Columbia EIP 2014 Forum

[Anonymous User]

Bidlist: The Sequel. All NYC offices, grades around median. Those in bold are favorites.

Rank Firm
1 Kirkland & Ellis LLP (New York, NY)
2 sidley austin llp (New York, NY)
3 Gibson Dunn
4 mayer brown llp (New York, NY)
5 paul hastings llp (New York, NY)
6 hogan lovells US LLP (New York, NY)
7 Morrison & Foerster LLP (New York, NY)
8 White & Case LLP (New York, NY)
9 Jones Day (New York, NY)
10 Arnold & Porter LLP (New York, NY)
11 Milbank Tweed Hadley & McCloy LLP (New York, NY)
12 Allen & Overy LLP (New York, NY)
13 Clifford Chance US LLP (New York, NY)
14 Willkie Farr & Gallagher LLP (New York, NY)
15 Schulte Roth & Zabel LLP (New York, NY)
16 Akin Gump Strauss Hauer & Feld LLP (New York, NY)
17 Cahill Gordon & Reindel LLP (New York, NY)
18 Ropes & Gray (New York, NY)
19 Greenberg Traurig LLP (New York, NY)
20 Cadwalader Wickersham & Taft LLP (New York, NY)
21 Holland & Knight
22 Baker Botts LLP (New York, NY)
23 goodwin procter llp (New York, NY)
24 O'Melveny & Myers LLP (New York, NY)
25 Fried Frank Harris Shriver & Jacobson LLP (New York, NY)
26 cooley llp (New York, NY)
27 Orrick Herrington & Sutcliffe
28 Hughes Hubbard
29 Baker Hostetler

[smaug_]

I don't have the honors report in front f me, but Gibson might be wasted without stone from what I remember last year.

[Anonymous User]

I don't have the honors report in front f me, but Gibson might be wasted without stone from what I remember last year.

Yeah, they're 85% honors (9/13), so I thought that too, but OCS encouraged me to include it. I didn't feel that I had too many reach firms, so I thought I might as well add it, but I wouldn't be heartbroken if it has to go.

[Anonymous User]

I don't have the honors report in front f me, but Gibson might be wasted without stone from what I remember last year.

Yeah, they're 85% honors (9/13), so I thought that too, but OCS encouraged me to include it. I didn't feel that I had too many reach firms, so I thought I might as well add it, but I wouldn't be heartbroken if it has to go.

I don't think you need to take it off. Having a couple reaches is fine is you are targeting NYC. And most of your bids appear pretty safe so eliminating GDC wouldn't make much of a difference.

[Anonymous User]

I don't have the honors report in front f me, but Gibson might be wasted without stone from what I remember last year.

Yeah, they're 85% honors (9/13), so I thought that too, but OCS encouraged me to include it. I didn't feel that I had too many reach firms, so I thought I might as well add it, but I wouldn't be heartbroken if it has to go.

I don't think you need to take it off. Having a couple reaches is fine is you are targeting NYC. And most of your bids appear pretty safe so eliminating GDC wouldn't make much of a difference.

Given my interests, I've been told that Debevoise could be a good reach firm too (27/40 honors offers). For a median kid who'll have to rely on interview skills/my winning personality, which one do you think is a better bet?

[Anonymous User]

I don't have the honors report in front f me, but Gibson might be wasted without stone from what I remember last year.

Yeah, they're 85% honors (9/13), so I thought that too, but OCS encouraged me to include it. I didn't feel that I had too many reach firms, so I thought I might as well add it, but I wouldn't be heartbroken if it has to go.

I don't think you need to take it off. Having a couple reaches is fine is you are targeting NYC. And most of your bids appear pretty safe so eliminating GDC wouldn't make much of a difference.

Given my interests, I've been told that Debevoise could be a good reach firm too (27/40 honors offers). For a median kid who'll have to rely on interview skills/my winning personality, which one do you think is a better bet?

They're probably similar but I want to say Debevoise based on its larger class. However, it also appears to be more popular in general so I'm not positive what would be better.

[Anonymous User]

Given my interests, I've been told that Debevoise could be a good reach firm too (27/40 honors offers). For a median kid who'll have to rely on interview skills/my winning personality, which one do you think is a better bet?

What are your interests? If you want to do transactional work, shoot for Debevoise. If you want to do litigation, try to get Gibson.

[Anonymous User]

What's the deal with Weil? Is it as non grade selective as its honors percentage suggests?

[Anonymous User]

Given my interests, I've been told that Debevoise could be a good reach firm too (27/40 honors offers). For a median kid who'll have to rely on interview skills/my winning personality, which one do you think is a better bet?

What are your interests? If you want to do transactional work, shoot for Debevoise. If you want to do litigation, try to get Gibson.

Litigation (soft IP)--both have pretty strong practices, but I understand that Debevoise is better known for its transnational practice.

[Anonymous User]

3L chiming in here. First off, good luck everyone. You'll all do great! Secondly, I heard people were making some remarks regarding Davis Polk's M&A practice so I figured I'd hop on here and chime in, as a person actually working in Davis Polk's M&A practice currently and who has worked previously in another. It's true that League Table results last year were skewed by the financial representation on one particularly large matter, but financial advisor representation is a fraction of the total book and most peer law firms, judging by my time at another law firm and a casual survey of others' deal listings, do commensurate financial advisory service. I will say that it is true that Davis Polk has not always had the largest nor most prestigious M&A practice, but the comments about losing market share in the public space recently and not having any PE practice are just wrong. Of all the headline deals this year, Davis Polk has been on the vast majority of them . . . read Comcast (nearly $100B with antitrust spin-offs), AstraZeneca ($125B at last bid), Tyson (not super large but an interesting hostile) . . . and has had numerous other public representations that aren't publically announced or that are ongoing. Furthermore, while PE has never been the primary thrust of the DPW practice, we are a growth player in this space and work with all the best shops. As a summer, I'm staffed on nearly a half a billion dollars of PE stuff right now and our market share is growing, not decreasing. So when I was deciding, the decision was if you want to do big public deals, Wachtell is the place, if you want to only do private equity, STB is the best. But if you want to do a mix of the largest and most interesting public deals and a healthy and growing amount of PE work, Davis Polk has an ideal practice. And we'll see where the League Tables leave us after all is said and done this year, but just surveying Dealbook, Davis Polk has put in an excellent showing this year so far and I can see a little of what is in the deal pipeline and its likely we’ll end up at or near #1 again this year.

[Anonymous User]

Very rough 1st draft of a bidlist. High Stone, no work experience, thinking transactional but open to litigation , not really sure what I'm doing. (All NY offices).

1. Proskauer
2. Shearman & Sterling
3. Sidley Austin
4. Gibson Dunn
5. Skadden
6. Paul Hastings
7. Wilmer Hale
8. Debevoise & Plimpton
9. White & Case
10. Weil
11. Sullivan & Cromwell
12. Latham & Watkins
13. Clifford Chance
14. Ropes & Gray
15. Paul Weiss
16. Covington & Burling
17. Freshfields
18.
19. Cleary Gottlieb
20. Davis Polk & Wardwell
21. Goodwin Procter
22. Cravath
23. O’Melveny & Myers LLP
24. Chadbourne & Parke
25. Dechert LLP
26.
27.
28. Wachtell
29. Simpson Thacher
30. Boies Schiller (Corporate)

Edited to add: As an aside, is the font size on Symplicity a little weird for anyone else?

[Anonymous User]

"Solid" grades doesn't mean much. Median? Above median? How far into Stone?

Also, you've got Covington twice - is that a reference to the DC office, or a slip-up? You might try firms like Cahill or Willkie for the remaining.

Edit: Thanks for the edits. What about Milbank on your list? They do certain corporate things very well, or at least as well as some of your other choices. It seems pretty well done though as far as rankings go, to be honest.

[MCFC]

.

[Anonymous User]

Finally finished my list (I think). As you can see, I'm basically committed to the DC and TX markets. I know I'm 6 spots short, but I'm open to suggestions. I'm also going to do ~7 mass mail apps for firms that don't allow multiple interviews, or aren't coming to EIP.

Just below Stone w/ work experience.

1. Skadden NY
2. Sidley DC
3. Akin Gump DC
4. Williams & Connolly DC
5. Arnold & Porter DC
6. Covington DC
7. WilmerHale DC
8. Haynes and Boone DAL
9. Wachtell NY
10. Boies Schiller DC
11. Mayer Brown DC
12. Gibson Dunn DC
13. Weil DAL
14. Mayer Brown HOU
15. Sidley DAL
16. Jones Day DAL
17. Bickel Brewer DAL
18. Davis Polk CA-Menlo
19. Latham DC
20. Steptoe & Johnson DC
21. Susman HOU
22. Skadden DC
23. Kirkland DC
24. Vinson Elkins TX


-Leia

[Tiago Splitter]

Finally finished my list (I think). As you can see, I'm basically committed to the DC and TX markets. I know I'm 6 spots short, but I'm open to suggestions. I'm also going to do ~7 mass mail apps for firms that don't allow multiple interviews, or aren't coming to EIP.

Just below Stone w/ work experience.

1. Skadden NY
2. Sidley DC
3. Akin Gump DC
4. Williams & Connolly DC
5. Arnold & Porter DC
6. Covington DC
7. WilmerHale DC
8. Haynes and Boone DAL
9. Wachtell NY
10. Boies Schiller DC
11. Mayer Brown DC
12. Gibson Dunn DC
13. Weil DAL
14. Mayer Brown HOU
15. Sidley DAL
16. Jones Day DAL
17. Bickel Brewer DAL
18. Davis Polk CA-Menlo
19. Latham DC
20. Steptoe & Johnson DC
21. Susman HOU
22. Skadden DC
23. Kirkland DC
24. Vinson Elkins TX


-Leia

Many of these offices will instantly ding you because of your grades. If you want to avoid striking out, you need to put a bunch of less selective NYC offices on there.

[Anonymous User]

Better?

1.Proskauer NY
2. Sidley DC
3. Akin Gump DC
4. Williams & Connolly DC
5. Arnold & Porter DC
6. Skadden NY
7. Covington DC
8. WilmerHale DC
9. Debevoise NY
10. Haynes and Boone DAL
11. Wachtell NY
12. Weil NY
13. Mayer Brown DC
14. Gibson Dunn DC
15. Schulte Roth NY
16. Willkie NY
17. Boies Schiller DC
18. Weil DAL
19. Mayer Brown HOU
20. Sidley DAL
21. Jones Day DAL
22. Bickel Brewer DAL
23. Davis Polk CA-Menlo
24. Latham DC
25. Steptoe & Johnson DC
26. Cravath NY
27. Susman HOU
28. Skadden DC
29. Kirkland DC
30. Vinson Elkins TX

-Leia

[smaug_]

No, that bid list is still wildly wildly optimistic. It's good that you have some less selective firms added, but there are a number of firms there that will trash your resume as soon as you leave the room. If you're a diversity candidate and someone from an affinity group told you otherwise, please ignore what I'm saying but please go talk to someone in that group to see what is reasonable given your grades. I'd expect that these firms are still way out of your reach.

From your list:

Williams & Connolly DC <- might give an offer or two to Columbia students, period. They will be amazing candidates.
Covington DC<- similar to the above
WilmerHale DC <- same
Debevoise NY <- talk to current debevoise summers/past associates and see if they can get you in, otherwise it'll be a stretch
Wachtell NY won't touch that GPA
Mayer Brown DC same
Gibson Dunn DC assuredly the same
Cravath NY I'd guess this is very difficult w/o Stone (and normally higher)
Susman HOU <- probably will not hire a Columbia student


Your list has some of the most selective offices of the most selective firms that come to EIP.
You really need to look into less selective firms and take time to talk with OCS.

[Tiago Splitter]

Why are you wasting high bids on extraordinary grade selective offices like Wachtell, Williams and Connolly, Covington DC, and WilmerHale DC? I think your best bet is to split your bids between NYC and Texas (assuming you have Texas ties.) DC is incredibly difficult even for people with good grades. You can then add some DC offices in add/drop as a handful will likely be available, and you can always mass mail there. But if you want a job you need to play it much safer.

[Anonymous User]

Agree with Smaug and would also add A&P and Covington to the list of auto-dings for you. Should really reconsider where you stand grade-wise in relation to firm cutoffs and start from scratch with a new list

[Anonymous User]

1) It's really messed up that above a B+ at Columbia is an auto-ding anywhere
2) Thanks for the advice, I'll make a more NY focused list and just sprinkle some DC in there.

-Leia

[Anonymous User]

1) It's really messed up that above a B+ at Columbia is an auto-ding anywhere
2) Thanks for the advice, I'll make a more NY focused list and just sprinkle some DC in there.

-Leia

A GPA above B+ at Columbia will carry you far into great firms, you just happened to pick the elite of the elite that require a GPA above A- at Columbia. That's all.

[smaug_]

1) It's really messed up that above a B+ at Columbia is an auto-ding anywhere
2) Thanks for the advice, I'll make a more NY focused list and just sprinkle some DC in there.

-Leia

A GPA above B+ at Columbia will carry you far into great firms, you just happened to pick the elite of the elite that require a GPA above A- at Columbia. That's all.

Exactly this. It's not meant as a jab at you or what you can do. You can land a great firm with your grades, you just need to recognize that you're solidly middle of the pack when it comes to grades. Some firms are really picky about grades and only want people with amazing grades. Some firms are really picky about personality and only want people that are fun to work with.

Figure out exactly what you want, why you want it, and which firms fit best with that.

Looking at your list, I generally assumed you wanted lit (Susman) but you're not interviewing with a number of firms that do great lit work in those markets. So, go through Chambers, talk to upperclassmen, talk to OCS and come up with a list of firms that suits your interests, and build a bid list from there.

[Anonymous User]

1) It's really messed up that above a B+ at Columbia is an auto-ding anywhere
2) Thanks for the advice, I'll make a more NY focused list and just sprinkle some DC in there.

-Leia

1) above is far from the truth, median at Columbia seems to open up as many or more firms than basically any school not yale. You're auto-ding at firms that only draw from the top of the class, period - post Wachtell, Susman, Boies, W&C and a bunch of top DC offices in any oci thread and you'd generate the same responses.

As others have said, a lot of great firms - in fact, most firms - pull below Stone, including several of the V20 NYC. For example, I think debevoise and sidley NY are fine choices to leave on your list, same with Jones Day and Mayer Brown in NY.

-little finger

[Anonymous User]

Nothing but appreciation for y'alls advice.

-Leia

[lunaraeon]

Nothing but appreciation for y'alls advice.

-Leia

Leia, might be helpful to check the Offer-By-Honors report it's rough, but gives a sense of where to bid.