Cornell AJF 2014 + Boston / DC Job Fairs, OCI & Mass Mailing Forum

[Anonymous User]

Hello-

I was hoping we could use this thread to compile some Cornell-specific info about each firm. I was hoping that perhaps various 3ls/ grads could give insight on the firms that are coming to OCI. Info could include anecdotes about the firm (ex: "Cravath people work a lot") and/or your experience with the firm during oci/cb (ex: Paul Weiss "wines and dines you on CB") and/or your experience with the firms selectivity (ex: "I was above average gpa at Jones Day and no CB"). Further info could include if the firm likes Cornell students in the past (Ex: White and Case takes 5+ every day from Cornell) etc or firms that you expected to receive but should have bid higher (ex: "I bid Gibson 3 and didn't get it.").

Below is a list in Vault ranking of the firms I saw coming to Cornell OCI. I'll edit it to add more and fill it any missing. Maybe you guys can quote the list and fill it next to the firm name, similar to what ImNoScar did on page 1 for someone's bidlist.

If we get enough contributors and everyone quotes the previously filled in list, we may get lots of great info compiled in one neat place.

This is not meant to supplant the regular firm research we will be doing.

Thanks!

2: Cravath
3: Sullcrom
4: Skadden
5: Davis Polk
6: Weil Gotshal
7: Simpson Thatche
8: Cleary
9: Kirkland & Ellis
10: Latham
12: Gibson Dunn
13: Debevoise
14: Paul Weiss
15: Williams & Connolly
18: Sidley Austin
19: Jones Day
20: White & Case
21: WilmerHale
23: Ropes & Gray
24: MoFo
25: O’Melveny & Meyers
26: Clifford Chance
27: Shearman & Sterling
28: Paul Hastings
29: Akin Gump
31: Linklaters

[Anonymous User]

I shit the bed first semester GPA wise and despite a solid bounce back second semester I'm only sitting at slightly over a 3.1. How fucked am I for AJF?

[Anonymous User]

I shit the bed first semester GPA wise and despite a solid bounce back second semester I'm only sitting at slightly over a 3.1. How fucked am I for AJF?

Are you this person? http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 3&t=230908

if not, what market are you targeting? URM? WE? 1L job location? Are you a good interviewer?

[Anonymous User]

I shit the bed first semester GPA wise and despite a solid bounce back second semester I'm only sitting at slightly over a 3.1. How fucked am I for AJF?

Are you this person? http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 3&t=230908

if not, what market are you targeting? URM? WE? 1L job location? Are you a good interviewer?

I'm not that person. Non-URM k-JD. Interning at a corporate in-house counsel position right now that I got through connections. I'd say that I'm a good interviewer and can keep conversations rolling pretty easily. And ideally I'd like to end up in NYC but I also have ties to Philly & NJ markets.

[Arbiter213]

I shit the bed first semester GPA wise and despite a solid bounce back second semester I'm only sitting at slightly over a 3.1. How fucked am I for AJF?

Are you this person? http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 3&t=230908

if not, what market are you targeting? URM? WE? 1L job location? Are you a good interviewer?

I'm not that person. Non-URM k-JD. Interning at a corporate in-house counsel position right now that I got through connections. I'd say that I'm a good interviewer and can keep conversations rolling pretty easily. And ideally I'd like to end up in NYC but I also have ties to Philly & NJ markets.

Pretty fucked but it's totally possible. Practice interviewing. A lot.

[Lincoln]

I shit the bed first semester GPA wise and despite a solid bounce back second semester I'm only sitting at slightly over a 3.1. How fucked am I for AJF?

Are you this person? http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 3&t=230908

if not, what market are you targeting? URM? WE? 1L job location? Are you a good interviewer?

I'm not that person. Non-URM k-JD. Interning at a corporate in-house counsel position right now that I got through connections. I'd say that I'm a good interviewer and can keep conversations rolling pretty easily. And ideally I'd like to end up in NYC but I also have ties to Philly & NJ markets.

Pretty fucked but it's totally possible. Practice interviewing. A lot.

Also mass mail. Now.

Don't waste your bids on Skadden and Kirkland on Day 3- you won't get anything you listed after it that low, and you wont get either of those with top third grades.

Isn't this a little pessimistic, or did things get more selective since I interviewed?

[Anonymous User]

Can someone critique my bid list please? Sitting at about 3.6.

Monday August 4
1. Paul Hastings 3.43-3.83 (3.6) 40
2. Sidley Austin 3.43-3.73 (3.56) 20
3. Willkie Farr 3.08-3.83 (3.48) 40
4. Cooley 36
5. Morrison & Foerster 3.15-3.54 (3.39) 20
6. Greenberg Traurig 3.10-4.0 (3.59) 20
7. Latham & Watkins 3.47-3.83 (3.66) 38
8. Ropes & Gray 3.37-3.79 (3.63) 20
9. Proskauer Rose 3.43-3.78 (3.56) 20
10. Kasowitz Benson 3.21-3.78 (3.55) 20
11. Morgan Lewis 3.28-3.48 (3.38) 20
12. Wilson Sonsini 3.51-4.0 (3.68) 40
13. Schulte Roth 3.08-3.63 (3.43) 40
14. Stroock & Stroock 3.17-3.45 (3.35) 20

Tuesday August 5
1. Pillsbury 3.39-3.73 (3.52) 20
2. Paul Weiss 3.15-3.86 (3.65) 40
3. WilmerHale NY 3.08-3.81 (3.56) 40
4. Goodwin Procter NY 3.28-3.47 (3.39) 20
5. Alston & Bird 3.11-3.77 (3.35) 20
6. Shearman & Sterling 3.08-3.73 (3.47) 60
7. Freshfields 3.22-3.53 (3.4) 40 (London)
8. Hughes Hubbard 3.06-3.33 (3.22) 40
9. Akin Gump 3.39-3.7 (3.52) 20
10. Foley & Lardner 20
11. Clifford Chance 3.08-3.83 (3.52) 80
12. Jones Day 3.15-3.86 (3.63) 40
13. hogan lovells 3.16-3.81 (3.46) 40
14. Chadbourne and Parke 3.43-3.83 (3.58) 20
15. Reed Smith 20

Wednesday August 6
1. Linklaters 3.33-3.65 (3.51) 40
2. Kaye Scholer 3.36-3.71 (3.5) 20
3. Perkins Coie 20
4. Weil 3.37-3.86 (3.63) 40
5. Herbert Smith 20
6. Pepper Hamilton 20
7. Cleary D.C. 3.47-3.96 (3.75) 18
8. Epstein, Becker, and Green 3.28-3.56 (3.42) 20
9. Kirkland & Ellis 3.23-4.0 (3.57) 20
10. Blank Rome 3.08-3.53 (3.25) 20
11. Dentons 20

[Arbiter213]

Don't waste your bids on Skadden and Kirkland on Day 3- you won't get anything you listed after it that low, and you wont get either of those with top third grades.

Isn't this a little pessimistic, or did things get more selective since I interviewed?

Maybe both.

[Anonymous User]

Don't waste your bids on Skadden and Kirkland on Day 3- you won't get anything you listed after it that low, and you wont get either of those with top third grades.

Isn't this a little pessimistic, or did things get more selective since I interviewed?

Maybe both.

Yeah, the average callback GPA for last year for Skadden was 3.63.

[Anonymous User]

Spoke with career services yesterday and they said NOT to mass mail firms coming to AJF (which from what I've read is completely contrary to TLS wisdom). Is this just our career services being dumb or is this credited?

[Anonymous User]

Don't waste your bids on Skadden and Kirkland on Day 3- you won't get anything you listed after it that low, and you wont get either of those with top third grades.

Isn't this a little pessimistic, or did things get more selective since I interviewed?

Maybe both.

Yeah, the average callback GPA for last year for Skadden was 3.63.

I'm aware of that, but the averages can be misleading when there are very small numbers getting them. I'd still say you should either move them up or cut them.

Edit: Oops, didn't mean to anon. Arbiter here.

[Lavitz]

Don't waste your bids on Skadden and Kirkland on Day 3- you won't get anything you listed after it that low, and you wont get either of those with top third grades.

Isn't this a little pessimistic, or did things get more selective since I interviewed?

Maybe both.

Yeah, the average callback GPA for last year for Skadden was 3.63.

That's actually much lower than when Lincoln did AJF, but I think that it's because that one person with a 3.08 dragged it down a lot. Assuming they only gave CBs to 4-5 people, the other 3-4 should still have been around top 10%.

Spoke with career services yesterday and they said NOT to mass mail firms coming to AJF (which from what I've read is completely contrary to TLS wisdom). Is this just our career services being dumb or is this credited?

I'm speaking with them next week so I'll find out then. Maybe they mean don't mail them until schedules are out so you can say that you bid on them but didn't get them. I'm pretty sure they were the ones who said it was possible to get extra interviews via resume drops at the hospitality suites, so I'm not sure why they would discourage mailing which has the same function.

[Arbiter213]

I'm speaking with them next week so I'll find out then. Maybe they mean don't mail them until schedules are out so you can say that you bid on them but didn't get them. I'm pretty sure they were the ones who said it was possible to get extra interviews via resume drops at the hospitality suites, so I'm not sure why they would discourage mailing which has the same function.

That's what they meant- don't mass mail if you already might have an interview. Anyone you miss and are interested in you should mass mail.

[toothbrush]

Spoke with career services yesterday and they said NOT to mass mail firms coming to AJF (which from what I've read is completely contrary to TLS wisdom). Is this just our career services being dumb or is this credited?

I'm speaking with them next week so I'll find out then. Maybe they mean don't mail them until schedules are out so you can say that you bid on them but didn't get them. I'm pretty sure they were the ones who said it was possible to get extra interviews via resume drops at the hospitality suites, so I'm not sure why they would discourage mailing which has the same function.

This is correct. Source: CSO + understanding what TLS means when they say mass mail firms.

[Anonymous User]

Spoke with career services yesterday and they said NOT to mass mail firms coming to AJF (which from what I've read is completely contrary to TLS wisdom). Is this just our career services being dumb or is this credited?

I'm speaking with them next week so I'll find out then. Maybe they mean don't mail them until schedules are out so you can say that you bid on them but didn't get them. I'm pretty sure they were the ones who said it was possible to get extra interviews via resume drops at the hospitality suites, so I'm not sure why they would discourage mailing which has the same function.

This is correct. Source: CSO + understanding what TLS means when they say mass mail firms.

Ah that makes more sense

[redsox550]

Day 1:
- My personal opinion is that Paul Hastings shouldn't be a number 1 bid just based off of their offer rate. 2. Latham is too far down and thus a waste of a bid. Proskaeur is definately way too far down and is a wate of a bid if u dont bid 1 or 2. I would move one of the 2 i mentioned to numbder 1 or 2, you have a pretty solid GPA but your first 6 bids are all under.I dont know much about Cooley but might want to move that down.
- FYI - by watse of bid I mean you should throw it on the very bottom of your list, and not in the middle where you actually have a shot at getting an interview somewhere else

Day 2:
I think Clifford Chance and Jones day and Akin are solid places for you and should be bid higher. Prob over firms like Pillsbury, Alston, and Goodwin NY especially because you if anything are underbidding overall

Day 3:
Move Weil to number 2 and u should ave a decent shot of getting your top 4

Just my adivce - take it or leave or ask me a question about it

Can someone critique my bid list please? Sitting at about 3.6.

Monday August 4
1. Paul Hastings 3.43-3.83 (3.6) 40
2. Sidley Austin 3.43-3.73 (3.56) 20
3. Willkie Farr 3.08-3.83 (3.48) 40
4. Cooley 36
5. Morrison & Foerster 3.15-3.54 (3.39) 20
6. Greenberg Traurig 3.10-4.0 (3.59) 20
7. Latham & Watkins 3.47-3.83 (3.66) 38
8. Ropes & Gray 3.37-3.79 (3.63) 20
9. Proskauer Rose 3.43-3.78 (3.56) 20
10. Kasowitz Benson 3.21-3.78 (3.55) 20
11. Morgan Lewis 3.28-3.48 (3.38) 20
12. Wilson Sonsini 3.51-4.0 (3.68) 40
13. Schulte Roth 3.08-3.63 (3.43) 40
14. Stroock & Stroock 3.17-3.45 (3.35) 20

Tuesday August 5
1. Pillsbury 3.39-3.73 (3.52) 20
2. Paul Weiss 3.15-3.86 (3.65) 40
3. WilmerHale NY 3.08-3.81 (3.56) 40
4. Goodwin Procter NY 3.28-3.47 (3.39) 20
5. Alston & Bird 3.11-3.77 (3.35) 20
6. Shearman & Sterling 3.08-3.73 (3.47) 60
7. Freshfields 3.22-3.53 (3.4) 40 (London)
8. Hughes Hubbard 3.06-3.33 (3.22) 40
9. Akin Gump 3.39-3.7 (3.52) 20
10. Foley & Lardner 20
11. Clifford Chance 3.08-3.83 (3.52) 80
12. Jones Day 3.15-3.86 (3.63) 40
13. Hogan Lovells 3.16-3.81 (3.46) 40
14. Chadbourne and Parke 3.43-3.83 (3.58) 20
15. Reed Smith 20

Wednesday August 6
1. Linklaters 3.33-3.65 (3.51) 40
2. Kaye Scholer 3.36-3.71 (3.5) 20
3. Perkins Coie 20
4. Weil 3.37-3.86 (3.63) 40
5. Herbert Smith 20
6. Pepper Hamilton 20
7. Cleary D.C. 3.47-3.96 (3.75) 18
8. Epstein, Becker, and Green 3.28-3.56 (3.42) 20
9. Kirkland & Ellis 3.23-4.0 (3.57) 20
10. Blank Rome 3.08-3.53 (3.25) 20
11. Dentons 20

[hephaestus]

I'm speaking with them next week so I'll find out then. Maybe they mean don't mail them until schedules are out so you can say that you bid on them but didn't get them. I'm pretty sure they were the ones who said it was possible to get extra interviews via resume drops at the hospitality suites, so I'm not sure why they would discourage mailing which has the same function.

That's what they meant- don't mass mail if you already might have an interview. Anyone you miss and are interested in you should mass mail.

This, but you should be interested in every firm until you have an offer.

[Arbiter213]

I'm speaking with them next week so I'll find out then. Maybe they mean don't mail them until schedules are out so you can say that you bid on them but didn't get them. I'm pretty sure they were the ones who said it was possible to get extra interviews via resume drops at the hospitality suites, so I'm not sure why they would discourage mailing which has the same function.

That's what they meant- don't mass mail if you already might have an interview. Anyone you miss and are interested in you should mass mail.

This, but you should be interested in every firm until you have an offer.

True.

[Anonymous User]

Day 1:
- My personal opinion is that Paul Hastings shouldn't be a number 1 bid just based off of their offer rate. 2. Latham is too far down and thus a waste of a bid. Proskaeur is definately way too far down and is a wate of a bid if u dont bid 1 or 2. I would move one of the 2 i mentioned to numbder 1 or 2, you have a pretty solid GPA but your first 6 bids are all under.I dont know much about Cooley but might want to move that down.
- FYI - by watse of bid I mean you should throw it on the very bottom of your list, and not in the middle where you actually have a shot at getting an interview somewhere else

Day 2:
I think Clifford Chance and Jones day and Akin are solid places for you and should be bid higher. Prob over firms like Pillsbury, Alston, and Goodwin NY especially because you if anything are underbidding overall

Day 3:
Move Weil to number 2 and u should ave a decent shot of getting your top 4

Just my adivce - take it or leave or ask me a question about it

Great, thanks a lot! When you say Paul Hastings is too high based on their offer rate do you mean because they have 40 slots or do they have a reputation of not giving a lot of offers? I see what you mean about Latham. The reason I put it further down is just that I'm worried I won't have as good a shot at getting an offer from them so didn't want to prioritize a firm too high that is less likely to hire me (ie Latham compared to Willkie). I'm also worried about prioritizing firms that don't have data at all. I put Cooley and Perkins Coie high on my lists, but don't want to if I don't have a realistic chance at landing a job with them.

Thanks a lot for the feedback.

[toothbrush]

Great, thanks a lot! When you say Paul Hastings is too high based on their offer rate do you mean because they have 40 slots or do they have a reputation of not giving a lot of offers? I see what you mean about Latham. The reason I put it further down is just that I'm worried I won't have as good a shot at getting an offer from them so didn't want to prioritize a firm too high that is less likely to hire me (ie Latham compared to Willkie). I'm also worried about prioritizing firms that don't have data at all. I put Cooley and Perkins Coie high on my lists, but don't want to if I don't have a realistic chance at landing a job with them.

Thanks a lot for the feedback.

Most likely he means based on PH past history of no-offering 2L SA's,

Overall when I read your list I thought it was very safe. I think you should put a few more reaches in there. Also, I personally didn't bid firms with no data because, like you said, it's not certain what they are looking for or why there is no data. There are plenty of firms that can fill up spots 1-15 for you that are worth bidding, without those firms, so maybe take them off.

[redsox550]

So my year (I'm a year ahead of you, starting my 3rd year) the data I had for PH was something like 12 no-offers or something ridiculous like that. I just took a look at this http://www.nalpdirectory.com/employer_p ... ings%22%7D and it appears thats no longer the case and they made their SA class much smaller. If thats the case then I see no reason to not bid them. I was just personally scared away from the data we had about them.

Also - one thing you should note which is echoed around here quite a bit i that the more selctive firms tend to have bigger SA classes. So for instance sure at Cooley your GPA might be awesome, but they are only hiring 3-4 SA it appears so one might imagine that you would really have to impress them to be one of the few they choose. A larger firm may be more willing to accept someone with a good GPA merely based off of that or would liekly be willing take more of a risk on someone who they arnt positive that would personality be a good fit. So basically, keep class size in mind a bit. Wilson has 1 SA, I can't imagine that the chance of being that one is so high.

Day 1:
- My personal opinion is that Paul Hastings shouldn't be a number 1 bid just based off of their offer rate. 2. Latham is too far down and thus a waste of a bid. Proskaeur is definately way too far down and is a wate of a bid if u dont bid 1 or 2. I would move one of the 2 i mentioned to numbder 1 or 2, you have a pretty solid GPA but your first 6 bids are all under.I dont know much about Cooley but might want to move that down.
- FYI - by watse of bid I mean you should throw it on the very bottom of your list, and not in the middle where you actually have a shot at getting an interview somewhere else

Day 2:
I think Clifford Chance and Jones day and Akin are solid places for you and should be bid higher. Prob over firms like Pillsbury, Alston, and Goodwin NY especially because you if anything are underbidding overall

Day 3:
Move Weil to number 2 and u should ave a decent shot of getting your top 4

Just my adivce - take it or leave or ask me a question about it

Great, thanks a lot! When you say Paul Hastings is too high based on their offer rate do you mean because they have 40 slots or do they have a reputation of not giving a lot of offers? I see what you mean about Latham. The reason I put it further down is just that I'm worried I won't have as good a shot at getting an offer from them so didn't want to prioritize a firm too high that is less likely to hire me (ie Latham compared to Willkie). I'm also worried about prioritizing firms that don't have data at all. I put Cooley and Perkins Coie high on my lists, but don't want to if I don't have a realistic chance at landing a job with them.

Thanks a lot for the feedback.

[Anonymous User]

Most likely he means based on PH past history of no-offering 2L SA's,

Overall when I read your list I thought it was very safe. I think you should put a few more reaches in there. Also, I personally didn't bid firms with no data because, like you said, it's not certain what they are looking for or why there is no data. There are plenty of firms that can fill up spots 1-15 for you that are worth bidding, without those firms, so maybe take them off.

Yeah I saw PH gave 58/70 offers last year, which does seem like a lower percentage than other firms. The reason I had them up that high is that according to Vault and ATL, it seems like PH has relatively happy associates.

Yeah, I think you're right about the no data firms, they kinda scare me, ha. I think I'll keep a couple on Wednesday because there are just fewer options that day. As for reach firms, I probably will put a few higher up. My concern is that my resume's not going to be very good. I don't have much in the way of extra-curriculars and have about a 0% chance of making Law Review. Thanks a lot!

[redsox550]

Last bit of advice. While the chance of the Skadden's of the world hiring you are slim. You have a good GPA and ocne you get to your lets say 8th bid for the day, the only firm you have a shot at getting a screener with are the DPW's and Skaddens which the large majority of Cornell realizes they have no shot at getting and don't even bother bidding on (like you). So its basically like you can bid Proskauer at 9 and Morgan at 11 and have basically a 0% chance of getting a screener which leads to a 0% chance of them giving u an offer. Or you can bid DPW/skadden/Simpson at 9 have a decent chance of getting a screener (especialy if they have a lot of interview slots) and a low but still possible chance of getting a CB/offer. While initally it seems counterintuitve, bidding the higher firms down there I think will give you a better not stirking out chance overall. I did that with a GPA not too far off from you, and ended up snagging a few CB's at far reaches.

[redsox550]

Most likely he means based on PH past history of no-offering 2L SA's,

Overall when I read your list I thought it was very safe. I think you should put a few more reaches in there. Also, I personally didn't bid firms with no data because, like you said, it's not certain what they are looking for or why there is no data. There are plenty of firms that can fill up spots 1-15 for you that are worth bidding, without those firms, so maybe take them off.

Yeah I saw PH gave 58/70 offers last year, which does seem like a lower percentage than other firms. The reason I had them up that high is that according to Vault and ATL, it seems like PH has relatively happy associates.

Yeah, I think you're right about the no data firms, they kinda scare me, ha. I think I'll keep a couple on Wednesday because there are just fewer options that day. As for reach firms, I probably will put a few higher up. My concern is that my resume's not going to be very good. I don't have much in the way of extra-curriculars and have about a 0% chance of making Law Review. Thanks a lot!

You do know, if you want some info on a "no-data" firm, someone on this website can probably give you some. It may be a year old or from a different school kinda clsoely ranked to Cornell, but somoene has data on basically every firm. Ask away

[Anonymous User]

Last bit of advice. While the chance of the Skadden's of the world hiring you are slim. You have a good GPA and ocne you get to your lets say 8th bid for the day, the only firm you have a shot at getting a screener with are the DPW's and Skaddens which the large majority of Cornell realizes they have no shot at getting and don't even bother bidding on (like you). So its basically like you can bid Proskauer at 9 and Morgan at 11 and have basically a 0% chance of getting a screener which leads to a 0% chance of them giving u an offer. Or you can bid DPW/skadden/Simpson at 9 have a decent chance of getting a screener (especialy if they have a lot of interview slots) and a low but still possible chance of getting a CB/offer. While initally it seems counterintuitve, bidding the higher firms down there I think will give you a better not stirking out chance overall. I did that with a GPA not too far off from you, and ended up snagging a few CB's at far reaches.

Hmm, okay, I didn't know that, and wouldn't have expected that. I would have thought the DPW/Skadden/Simpsons would be the first to go. Thanks!

You do know, if you want some info on a "no-data" firm, someone on this website can probably give you some. It may be a year old or from a different school kinda clsoely ranked to Cornell, but somoene has data on basically every firm. Ask away

Okay, cool. Where do you think the best place to go and ask would be?