Help me decide: Skadden, S&C, K&E, Latham, DPW Forum

[Anonymous User]

I don't fully understand why DPW's M&A group isn't seen as on par with S&C. When you look at the league tables, both in terms of total $ and $ per deal, the numbers are incredibly similar and they routinely handle huge deals like S&C. Is it because DPW is being more seen as fin-services M&A or because they are generally seen as better in Cap Markets? I get no one is saying that DPW is materially worse than S&C, but I don't fully understand that, outside of Wachtell, DPW/S&C/Cravath aren't seen on equal footing for M&A.

It's true that historically these are peer firms on league tables. For whatever reason, this year DPW is trailing behind significantly. The H1 volume of the other firms you mentioned was twice as much as DPW's.

I mean, if you really want to rely on the most recent mergermarket figures, White & Case has been shitting on everyone in M&A deal value since last year.

[Anonymous User]

I don't fully understand why DPW's M&A group isn't seen as on par with S&C. When you look at the league tables, both in terms of total $ and $ per deal, the numbers are incredibly similar and they routinely handle huge deals like S&C. Is it because DPW is being more seen as fin-services M&A or because they are generally seen as better in Cap Markets? I get no one is saying that DPW is materially worse than S&C, but I don't fully understand that, outside of Wachtell, DPW/S&C/Cravath aren't seen on equal footing for M&A.

It's true that historically these are peer firms on league tables. For whatever reason, this year DPW is trailing behind significantly. The H1 volume of the other firms you mentioned was twice as much as DPW's.

I mean, if you really want to rely on the most recent mergermarket figures, White & Case has been shitting on everyone in M&A deal value since last year.

(W&C) having one really good year doesn't mean much unless it lasts, but I guess having a bad year when the market is red hot should at least raise some questions.

[Anonymous User]

I've noticed that Latham comes last in almost all of these polls involving elite firms -- and behind firms with lower Vault rankings. Is the firm overrated?

Latham's vault rank comes from an incredibly broad nation-wide practice (strong presences in DC, Chi, TX and CA) in additional to super high revenue stemming from its massive size. On the other hand, a lot of the lower ranked firms discussed are pretty NYC centric (with a few outposts in other states - DPW/S&C particularly) and smaller (1/3 or 1/4 the size of Latham). As such, the ranking isn't really representative of quality, especially when talking specifically NYC.

I don't know how well this logic can be exported out to K&E or Skadden

[Anonymous User]

If you want Chicago, K&E.

If you want NYC, whichever you liked most between S&C or DPW. Skadden/Latham/Kirkland are not peer firms to S&C and DPW in NYC

Hope this helps.

[Anonymous User]

Bump

[Anonymous User]

If you want Chicago, K&E.

If you want NYC, whichever you liked most between S&C or DPW. Skadden/Latham/Kirkland are not peer firms to S&C and DPW in NYC

Hope this helps.

Lol @ K&E/LW not peer firms.

First, at this level, the exit opps and experience is not materially different.

Second, league tables denoting the volume/size of deals is hardly a good indicator of quality of experience, complexity of work done, etc.

Third, there are other more important considerations here than vault rankings. S&C/DPW/Skadden all have stringent face-time requirements and are old-schooly in all the shitty ways (older partners who are not accessible/relatable; old school thinking of every junior should just be grateful they've been deemed worthy of working here, etc.) K&E/LW both are very friendly with WFH, have younger/new-school culture and pay above market in bonuses. Also, a good amount of associates at a firm like Skadden don't get their preferred practice area after the rotational.

OP - first decide between Chicago vs. NYC. Then decide what you want out of your career and what work environment sounds more aligned with your goals and lifestyle. Once we're talking about the V10 firms, all this nonsense about rankings and league tables goes out the window - pick the place you are most likely to succeed to achieve your desired goals.

[Anonymous User]

If you want Chicago, K&E.

If you want NYC, whichever you liked most between S&C or DPW. Skadden/Latham/Kirkland are not peer firms to S&C and DPW in NYC

Hope this helps.

Could you clarify why you think Skadden is not a peer firm of S&C or DPW in NY? Sure, they're both slightly more selective than Skadden but is that it? Seems like this stance is pretty outdated based on the past 10 years' data but willing to hear ya out.

[Anonymous User]

bump

[Anonymous User]

If you want Chicago, K&E.

If you want NYC, whichever you liked most between S&C or DPW. Skadden/Latham/Kirkland are not peer firms to S&C and DPW in NYC

Hope this helps.

+1

Skadden summers can protest and make lots of valid data driven arguments for why this is unfair, and Latham/Kirkland attorneys can profess the benefits of their lax culture; but for better or worse, this is what the street and the higher end legal market thinks. Feel free to ignore that and go with Latham or Skadden, but realize that you’re doing so for fit.

[Anonymous User]

If you want Chicago, K&E.

If you want NYC, whichever you liked most between S&C or DPW. Skadden/Latham/Kirkland are not peer firms to S&C and DPW in NYC

Hope this helps.

+1

Skadden summers can protest and make lots of valid data driven arguments for why this is unfair, and Latham/Kirkland attorneys can profess the benefits of their lax culture; but for better or worse, this is what the street and the higher end legal market thinks. Feel free to ignore that and go with Latham or Skadden, but realize that you’re doing so for fit.

LOL @ law students making assumptions about what firms are peers and what are not. I did my second look with DPW and their partner voluntarily brought up skadden and latham as peer firms

[Anonymous User]

If you want Chicago, K&E.

If you want NYC, whichever you liked most between S&C or DPW. Skadden/Latham/Kirkland are not peer firms to S&C and DPW in NYC

Hope this helps.

+1

Skadden summers can protest and make lots of valid data driven arguments for why this is unfair, and Latham/Kirkland attorneys can profess the benefits of their lax culture; but for better or worse, this is what the street and the higher end legal market thinks. Feel free to ignore that and go with Latham or Skadden, but realize that you’re doing so for fit.

LOL @ law students making assumptions about what firms are peers and what are not. I did my second look with DPW and their partner voluntarily brought up skadden and latham as peer firms

This is the anon you’re immediately quoting. I’m a senior associate who has worked at several firms including one of those listed. It sounds more likely that you are the law student, fresh off a second look, and speaking out of turn.

Sure, they are peers, broadly speaking; they operate in the same space and certainly compete for deals and find themselves across from each other all the time. Those are not the only factors that feed into market perception here.

[Anonymous User]

If you want Chicago, K&E.

If you want NYC, whichever you liked most between S&C or DPW. Skadden/Latham/Kirkland are not peer firms to S&C and DPW in NYC

Hope this helps.

+1

Skadden summers can protest and make lots of valid data driven arguments for why this is unfair, and Latham/Kirkland attorneys can profess the benefits of their lax culture; but for better or worse, this is what the street and the higher end legal market thinks. Feel free to ignore that and go with Latham or Skadden, but realize that you’re doing so for fit.

LOL @ law students making assumptions about what firms are peers and what are not. I did my second look with DPW and their partner voluntarily brought up skadden and latham as peer firms

This is the anon you’re immediately quoting. I’m a senior associate who has worked at several firms including one of those listed. It sounds more likely that you are the law student, fresh off a second look, and speaking out of turn.

Sure, they are peers, broadly speaking; they operate in the same space and certainly compete for deals and find themselves across from each other all the time. Those are not the only factors that feed into market perception here.

Honestly, the "senior associate" sounds more like a law student to me. As a NY corp associate who works across from all of these firms, Skadden is clearly a peer and Latham will be in a couple years given its current trajectory.

[Anonymous User]

If you want Chicago, K&E.

If you want NYC, whichever you liked most between S&C or DPW. Skadden/Latham/Kirkland are not peer firms to S&C and DPW in NYC

Hope this helps.

+1

Skadden summers can protest and make lots of valid data driven arguments for why this is unfair, and Latham/Kirkland attorneys can profess the benefits of their lax culture; but for better or worse, this is what the street and the higher end legal market thinks. Feel free to ignore that and go with Latham or Skadden, but realize that you’re doing so for fit.

LOL @ law students making assumptions about what firms are peers and what are not. I did my second look with DPW and their partner voluntarily brought up skadden and latham as peer firms

This is the anon you’re immediately quoting. I’m a senior associate who has worked at several firms including one of those listed. It sounds more likely that you are the law student, fresh off a second look, and speaking out of turn.

Sure, they are peers, broadly speaking; they operate in the same space and certainly compete for deals and find themselves across from each other all the time. Those are not the only factors that feed into market perception here.

Honestly, the "senior associate" sounds more like a law student to me. As a NY corp associate who works across from all of these firms, Skadden is clearly a peer and Latham will be in a couple years given its current trajectory.

Lol at anons on a law SCHOOL forum bickering about who's legit.

[almostperfectt]

If you want Chicago, K&E.

If you want NYC, whichever you liked most between S&C or DPW. Skadden/Latham/Kirkland are not peer firms to S&C and DPW in NYC

Hope this helps.

+1

Skadden summers can protest and make lots of valid data driven arguments for why this is unfair, and Latham/Kirkland attorneys can profess the benefits of their lax culture; but for better or worse, this is what the street and the higher end legal market thinks. Feel free to ignore that and go with Latham or Skadden, but realize that you’re doing so for fit.

LOL @ law students making assumptions about what firms are peers and what are not. I did my second look with DPW and their partner voluntarily brought up skadden and latham as peer firms

This is the anon you’re immediately quoting. I’m a senior associate who has worked at several firms including one of those listed. It sounds more likely that you are the law student, fresh off a second look, and speaking out of turn.

Sure, they are peers, broadly speaking; they operate in the same space and certainly compete for deals and find themselves across from each other all the time. Those are not the only factors that feed into market perception here.

Honestly, the "senior associate" sounds more like a law student to me. As a NY corp associate who works across from all of these firms, Skadden is clearly a peer and Latham will be in a couple years given its current trajectory.

Lol at anons on a law SCHOOL forum bickering about who's legit.

This is part of the issue of people abusing anon when not revealing sensitive information. Including your post.