get about $30-$40 per hour (depending on class, I believe) for each hour worked over 2,050 hours.

wtf so you have to bill an extra 400-500 hours just to get a FIRST YEAR market bonus?

That's not bad. If we bill an extra 400 we make less than $15 an hour. If we bill an extra 300, it's not even a guarantee that we will make anything over the market bonus. I think this system sounds pretty nice.

K&S has a firm-wide meeting tomorrow (was already on the books). Wouldn't be a bad time to announce...

Would be a bad time to pull a Reed Smith.

[Anonymous User]

So what is Greenberg Traurig going to do? Is Rosenbaum gonna decide it’s actually “better for clients” if they match or they going to designate themselves the top of TTT shit firms that get all the left over OCI rejects?

[Anonymous User]

Hourly Wall of Shame:

• Fried Frank
  1. Latham ($3.25MM PPP, 24.8% L5Y PPP growth, 3.0 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  2. Paul Hastings ($2.91MM PPP, 28.4% L5Y PPP growth, 2.8 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  3. Akin Gump ($2.39MM PPP, 35.5% L5Y PPP growth, 2.0 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  4. King & Spalding ($2.61MM PPP, 23.8% L5Y PPP growth, 2.1 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  Vinson & Elkins
  5. Shearman & Sterling ($2.32MM PPP, 34.4% L5Y PPP growth, 2.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  6. Gibson Dunn ($3.24MM PPP, 13.3% L5Y PPP growth, 2.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  7. Dechert ($2.68MM PPP, 21.7% L5Y PPP growth, 2.7 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  8. Wilmer ($2.12MM PPP, 31.0% L5Y PPP growth, 2.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  9. Schulte ($2.56MM PPP, 17.7% L5Y PPP growth, 2.6 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  Cooley
  Kramer Levin
  10. Baker Botts ($1.84MM PPP, 26.0% L5Y PPP growth, 1.9 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  11. Alston & Bird ($1.93MM PPP, 11.0% L5Y PPP growth, 1.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  12. Sheppard Mullin ($1.71MM PPP, 26.0% L5Y PPP growth, 2.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  13. McDermott ($1.71MM PPP, 14.8% L5Y PPP growth, 1.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)

[Anonymous User]

Hourly Wall of Shame:

• Fried Frank
  1. Latham ($3.25MM PPP, 24.8% L5Y PPP growth, 3.0 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  2. Paul Hastings ($2.91MM PPP, 28.4% L5Y PPP growth, 2.8 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  3. Akin Gump ($2.39MM PPP, 35.5% L5Y PPP growth, 2.0 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  4. King & Spalding ($2.61MM PPP, 23.8% L5Y PPP growth, 2.1 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  Vinson & Elkins
  5. Shearman & Sterling ($2.32MM PPP, 34.4% L5Y PPP growth, 2.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  6. Gibson Dunn ($3.24MM PPP, 13.3% L5Y PPP growth, 2.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  7. Dechert ($2.68MM PPP, 21.7% L5Y PPP growth, 2.7 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  8. Wilmer ($2.12MM PPP, 31.0% L5Y PPP growth, 2.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  9. Schulte ($2.56MM PPP, 17.7% L5Y PPP growth, 2.6 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  Cooley
  Kramer Levin
  10. Baker Botts ($1.84MM PPP, 26.0% L5Y PPP growth, 1.9 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  11. Alston & Bird ($1.93MM PPP, 11.0% L5Y PPP growth, 1.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  12. Sheppard Mullin ($1.71MM PPP, 26.0% L5Y PPP growth, 2.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  13. McDermott ($1.71MM PPP, 14.8% L5Y PPP growth, 1.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)

Why is Greenberg Traurig not on this list, is it conclusive they won’t raise?

[Anonymous User]

Hourly Wall of Shame:

• Fried Frank
  1. Latham ($3.25MM PPP, 24.8% L5Y PPP growth, 3.0 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  2. Paul Hastings ($2.91MM PPP, 28.4% L5Y PPP growth, 2.8 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  3. Akin Gump ($2.39MM PPP, 35.5% L5Y PPP growth, 2.0 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  4. King & Spalding ($2.61MM PPP, 23.8% L5Y PPP growth, 2.1 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  Vinson & Elkins
  5. Shearman & Sterling ($2.32MM PPP, 34.4% L5Y PPP growth, 2.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  6. Gibson Dunn ($3.24MM PPP, 13.3% L5Y PPP growth, 2.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  7. Dechert ($2.68MM PPP, 21.7% L5Y PPP growth, 2.7 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  8. Wilmer ($2.12MM PPP, 31.0% L5Y PPP growth, 2.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  9. Schulte ($2.56MM PPP, 17.7% L5Y PPP growth, 2.6 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  Cooley
  Kramer Levin
  10. Baker Botts ($1.84MM PPP, 26.0% L5Y PPP growth, 1.9 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  11. Alston & Bird ($1.93MM PPP, 11.0% L5Y PPP growth, 1.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  12. Sheppard Mullin ($1.71MM PPP, 26.0% L5Y PPP growth, 2.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  13. McDermott ($1.71MM PPP, 14.8% L5Y PPP growth, 1.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)

Please add Cadwalader thanks.

I love how ATL just shits on everybody ever there. A salty bunch. If you don't match raises/bonuses, you're greedy, cheap, and desperate; if you match bonuses, you're a tone deaf, collusive lemming.

Horrible headline. Only cheap associates will go work at a firm and make $180k a year?

And make $10k less than they would at another firm doing similar work (not to mention knowing that Reed Smith is unlikely to match any future raises and the fact that the gap gets bigger with seniority). Realistically it's not "cheap" associates, but associates who lack offers from firms that pay market.

[Anonymous User]

Why is Greenberg Traurig not on this list, is it conclusive they won’t raise?

"For us, our highest priorities remain excellence, delivering value and innovation and maintaining a wind-proof culture based on individual respect, trust, empowerment, and collaboration. Change can be empowering, but not when it is simply based on what the “pack” is doing rather than a solid strategy which is grounded in our core values. For over 50 years, we have found our best opportunities in change; it has allowed our firm to be diverse, entrepreneurial, nimble, and responsive over the years. But we do not base our changes on the whims of the marketplace or ill-advised, so-called experts."

-Greenberg TTTraurig

[Anonymous User]

Hourly Wall of Shame:

• Fried Frank
  1. Latham ($3.25MM PPP, 24.8% L5Y PPP growth, 3.0 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  2. Paul Hastings ($2.91MM PPP, 28.4% L5Y PPP growth, 2.8 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  3. Akin Gump ($2.39MM PPP, 35.5% L5Y PPP growth, 2.0 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  4. King & Spalding ($2.61MM PPP, 23.8% L5Y PPP growth, 2.1 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  Vinson & Elkins
  5. Shearman & Sterling ($2.32MM PPP, 34.4% L5Y PPP growth, 2.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  6. Gibson Dunn ($3.24MM PPP, 13.3% L5Y PPP growth, 2.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  7. Dechert ($2.68MM PPP, 21.7% L5Y PPP growth, 2.7 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  8. Wilmer ($2.12MM PPP, 31.0% L5Y PPP growth, 2.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  9. Schulte ($2.56MM PPP, 17.7% L5Y PPP growth, 2.6 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  Cooley
  Kramer Levin
  10. Baker Botts ($1.84MM PPP, 26.0% L5Y PPP growth, 1.9 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  11. Alston & Bird ($1.93MM PPP, 11.0% L5Y PPP growth, 1.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  12. Sheppard Mullin ($1.71MM PPP, 26.0% L5Y PPP growth, 2.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  13. McDermott ($1.71MM PPP, 14.8% L5Y PPP growth, 1.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)

Why is Greenberg Traurig not on this list, is it conclusive they won’t raise?

Better question: why is Cooley off this list?

[Anonymous User]

Hourly Wall of Shame:

• Fried Frank
  1. Latham ($3.25MM PPP, 24.8% L5Y PPP growth, 3.0 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  2. Paul Hastings ($2.91MM PPP, 28.4% L5Y PPP growth, 2.8 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  3. Akin Gump ($2.39MM PPP, 35.5% L5Y PPP growth, 2.0 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  4. King & Spalding ($2.61MM PPP, 23.8% L5Y PPP growth, 2.1 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  Vinson & Elkins
  5. Shearman & Sterling ($2.32MM PPP, 34.4% L5Y PPP growth, 2.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  6. Gibson Dunn ($3.24MM PPP, 13.3% L5Y PPP growth, 2.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  7. Dechert ($2.68MM PPP, 21.7% L5Y PPP growth, 2.7 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  8. Wilmer ($2.12MM PPP, 31.0% L5Y PPP growth, 2.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  9. Schulte ($2.56MM PPP, 17.7% L5Y PPP growth, 2.6 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  Cooley
  Kramer Levin
  10. Baker Botts ($1.84MM PPP, 26.0% L5Y PPP growth, 1.9 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  11. Alston & Bird ($1.93MM PPP, 11.0% L5Y PPP growth, 1.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  12. Sheppard Mullin ($1.71MM PPP, 26.0% L5Y PPP growth, 2.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  13. McDermott ($1.71MM PPP, 14.8% L5Y PPP growth, 1.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)

Why is Greenberg Traurig not on this list, is it conclusive they won’t raise?

Better question: why is Cooley off this list?

They matched market pay, which is more than anyone else on that list can say? And they have a track record/reputation for paying significantly above-market bonuses so I guess you could give them the benefit of the doubt to make good on their promise to include summer bonuses at the end of the year

[NakedPowerOrgan]

Hourly Wall of Shame:

• Fried Frank
  1. Latham ($3.25MM PPP, 24.8% L5Y PPP growth, 3.0 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  2. Paul Hastings ($2.91MM PPP, 28.4% L5Y PPP growth, 2.8 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  3. Akin Gump ($2.39MM PPP, 35.5% L5Y PPP growth, 2.0 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  4. King & Spalding ($2.61MM PPP, 23.8% L5Y PPP growth, 2.1 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  Vinson & Elkins
  5. Shearman & Sterling ($2.32MM PPP, 34.4% L5Y PPP growth, 2.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  6. Gibson Dunn ($3.24MM PPP, 13.3% L5Y PPP growth, 2.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  7. Dechert ($2.68MM PPP, 21.7% L5Y PPP growth, 2.7 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  8. Wilmer ($2.12MM PPP, 31.0% L5Y PPP growth, 2.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  9. Schulte ($2.56MM PPP, 17.7% L5Y PPP growth, 2.6 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  Cooley
  Kramer Levin
  10. Baker Botts ($1.84MM PPP, 26.0% L5Y PPP growth, 1.9 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  11. Alston & Bird ($1.93MM PPP, 11.0% L5Y PPP growth, 1.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  12. Sheppard Mullin ($1.71MM PPP, 26.0% L5Y PPP growth, 2.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)
  13. McDermott ($1.71MM PPP, 14.8% L5Y PPP growth, 1.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)

Why is Greenberg Traurig not on this list, is it conclusive they won’t raise?

They didn't make the cut because of low PPP, stagnant growth, and high leverage. It's conclusive that they won't raise for all offices. I can see them raising in NYC and Chicago and telling everybody else to fuck off. GT deserves a different type of shame than Latham does.