Want to save the world? Do Biglaw! Forum

[Old Gregg]

Also, being able to skate by in NYC isn't "wealth" either. Wealth, at the very least, is positive net worth. How much positive is up for debate, but we can all agree that if your net worth is less than zero, you are far from wealthy.

[Anonymous User]

I complain about biglaw as much as the next guy but it's preposterous to say that biglaw attorneys aren't "well paid."

just looking at salaries isnt enough. $160k without debt is A LOT of money, and id consider biglaw attorneys well paid along those lines.

But $160k with $250k student loans? no way.

Sorry, but dixiecupdrinking is right. You could be faced with $250K student loans on a lot less than BigLaw salary, or even no job at all. Don't complain about having to service your loans with $160K salary. Imagine servicing it on $50 or $60K.

With arguing skillz like this, no wonder you are servicing on 60k.

Hardly an argument, just an observation about how easy it is to lose perspective.

[Old Gregg]

Hardly an argument, just an observation about how easy it is to lose perspective.

1) No reason for any of your posts ITT to be anonymous. Easy to make bullshit argumen... err sorry... observations, when you don't have to stand by them.
2) Also similarly easy to strawman my point.
3) See point re: wealth above.

Also, LOL@you if you're servicing $250k debt on a $60k salary. There's my perspective on that.

[Anonymous User]

I guess I just disagree but it's a matter of perspective. I don't remotely find it a hardship to live in NYC and service loans. I could live better elsewhere I guess, and I wish I weren't throwing money down the federal loan toilet, but I'm maxing 401(k) and haven't ever had to worry about being able to afford anything.

I never said it was a hardship either. My point is that people think corporate associates are very well off and wealthy. You aren't wealthy with six-figure debt and a $160k salary, and are especially not wealthy with those figures in NYC.

So, according to http://money.cnn.com/calculator/pf/cost-of-living/, an LA associate making $160k with debt around $180k, not $250k, should be doing decently alright compared to their NYC counterpart?

At this point, very glad I moved from NYC to LA.

[AReasonableMan]

Public Interest Lawyers are as likely to hurt the world as they are to save it. Rather someone will reoffend is anyone's guess, but if they do the world is worse. If they don't then it is better, because they have a better quality of life and pay taxes. What about the home foreclosure you a stop? Does the lost money mean the bank lays off Martha, and now Martha's kid never goes to college, and resorts to prostitution to make ends meet? At least big law lawyers help their clients without the self righteousness self delusions.

[sinfiery]

So, according to http://money.cnn.com/calculator/pf/cost-of-living/, an LA associate making $160k with debt around $180k, not $250k, should be doing decently alright compared to their NYC counterpart?

At this point, very glad I moved from NYC to LA.

25k in NYC manhattan is suppose to be 9k in Dallas

Having lived in both situations, that is not even close. More like 17-19k in Dallas is 25k in Manhattan. I wouldn't trust a calculator so ridiculously off.

[Old Gregg]

yeah the COL calculators are kind of stupid. there's definitely some truth to it (i.e., we all know MFH is wayyyy more expensive than Dallas), but very difficult to quantify.

Needless to say, if you're making $160k in Dallas, you're doing VERY WELL for yourself. You might even be able to crush it in the Highland Park bars (j/k)...

[Tanicius]

Why are you guys having this debate? It seriously doesn't matter. Most people could make 500k and they still wouldn't donate $40,000 to charity every year.

[jselson]

Public interest lawyers are as likely to hurt the world as they are to save it. Rather someone will reoffend is anyone's guess, but if they do the world is worse. If they don't then it is better, because they have a better quality of life and pay taxes. What about the home foreclosure you a stop? Does the lost money mean the bank lays off Martha, and now Martha's kid never goes to college, and resorts to prostitution to make ends meet? At least big law lawyers help their clients without the self righteousness self delusions.

I'll try to respond to this, although the writing here is almost incomprehensible. (Also, I'm planning on doing BigLaw and have no moral qualms about it.)

I think there are two types of non-government PI people: those who are activists and want to do issue litigation, and those who just want to serve underserved communities. For the former, I don't think they, as a group, have any greater claim to being moral than anyone else - they can only be judged on whatever issue they're pursuing. As to the latter, their argument is not, "I want my poor person to win no matter what," but more, "I want my clients to be able to access and use the law to the same extent that corporate clients can." These folks aren't results-oriented, but process-oriented, and think, rightly, that pro se litigants are going to fare worse than those who have representation and that this is unfair since many of them would have winning, or at least plausible, arguments otherwise. It doesn't matter if you personally think that a particular foreclosure being stopped would be good or bad for the economy; that's an argument you should make to a legislature. What matters is that the laws as written and interpreted are enforced, and the legal system does not uphold law or justice when representation is lacking.

[jselson]

One more thing: I think BigLaw can often be the best way to get into some PI. For the PI area that I would actually be interested in working in, in the community I would want to serve, the organizations basically have no one working there who is straight out of law school. Instead, the lawyers on payroll all seemed to be ex-BigLaw folks who made connections through pro bono work. This is for an urban area, though. I imagine rural areas would likely be different, although whether you would earn enough money to eat going that route might be in doubt.

[B.B. Homemaker]

Corporations need defense attorneys too.

Thank god.