Is dropping out at the end of 2L ever credited? Forum

[Anonymous User]

No. Use this summer to bolster your resume, and begin applying to JD preferred positions if you truly hate law. A lot of students hate law school. If you have friends who are not in law school, hang out with them and simply be tolerable in class ( if you do in fact end up going).

If you later decide you want to practice law, then think about where you want to sit for the bar.

After 1L is the time to drop and run. Once you are financially committed to Fall 2L, you are halfway done. While this does not pertain to you, the timeframe is still important. Unless, of course, you were offered your dream job. iIn that case drop, but that does not seem to be the case with you.

TLDR: 3LOLOLOL your way, take easy classes and graduate

Thanks guys! Leaning towards staying. I wish I had as much support and care at my school as I did from you internet strangers. Whenever I talk to higher ups about how I feel, I'm just bombarded with inane Boomerisms.

I don't truly hate law, it's just that law school is absolutely soul-crushing. Maybe it's the depression and humiliation stemming from being a 2L retaking a 1L course, but (most of) the people, classes, etc. are just unbearable. I feel so worthless around people who seem so amazing--like folks involved in Law Review, Moot Court, RA, TA, students orgs, etc. all at once. I try to stay off campus as much as possible and keep my nose buried in internships/pro bono.

[northwood]

Law School Sucks. Just be nice, polite, and sociable, and try to make or maintain friendships with non law school people. Not only will it give you a bigger break from law related talk, but it also helps keep things in perspective.

Law School is 3 years of suckiness... once you are done, though you don't have to ever go back as a student.

By the way, I firmly believe that those that must proclaim their awesomness and constantly remind you of how busy/ awesome/ amazing they are looking for a way to make themselves seem superior. And a lot of the times they aren't that busy, or they are simply ineffective with their time management/ or don't know how to say no or delegate tasks...

[Anonymous User]

Sometimes, but not in your case.

spleen, surprised to hear this from you given how upset you seem in the Vale thread re: your PD aspirations.

[northwood]

perhaps because OP is not taking out any loans?

[Anonymous User]

perhaps because OP is not taking out any loans?

i suppose that makes sense.

i meant that if someone like him at the top of the class with journal/moot ct. at a comparable school AND relevant internships is being turned down right and left, what's gonna become of a bottom-feeder like me who just has "demonstrated commitment" and passion, but not much else going for her?

what to do going forward to prevent myself from being forever ensconced in the Vale?

[spleenworship]

Sometimes, but not in your case.

spleen, surprised to hear this from you given how upset you seem in the Vale thread re: your PD aspirations.

OP graduating with no debt, only one more year to go, and a decent if not remarkable shot at jobs.

Look, if you were all like "I gotta take out another $100K for next year and I want Biglaw only" then maybe you should drop. But that just isn't the case.

In my case I'm in debt, I have a family and a mortgage, and I had some unrealistic expectations. so yeah, our situation is wildly different.


Also PS you know the fact is is that I know the grades of the people, generally speaking, Who got the jobs at the local PD office instead of me and two of those four had worse grades than me. Fact is that PD work isn't really about grades or journal. Or for that matter even Relevant internships or clinics if you can Interview well, you know?

[guano]

A JD would add some tangetial value. People will respect you for having a law degree. And it is a good degree to go into financial advising.

Bullshit

[rpupkin]

I don't truly hate law, it's just that law school is absolutely soul-crushing. Maybe it's the depression and humiliation stemming from being a 2L retaking a 1L course, but (most of) the people, classes, etc. are just unbearable. I feel so worthless around people who seem so amazing--like folks involved in Law Review, Moot Court, RA, TA, students orgs, etc. all at once.

It's all relative. All of those students you find amazing tried (and failed) to get into a T14 law school. And those amazing folks at the T14 law schools? Most of them try and fail to get into the top 10% of the class. And those fortunate few who make it into the top 10% of the class at a T14? Most of them try and fail to get feeder COA clerkships. And those superstars who get feeder COA clerkships? Most of them try and fail to get SCOTUS clerkships.

There's always someone better. Always. Who cares? Stop judging yourself against the perceived success of others. For all you know, those "amazing folks" you envy are crying themselves to sleep every night because of their own self-perceived inadequacies. And think of how your situation looks compared to someone paying sticker at a TTT. Or think how good your situation looks compared to someone who barely graduated high school with a learning disability (a real disability--not the "I can't study for finals without adderall" syndrome).

Stop beating yourself up. You're not a superstar law student, and you're not going to be Chief Justice of the Supreme Court. But you've got minimal debt and you seem to enjoy aspects of law. Be grateful for that.

[Anonymous User]

Sometimes, but not in your case.

spleen, surprised to hear this from you given how upset you seem in the Vale thread re: your PD aspirations.

OP graduating with no debt, only one more year to go, and a decent if not remarkable shot at jobs.

OP here. "Remarkable shot at jobs"? I sure hope so! Too bad my T25 doesn't offer school-funded fellowships.

[sparty99]

There is nothing on my resume that indicates that I am a URM. Consequently, this has played NO PART in me securing interviews. But nice try.

OK. Here's what you've said elsewhere (http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... y#p7201599):

I know I don't receive a URM boost. If I did, I would have received call-backs at all the career fairs that I attended.

I said there is no URM boost. I'm claiming that grades are the only thing that they care about. I have WE and it' not subpar. It's highly legit. I also had a 1L firm job. Still, no one cared. But I'm not trying to get into a tit-for-tat with you. I'm a minority and jobless.

If you are a URM and not making that clear on your resume then you're really, doing it wrong. And I don't know why you would not do this, but also go to minority job fairs.

I don't know why you are all of a sudden making this about me. No one cares that I'm a URM. Even applications that say they want URMS, then I might put it down that i'm a member of my Law School's URM group. But even still, they don't give two fucks as I'm waiting on the sidelines. I've also been to miniroitiy career fairs. Thank you. They have been mostly a waste of time for me. I've received 0 interviews or call backs from ones that they interview at.

[sparty99]

A JD would add some tangetial value. People will respect you for having a law degree. And it is a good degree to go into financial advising.

Bullshit

Oh, okay, dude. I guess Edward Jones and Northwestern Mutual doesn't specifically target JD's. I guess I must of mis-read those job postings that said they like people with JD's. My bad dude.

[guano]

A JD would add some tangetial value. People will respect you for having a law degree. And it is a good degree to go into financial advising.

Bullshit

Oh, okay, dude. I guess Edward Jones and Northwestern Mutual doesn't specifically target JD's. I guess I must of mis-read those job postings that said they like people with JD's. My bad dude.

They'll target anyone with a pulse. It makes zero difference if you have a JD or not. The only advantage the JD gives is that you might have former classmates who are now biglawyers, who would make good clients. They're not targeting the JD, they're targeting the JD's network

[thatgirlthere]

Is it possible to do a full-time externship? Then you won't have to go back to school and you'll still get credit toward your JD.

[Anonymous User]

Is it possible to do a full-time externship? Then you won't have to go back to school and you'll still get credit toward your JD.

Yes, at my home school. Not sure if that's a possibility at the school i plan to visit away at, but I'll look into it.

[dresden doll]

I HATE law school--I literally have made no friends here. I despise the social milieu, the cutthroat atmosphere, the forced curve, the Boomerisms spouted by profs/career services etc. etc.

I don't have a lot of advice, but I can't even express how much I agree with this sentiment. FWIW, there are others out there that feel the same way.

Yeah, I can definitely sympathize, too.

[Anonymous User]

I HATE law school--I literally have made no friends here. I despise the social milieu, the cutthroat atmosphere, the forced curve, the Boomerisms spouted by profs/career services etc. etc.

I don't have a lot of advice, but I can't even express how much I agree with this sentiment. FWIW, there are others out there that feel the same way.

Yeah, I can definitely sympathize, too.

dresden doll, you're out of the Vale and got a direct services PI jerb, right?

[dresden doll]

I don't work for a direct service provider, but, yes, it's in PI. And I left the vale towards the end of 3L.

[Anonymous User]

There is nothing on my resume that indicates that I am a URM. Consequently, this has played NO PART in me securing interviews. But nice try.

OK. Here's what you've said elsewhere (http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... y#p7201599):

I know I don't receive a URM boost. If I did, I would have received call-backs at all the career fairs that I attended.

I said there is no URM boost. I'm claiming that grades are the only thing that they care about. I have WE and it' not subpar. It's highly legit. I also had a 1L firm job. Still, no one cared. But I'm not trying to get into a tit-for-tat with you. I'm a minority and jobless.

If you are a URM and not making that clear on your resume then you're really, doing it wrong. And I don't know why you would not do this, but also go to minority job fairs.

Is there a diversity boost for ORMs?

[spleenworship]

As a note, I hate law school as well for all the reasons mentioned except that I've made about 5 friends for life here.

They also hate law school, with one notable exception.

[Anonymous User]

As a note, I hate law school as well for all the reasons mentioned except that I've made about 5 friends for life here.

They also hate law school, with one notable exception.

thanks! it's great to feel that i'm not alone in this.

spleen, what did you mean when you said that i have a "decent, if not remarkable shot at jobs", despite my bottom of the barrel grades and lack journal/moot ct. etc. ? how to stand out when every other PI gunner is loading up on clinics, externships, etc? fwiw i got my summer position thru EJW and will be attending this year as well. how to best position myself for a FTLT PD/Legal Aid position when i end up in the Vale? because i'm not a good candidate by traditional means, i need to strategize now.

[spleenworship]

As a note, I hate law school as well for all the reasons mentioned except that I've made about 5 friends for life here.

They also hate law school, with one notable exception.

thanks! it's great to feel that i'm not alone in this.

spleen, what did you mean when you said that i have a "decent, if not remarkable shot at jobs", despite my bottom of the barrel grades and lack journal/moot ct. etc. ? how to stand out when every other PI gunner is loading up on clinics, externships, etc? fwiw i got my summer position thru EJW and will be attending this year as well. how to best position myself for a FTLT PD/Legal Aid position when i end up in the Vale? because i'm not a good candidate by traditional means, i need to strategize now.

I should've said "decent, but not remarkable."

That said, I wasn't lying when I said you have a shot at jobs. You do. Because PI job attainment is mostly about 3 things: 1) interviewing well (and writing good cover letters to get the interview), 2) passion (this plays into both the cover letter and interview), 3) luck (which we cannot control). I'd say that these three factors are about 70% of the process. The other 30% is grades and relevant clinics/internships. And only 10% of that is grades. You already have some of that: you have had a summer PI gig. Now just get a relevant clinic or externships in the fall and highlight that when you apply.

Work on your cover letters and interview skills, and get that relevant gig. After that your chances are about the same as everyone else. Especially considering that, IMO, luck is a solid 30% of the process.

[Anonymous User]

As a note, I hate law school as well for all the reasons mentioned except that I've made about 5 friends for life here.

They also hate law school, with one notable exception.

thanks! it's great to feel that i'm not alone in this.

spleen, what did you mean when you said that i have a "decent, if not remarkable shot at jobs", despite my bottom of the barrel grades and lack journal/moot ct. etc. ? how to stand out when every other PI gunner is loading up on clinics, externships, etc? fwiw i got my summer position thru EJW and will be attending this year as well. how to best position myself for a FTLT PD/Legal Aid position when i end up in the Vale? because i'm not a good candidate by traditional means, i need to strategize now.

I should've said "decent, but not remarkable."

That said, I wasn't lying when I said you have a shot at jobs. You do. Because PI job attainment is mostly about 3 things: 1) interviewing well (and writing good cover letters to get the interview), 2) passion (this plays into both the cover letter and interview), 3) luck (which we cannot control). I'd say that these three factors are about 70% of the process. The other 30% is grades and relevant clinics/internships. And only 10% of that is grades. You already have some of that: you have had a summer PI gig. Now just get a relevant clinic or externships in the fall and highlight that when you apply.

Work on your cover letters and interview skills, and get that relevant gig. After that your chances are about the same as everyone else. Especially considering that, IMO, luck is a solid 30% of the process.

thank you, thank you, this is very constructive advice! and best of luck to you, spleen.

well, i think i'll tough it out and stay. i'm praying that the school close to home accepts me as a visitor student. hopefully it will be a better environment, and if not, at least i'll be closer to family and friends.

[Anonymous User]

quick ?: is is very difficult to get a firm job if you've never worked in a firm setting? I've done family and immigration law, but in Legal Aid settings solely, not in small/mid firms that specialize in those practice areas.

[Anonymous User]

What are your options if you don't continue in law school? If you have options that you like just as much/better and pay just as much/better as a PI legal job, then leaving probably isn't a big deal. If you don't, because you actually like the practice of law, it seems like leaving would be shooting yourself in the foot - you just need to plow through school and get it over with so you can get on to the good stuff.

As for feeling inferior to your classmates - you got admitted, and you got admitted with a scholarship. The school thought you were qualified. Once you get to school, you're competing against people with GPAs/LSATs distributed along a very very narrow band, which means that, basically, almost everyone has the same aptitude for law (to the degree GPA/LSAT shows that). Since schools grade on a curve, someone is going to have to end up with lower grades for work that's probably not significantly different, overall, than the stuff that gets higher grades. Yes, there's usually an objective difference between an A exam and a C exam, but the significance of that difference is a function of the need to grade on a curve, not a judgment that the C somehow objectively shows that you will not be as good a lawyer as the person who got the A. Plus, ability to get good grades in law school classes is very weakly correlated to ability to be a good lawyer. So who cares if your classmates are better at writing exams than you are?

options if i do not continue law school are not good. majored in sociology and anthropology and minored in spanish, lol. probably a direct client services oriented jerb in the high 20s-low-30s. did americorps between UG and lawl school.

[BigRob]

This thread is a scathing indictment of affirmative action.

Because of his race, OP was admitted to a school with lower credentials than the rest of the student body. Then -- shocker -- he didn't get good grades on curved exams. He feels inferior to his classmates, depressed, and miserable, and his job prospects have suffered.

How any other result could be expected is beyond me.

user has been outed and banned for anon abuse and debating affirmative action outside the AA thread. user also needs to learn to read as OP has never identified as URM, and was admitted with a merit scholarship which suggests OP's credentials were just fine. user also needs to learn not to insult people he doesn't know.