Workload after giving notice in biglaw Forum

[rpupkin]

This is very dangerous advice. At my firm it is common for people to give their 2 weeks notice and be asked to leave at the end of that same week. The exception is when the person still has a lot of active work that is not easily offloaded - not the fact pattern you describe. Big law is not the sort of place that they'd knowingly pay someone to sit around for 4-6 weeks doing nothing.

I've done this for close to 10 years. I have and had friends and classmates and acquaintances in probably a hundred firms. I have never once heard this. Nor have I seen it. Nor have I seen it from opposing counsel (many, many times people quit on opposing deal teams. They'll be transitioned off quickly, but their email always works for 2-3 more weeks and they respond to transition to new associate). Biglaw standard operating procedure is to take you off matters immediately and not give you anything new, but nobody gets escorted out sooner than they request, assuming nothing outlandish, like giving more than a month or two notice, in which case they would keep you staffed. I strongly suspect you have no idea what you're talking about, or if it is true, what you're talking about isn't biglaw. I could see it happening at some ID mill.

I had the same reaction to the anon's post.

[Lincoln]

This is very dangerous advice. At my firm it is common for people to give their 2 weeks notice and be asked to leave at the end of that same week. The exception is when the person still has a lot of active work that is not easily offloaded - not the fact pattern you describe. Big law is not the sort of place that they'd knowingly pay someone to sit around for 4-6 weeks doing nothing.

I've done this for close to 10 years. I have and had friends and classmates and acquaintances in probably a hundred firms. I have never once heard this. Nor have I seen it. Nor have I seen it from opposing counsel (many, many times people quit on opposing deal teams. They'll be transitioned off quickly, but their email always works for 2-3 more weeks and they respond to transition to new associate). Biglaw standard operating procedure is to take you off matters immediately and not give you anything new, but nobody gets escorted out sooner than they request, assuming nothing outlandish, like giving more than a month or two notice, in which case they would keep you staffed. I strongly suspect you have no idea what you're talking about, or if it is true, what you're talking about isn't biglaw. I could see it happening at some ID mill.

I had the same reaction to the anon's post.

+1

[Anonymous User]

Tip from a super senior associate:

Take a week long (two if possible) vacation prior to giving notice. Then give 3-4 weeks notice. You notice trends after so long in this job. Smart kids did this at 10x the rate stupid kids did. Trick is to give short enough notice that they won't staff you (my firm has strict if unwritten policies about staffing people who have given notice), but be off your deals.

= 4-6 weeks of no work at BIGLAW pay.

You're welcome in advance.

This is very dangerous advice. At my firm it is common for people to give their 2 weeks notice and be asked to leave at the end of that same week. The exception is when the person still has a lot of active work that is not easily offloaded - not the fact pattern you describe. Big law is not the sort of place that they'd knowingly pay someone to sit around for 4-6 weeks doing nothing.

I've done this for close to 10 years. I have and had friends and classmates and acquaintances in probably a hundred firms. I have never once heard this. Nor have I seen it. Nor have I seen it from opposing counsel (many, many times people quit on opposing deal teams. They'll be transitioned off quickly, but their email always works for 2-3 more weeks and they respond to transition to new associate). Biglaw standard operating procedure is to take you off matters immediately and not give you anything new, but nobody gets escorted out sooner than they request, assuming nothing outlandish, like giving more than a month or two notice, in which case they would keep you staffed. I strongly suspect you have no idea what you're talking about, or if it is true, what you're talking about isn't biglaw. I could see it happening at some ID mill.

Only thing even close to this is that one firm (very highly regarded), will ask that you not come in if you're not on any active deals if and only if you're going to a competitor firm. They'll still pay you for your entire notice period, up to 3-4 weeks. I believe they see it as a potential conflict of interest to be avoided.

I'm the other anon who basically said the same thing. Felt compelled to the respond given the bolded. The firm I left is a biglaw v25 firm, major market, and what I said is 100% true. It's not a SullCrom sweatshop but it's not some lifestyle firm either. I was in litigation and everyone else is talking about "deals", but I didn't exaggerate at all. Wasn't giving advice though, was just providing an anecdote. And I will also say that some partners who had served as recommenders or knew I was leaving specifically said not to give my notice until 2 weeks, thinking they'd just ax me right then. Not exactly sure why, but I went the other way and gave the 2 months and it was awesome. I do remember being gone and having to fly back for literally one day to handle something in court but then leaving again the next day. I definitely could have burned some bridges but eventually had an offer to come back so I did not.

[BernieTrump]

Tip from a super senior associate:

Take a week long (two if possible) vacation prior to giving notice. Then give 3-4 weeks notice. You notice trends after so long in this job. Smart kids did this at 10x the rate stupid kids did. Trick is to give short enough notice that they won't staff you (my firm has strict if unwritten policies about staffing people who have given notice), but be off your deals.

= 4-6 weeks of no work at BIGLAW pay.

You're welcome in advance.

This is very dangerous advice. At my firm it is common for people to give their 2 weeks notice and be asked to leave at the end of that same week. The exception is when the person still has a lot of active work that is not easily offloaded - not the fact pattern you describe. Big law is not the sort of place that they'd knowingly pay someone to sit around for 4-6 weeks doing nothing.

I've done this for close to 10 years. I have and had friends and classmates and acquaintances in probably a hundred firms. I have never once heard this. Nor have I seen it. Nor have I seen it from opposing counsel (many, many times people quit on opposing deal teams. They'll be transitioned off quickly, but their email always works for 2-3 more weeks and they respond to transition to new associate). Biglaw standard operating procedure is to take you off matters immediately and not give you anything new, but nobody gets escorted out sooner than they request, assuming nothing outlandish, like giving more than a month or two notice, in which case they would keep you staffed. I strongly suspect you have no idea what you're talking about, or if it is true, what you're talking about isn't biglaw. I could see it happening at some ID mill.

Only thing even close to this is that one firm (very highly regarded), will ask that you not come in if you're not on any active deals if and only if you're going to a competitor firm. They'll still pay you for your entire notice period, up to 3-4 weeks. I believe they see it as a potential conflict of interest to be avoided.

I'm the other anon who basically said the same thing. Felt compelled to the respond given the bolded. The firm I left is a biglaw v25 firm, major market, and what I said is 100% true. It's not a SullCrom sweatshop but it's not some lifestyle firm either. I was in litigation and everyone else is talking about "deals", but I didn't exaggerate at all. Wasn't giving advice though, was just providing an anecdote. And I will also say that some partners who had served as recommenders or knew I was leaving specifically said not to give my notice until 2 weeks, thinking they'd just ax me right then. Not exactly sure why, but I went the other way and gave the 2 months and it was awesome. I do remember being gone and having to fly back for literally one day to handle something in court but then leaving again the next day. I definitely could have burned some bridges but eventually had an offer to come back so I did not.

I'm not sure we are disagreeing. You gave two months, and they didn't fire you, and it was awesome. My advice was to do exactly what you did, but with a little less notice.

The only difference is that "friendly" partners told you the group might fire you if you gave more than 2 weeks? The same partners that would have had to do the work and/or restaff you immediately if you gave formal notice?

I've never heard of what you're saying before, but you might want to look at the incentives there. Firm clearly has a policy of not really working associates after notice (like every other firm). If you think it was just a few partners in your group who knew of your plan, you're crazy. Stuff like this gets emailed around instantly to the group partner list as soon as someone mentions it even informally. The few "friendly" partners give you a piece of advice that benefits them, at your expense.

Nobody actually gets fired for giving 4 weeks instead of 2. Would actually be an economically stupid decision for firms (if the difference is more than a small period of time, associate able to take unemployment, have state law rights in CA).

[Anonymous User]

Tip from a super senior associate:

Take a week long (two if possible) vacation prior to giving notice. Then give 3-4 weeks notice. You notice trends after so long in this job. Smart kids did this at 10x the rate stupid kids did. Trick is to give short enough notice that they won't staff you (my firm has strict if unwritten policies about staffing people who have given notice), but be off your deals.

= 4-6 weeks of no work at BIGLAW pay.

You're welcome in advance.

This is very dangerous advice. At my firm it is common for people to give their 2 weeks notice and be asked to leave at the end of that same week. The exception is when the person still has a lot of active work that is not easily offloaded - not the fact pattern you describe. Big law is not the sort of place that they'd knowingly pay someone to sit around for 4-6 weeks doing nothing.

I've done this for close to 10 years. I have and had friends and classmates and acquaintances in probably a hundred firms. I have never once heard this. Nor have I seen it. Nor have I seen it from opposing counsel (many, many times people quit on opposing deal teams. They'll be transitioned off quickly, but their email always works for 2-3 more weeks and they respond to transition to new associate). Biglaw standard operating procedure is to take you off matters immediately and not give you anything new, but nobody gets escorted out sooner than they request, assuming nothing outlandish, like giving more than a month or two notice, in which case they would keep you staffed. I strongly suspect you have no idea what you're talking about, or if it is true, what you're talking about isn't biglaw. I could see it happening at some ID mill.

Only thing even close to this is that one firm (very highly regarded), will ask that you not come in if you're not on any active deals if and only if you're going to a competitor firm. They'll still pay you for your entire notice period, up to 3-4 weeks. I believe they see it as a potential conflict of interest to be avoided.

I'm the other anon who basically said the same thing. Felt compelled to the respond given the bolded. The firm I left is a biglaw v25 firm, major market, and what I said is 100% true. It's not a SullCrom sweatshop but it's not some lifestyle firm either. I was in litigation and everyone else is talking about "deals", but I didn't exaggerate at all. Wasn't giving advice though, was just providing an anecdote. And I will also say that some partners who had served as recommenders or knew I was leaving specifically said not to give my notice until 2 weeks, thinking they'd just ax me right then. Not exactly sure why, but I went the other way and gave the 2 months and it was awesome. I do remember being gone and having to fly back for literally one day to handle something in court but then leaving again the next day. I definitely could have burned some bridges but eventually had an offer to come back so I did not.

I'm not sure we are disagreeing. You gave two months, and they didn't fire you, and it was awesome. My advice was to do exactly what you did, but with a little less notice.

The only difference is that "friendly" partners told you the group might fire you if you gave more than 2 weeks? The same partners that would have had to do the work and/or restaff you immediately if you gave formal notice?

I've never heard of what you're saying before, but you might want to look at the incentives there. Firm clearly has a policy of not really working associates after notice (like every other firm). If you think it was just a few partners in your group who knew of your plan, you're crazy. Stuff like this gets emailed around instantly to the group partner list as soon as someone mentions it even informally. The few "friendly" partners give you a piece of advice that benefits them, at your expense.

Nobody actually gets fired for giving 4 weeks instead of 2. Would actually be an economically stupid decision for firms (if the difference is more than a small period of time, associate able to take unemployment, have state law rights in CA).

What looks better? 1) Taking a 3-4 week vacation, then giving a two week notice when you get back (and attempting to get your deals covered before you leave), or 2) taking two weeks of vacation and then giving a month of notice (still trying to get my deals covered so I don't have much work after I come back). 3rd/4th year at a v50 with unlimited vacation.

Issue I'm running into is I would need to take the vacation soon (taking bar in new state soon and need to start studying soon) and wouldn't be able to give my teams much notice of that.

[Anonymous User]

Just want to chime in - when I gave my 2 weeks notice unexpectedly (I.e. I wasn’t told to go look for another job in a review or anything) at my old v60, I was walked out the door the same day. My old firm had a history of doing this, so I cleared out my office the night before giving notice, tried to have everything ready to transition (emails teed up, etc), and generally be ready. Gave my notice to the partners, said I’ll be around for a few weeks. I was walked down to hr, had my exit interview right then, waited until IT came by hr’s office to take my cell phone, and then was escorted out. Apparently it’s standard operating procedure at my v60. Anyway it was great - didn’t have to sit around awkwardly for a few week and I got paid for it.

[Anonymous User]

I recently gave my two weeks. I’m still getting staffed on new assignments and the partners are telling me they’ll transition the work once I leave. I’m working weekends and pulling close to all-nighters. One of my friends who also recently left the firm was told to do the work but not bill it to the client.

[Anonymous User]

I've lateraled twice and both times I did nothing after giving two weeks' notice except transition my matters. I wasn't staffed on anything new and basically got paid for doing nothing. This is the norm in my experience. That said, multiple friends of mine have been escorted out the same day they've given notice, so be prepared for that possibility.

[Anonymous User]

I recently gave my two weeks. I’m still getting staffed on new assignments and the partners are telling me they’ll transition the work once I leave. I’m working weekends and pulling close to all-nighters. One of my friends who also recently left the firm was told to do the work but not bill it to the client.

Serious question - why? I can understand a concern about burning bridges as the basis for not doing nothing at all, or even for billing 8 hours a day during your notice period. But why not just... not do this?

[Dcc617]

When I told one senior I was leaving and that I’d help transition as needed, he told me that he thought we could crank a bunch of stuff out before I left so wouldn’t need to restaff.

I started waiting a full business day to respond to his emails. 3 days later he restaffed me.

They’ll drain every last bit out of you if you let them. So don’t let them. They have zero leverage, and you’re not going to blow up your reputation you’ve spent years building because you coast during your notice period.

[Anonymous User]

In my corp group I saw the whole gamut of workloads upon leaving. All pre-Covid, so it was in the office, but one person started leaving earlier every day and arriving later, and by the end she was just scrolling on her phone and leaving at 3:00. She did transition her matters, but by the end there was nothing to do. One guy, who in all fairness had been very busy and was on several hectic deals, was in the office late getting stuff done until the end and was pretty peeved. I remember him saying he was annoyed to be in late enough to get comped dinner after giving notice. The real hero was one other person who was having a sort of casual exit process conversation with one the primary partners she worked for, and, the story goes, he said something snide, she got triggered, told him what she thought of him, and that was her last day in the office (wasn't walked out by security or anything, but they told her she could work from home for her notice). When I was on the way out it was mid-deal and I pulling all nighters and super slammed for a week and then I snapped out of it, wrote a polite e-mail to the partner on the deal and told them I was happy to be available for ongoing queries and transitional assistance, but as a rule wouldn't be at my computer in the evenings or weekends. No pushback.

[Anonymous User]

They’ll drain every last bit out of you if you let them. So don’t let them. They have zero leverage, and you’re not going to blow up your reputation you’ve spent years building because you coast during your notice period.

thanks, this is super helpful. i'm a few days into my notice period and have had some partners trying to pile on work before i head out. since yesterday i've been politely declining the annoying hectic work and saying yes to the easier stuff. no pushback so far.

[Anonymous User]

When I told one senior I was leaving and that I’d help transition as needed, he told me that he thought we could crank a bunch of stuff out before I left so wouldn’t need to restaff.

I started waiting a full business day to respond to his emails. 3 days later he restaffed me.

They’ll drain every last bit out of you if you let them. So don’t let them. They have zero leverage, and you’re not going to blow up your reputation you’ve spent years building because you coast during your notice period.

Facts. I left for an in-house job and this senior wanted me to help crank through documents ahead of schedule *and* assist with some non-billable work. I straight up did not respond to emails on the latter and did just enough to keep the deal moving on my end. Still have a great relationship with the partners and will never interact with this senior again (fingers crossed).

[Anonymous User]

Both times I've quit I didn't do a whole lot. I did my best to transition what I could and get people up to speed and then basically didn't do shit. I've known people that get absolutely dumped on (including their last day!) but realistically, you have all the leverage, ESPECIALLY when going in house. Silence or no is a good answer.