What is life like for TTTT career services employees Forum

[Anonymous User]

I'm in my first year at Suffolk and am working for a firm in Boston this summer as a summer associate alongside two BC law students. I am not in the top 10% of my class. I worked hard in undergrad building my resume and working for firms. It's not all about ranks and grades. In fact, I was offered multiple positions at litigation firms in Boston and not a single one asked to see grades.

And for the record, I was also offered a position at the Manhattan DA this summer.

So for those of you caught up in the idea that the rank of your school means something, unless you're at an Ivy I'd think twice before shitting on TTTT schools.

[Colonel_funkadunk]

That which applies to one part of a group can't necessarily be applied to the whole group.

[dead head]

I'm in my first year at Suffolk and am working for a firm in Boston this summer as a summer associate alongside two BC law students. I am not in the top 10% of my class. I worked hard in undergrad building my resume and working for firms. It's not all about ranks and grades. In fact, I was offered multiple positions at litigation firms in Boston and not a single one asked to see grades.

And for the record, I was also offered a position at the Manhattan DA this summer.

So for those of you caught up in the idea that the rank of your school means something, unless you're at an Ivy I'd think twice before shitting on TTTT schools.

So if school rank and grades don't mean anything, then why are so many Suffolk grads jobless at graduation compared to T14 grads? Do you think it's because T14 students try harder, network harder, and have spent more time getting work experience prior to law school while Suffolk students are lazy bums who don't network and have no WE?

[yossarian]

I'm in my first year at Suffolk and am working for a firm in Boston this summer as a summer associate...
So for those of you caught up in the idea that the rank of your school means something, unless you're at an Ivy I'd think twice before shitting on TTTT schools.

I'm really happy things have worked out so well for you. You've clearly worked hard, and I'm glad you're see results. But do things really seem rosy for most of your class? What about the graduating class?

We don't judge TTT students, just TTT schools.

[Danger Zone]

I'm in my first year at Suffolk and am working for a firm in Boston this summer as a summer associate alongside two BC law students. I am not in the top 10% of my class. I worked hard in undergrad building my resume and working for firms. It's not all about ranks and grades. In fact, I was offered multiple positions at litigation firms in Boston and not a single one asked to see grades.

And for the record, I was also offered a position at the Manhattan DA this summer.

So for those of you caught up in the idea that the rank of your school means something, unless you're at an Ivy I'd think twice before shitting on TTTT schools.

[timbs4339]

I'm in my first year at Suffolk and am working for a firm in Boston this summer as a summer associate alongside two BC law students. I am not in the top 10% of my class. I worked hard in undergrad building my resume and working for firms. It's not all about ranks and grades. In fact, I was offered multiple positions at litigation firms in Boston and not a single one asked to see grades.

And for the record, I was also offered a position at the Manhattan DA this summer.

So for those of you caught up in the idea that the rank of your school means something, unless you're at an Ivy I'd think twice before shitting on TTTT schools.

Tony's Somerville PI firm is lucky to have you.

[Nucky]

I'm in my first year at Suffolk and am working for a firm in Boston this summer as a summer associate alongside two BC law students. I am not in the top 10% of my class. I worked hard in undergrad building my resume and working for firms. It's not all about ranks and grades. In fact, I was offered multiple positions at litigation firms in Boston and not a single one asked to see grades.

And for the record, I was also offered a position at the Manhattan DA this summer.

So for those of you caught up in the idea that the rank of your school means something, unless you're at an Ivy I'd think twice before shitting on TTTT schools.

[objctnyrhnr]

I'm in my first year at Suffolk and am working for a firm in Boston this summer as a summer associate alongside two BC law students. I am not in the top 10% of my class. I worked hard in undergrad building my resume and working for firms. It's not all about ranks and grades. In fact, I was offered multiple positions at litigation firms in Boston and not a single one asked to see grades.

And for the record, I was also offered a position at the Manhattan DA this summer.

So for those of you caught up in the idea that the rank of your school means something, unless you're at an Ivy I'd think twice before shitting on TTTT schools.

1. Perhaps these flawed reasoning skills are the reason you ended up at your TTTT to begin with. Nobody has ever said it's IMPOSSIBLE to do anything legitimate from a TTTT. All that has been said is that it's way way way harder, and the majority of your class won't succeed in doing anything legitimate within 9 months after graduation (again, look at the stats). One counter-example cannot counteract overwhelming statistics.

2. I cannot speak to your specific situation, but I am tempted to say that you are straight silly/naive if you think that what you do 1L summer matters insofar as it affects your prospect of getting post-grad employment (unless, arguably, you are a URM).

3. You say "oh i got a manhattan DA position" as if you really did. You got a bitch-work-doing superior court support 1L internship. I am not saying that it's not worth doing as a 1L, but don't act like you got some ridiculously competitive thing.

4. Try your ass off for that firm this summer. Without top 10% grades at suffolk, it might be your only chance at post grad employment. Try to feel them out on your 2L summer and on post-grad hiring possibilities before you finish this summer. Make sure that you are not just being used as cheap labor at a tiny firm that is not doing well enough to be able to hire post-grad positions.

5. i might reconsider the DA's office unless you truly believe that this small firm litigation position could lead to a 2L SA and post grad employment. the only successful suffolk people anybody finds these days began as prosecutors (and even still, it's ridiculously hard to become a prosecutor in a competitive city, period, but the plus side is that grades are less emphasized)

user has been outed and warned for anon abuse

[encore1101]

1. Perhaps these flawed reasoning skills are the reason you ended up at your TTTT to begin with. Nobody has ever said it's IMPOSSIBLE to do anything legitimate from a TTTT. All that has been said is that it's way way way harder, and the majority of your class won't succeed in doing anything legitimate within 9 months after graduation (again, look at the stats). One counter-example cannot counteract overwhelming statistics.

http://www.nationallawjournal.com/id=12 ... &curpage=3

Sadly, the methodology used in evaluating the metrics, as well as the metrics themselves, are terrible indicators of a school's actual quality.

And yes, to confirm what will undoubtedly be an ad hominem response, I go to a TTT (with a post-graduate job offer), but you don't need to be a statistician to understand why the rankings shouldn't mean as much as they do.

[patogordo]

job statistics aren't rankings

[timbs4339]

job statistics aren't rankings

I'm not sure how "are you working, what's your job, and what's your salary" is a flawed metric.

[encore1101]

job statistics aren't rankings

I'm not sure how "are you working, what's your job, and what's your salary" is a flawed metric.

It's not a flawed metric, but its not appropriately weighted.

[objctnyrhnr]

1. Perhaps these flawed reasoning skills are the reason you ended up at your TTTT to begin with. Nobody has ever said it's IMPOSSIBLE to do anything legitimate from a TTTT. All that has been said is that it's way way way harder, and the majority of your class won't succeed in doing anything legitimate within 9 months after graduation (again, look at the stats). One counter-example cannot counteract overwhelming statistics.

http://www.nationallawjournal.com/id=12 ... &curpage=3

Sadly, the methodology used in evaluating the metrics, as well as the metrics themselves, are terrible indicators of a school's actual quality.

And yes, to confirm what will undoubtedly be an ad hominem response, I go to a TTT (with a post-graduate job offer), but you don't need to be a statistician to understand why the rankings shouldn't mean as much as they do.

Nobody said anything about rankings. All that was said is that TTTTs' percent of people who have jd-requiring jobs 9 months post grad [generally] suck compared to that of higher schools. I do not give any stock to USNWR either.

[timbs4339]

job statistics aren't rankings

I'm not sure how "are you working, what's your job, and what's your salary" is a flawed metric.

It's not a flawed metric, but its not appropriately weighted.

Yes, it gives much too much weight to short-term, part-time, and school funded jobs. None of which excuses Suffolk's atrocious FTLT employment rate.

[encore1101]

1. Perhaps these flawed reasoning skills are the reason you ended up at your TTTT to begin with. Nobody has ever said it's IMPOSSIBLE to do anything legitimate from a TTTT. All that has been said is that it's way way way harder, and the majority of your class won't succeed in doing anything legitimate within 9 months after graduation (again, look at the stats). One counter-example cannot counteract overwhelming statistics.

http://www.nationallawjournal.com/id=12 ... &curpage=3

Sadly, the methodology used in evaluating the metrics, as well as the metrics themselves, are terrible indicators of a school's actual quality.

And yes, to confirm what will undoubtedly be an ad hominem response, I go to a TTT (with a post-graduate job offer), but you don't need to be a statistician to understand why the rankings shouldn't mean as much as they do.

Nobody said anything about rankings. All that was said is that TTTTs' percent of people who have jd-requiring jobs 9 months post grad [generally] suck compared to that of higher schools. I do not give any stock to USNWR either.

Fair enough. I personally consider designations such as "TTTT," etc., to be dependent on rankings, but I agree that schools could/should be ranked by pure employment statistics as well.

[gdane]

This whole thread is obnoxious. Trashing other people to feel good about yourselves is mad weak.

[OneMoreLawHopeful]

I don't get this: isn't the point of "special snowflake syndrome" that the person thinks, without justification, that they will be different? Once a person has justification (which it sounds like anon has, because anon's experience was, in fact, different), then they're not someone with "special snowflake syndrome," they're just someone describing their life.

It strikes me as pretty shitty that you can't acknowledge that.

[Danger Zone]

He's a 1L who will be working at a firm this summer. Let's not pretend he's had an awesome outcome yet. He thinks he will have one, though, and beat the odds because he is special. Thus, snowflake.

You're welcome.

[objctnyrhnr]

He's a 1L who will be working at a firm this summer. Let's not pretend he's had an awesome outcome yet. He thinks he will have one, though, and beat the odds because he is special. Thus, snowflake.

You're welcome.

This was about to be my response. The previous poster does have a point about the nature of special snowflake syndrome, but the Suffolk 1L was/is touting his horn wayyyyy too hard about working at some firm his 1L summer and "having an offer from Manhattan DA" [FOR A 1L POSITION].

If people realized they were effed (regardless of whether that poster actually will be) after their first year, more people would drop out and the schools would have way less money. Simultaneously, both private and public sector employers have no complaints about free/cheap labor in the form of internships. It's a viscous cycle...and this certainly does not just apply to TTT's. When one is getting internships/small firm SA's with a modicum of success, especially as a 1L, it is difficult to realize/accept/acknowledge that one might still be in deep sh$t.

[OneMoreLawHopeful]

He's a 1L who will be working at a firm this summer. Let's not pretend he's had an awesome outcome yet. He thinks he will have one, though, and beat the odds because he is special. Thus, snowflake.

You're welcome.

My bad, I thought he was a 2L.

I was also confused because someone on TLS called me a special snowflake yesterday, and I'm a 3L with a job lined up, so it seemed like there was some move to change the definition.

[timbs4339]

It may be that part of special snowflake syndrome is a failure to acknowledge just how much of a role blind dumb luck plays in your previous success, and to look at it as predetermined or predestined. "I got this job because I did X,Y,Z, therefore my classmates who didn't get jobs must not have done X,Y,Z." Hell, you may have gotten that job because the partner just won a huge case 10 minutes before you walked into the interview, or because the small firm you interned at just happened to land a huge client and needed more people, while your classmate interned at a firm that lost.

[XxSpyKEx]

I'm in my first year at Suffolk and am working for a firm in Boston this summer as a summer associate alongside two BC law students. I am not in the top 10% of my class. I worked hard in undergrad building my resume and working for firms. It's not all about ranks and grades. In fact, I was offered multiple positions at litigation firms in Boston and not a single one asked to see grades.

And for the record, I was also offered a position at the Manhattan DA this summer.

So for those of you caught up in the idea that the rank of your school means something, unless you're at an Ivy I'd think twice before shitting on TTTT schools.

So if school rank and grades don't mean anything, then why are so many Suffolk grads jobless at graduation compared to T14 grads? Do you think it's because T14 students try harder, network harder, and have spent more time getting work experience prior to law school while Suffolk students are lazy bums who don't network and have no WE?

While I know this was meant to be a snarky sarcastic response, you'd be surprised how much more true this than you would think.. I had the "opportunity" to attend both a TTT (although now it's a TT) and a t10, and the people at the t10 definitely tried harder and a LOT more people had work experience. I suspect a lot of the people who went to my law school would have done well regardless of where they went to law school (the exception is people who went to work for top biglaw firms--those firms are very dead set on hiring only the top people at the t14 schools). I think the higher up the ranking you go, the more true this is as well. For example, if you actually meet 10 Yale Law grads, talk to them, and ask them about their background before law school, you'd probably conclude that those most of those people are sufficiently smart, accomplished, and hard working to have done well even without having attended Yale... The most helpful about attending a higher ranked law school is that you get a really good alumni network that you can utilize to make your way into jobs that might otherwise been really difficult to get. Although, while in law school, I found the actual networking part of it to be more dependent on job type. PI people had to network a lot more, but a lot of people relied on OCI for firms. With that said, I think people who reached out to alumni before OCI to learn more about firms did better, since they were able to better communicate that they were actually interested in the specific firms (and that they were a good fit for them). Also, the large chunk of my class that didn't get jobs through OCI had to network (c/o 2011 here).

[IgosduIkana]

I'm more concerned with what life is like in the Admissions Office.

I'm thinking straight up Stratton Oakmont.

Telling a kid that "he can knock off a few $$$ from the annual tuition by putting his 1L SA summer money towards his/her loans," as he/she mimes getting a BJ from the phone receiver.

lol

[dead head]

So if school rank and grades don't mean anything, then why are so many Suffolk grads jobless at graduation compared to T14 grads? Do you think it's because T14 students try harder, network harder, and have spent more time getting work experience prior to law school while Suffolk students are lazy bums who don't network and have no WE?

While I know this was meant to be a snarky sarcastic response, you'd be surprised how much more true this than you would think.. I had the "opportunity" to attend both a TTT (although now it's a TT) and a t10, and the people at the t10 definitely tried harder and a LOT more people had work experience. I suspect a lot of the people who went to my law school would have done well regardless of where they went to law school (the exception is people who went to work for top biglaw firms--those firms are very dead set on hiring only the top people at the t14 schools). I think the higher up the ranking you go, the more true this is as well. For example, if you actually meet 10 Yale Law grads, talk to them, and ask them about their background before law school, you'd probably conclude that those most of those people are sufficiently smart, accomplished, and hard working to have done well even without having attended Yale... The most helpful about attending a higher ranked law school is that you get a really good alumni network that you can utilize to make your way into jobs that might otherwise been really difficult to get. Although, while in law school, I found the actual networking part of it to be more dependent on job type. PI people had to network a lot more, but a lot of people relied on OCI for firms. With that said, I think people who reached out to alumni before OCI to learn more about firms did better, since they were able to better communicate that they were actually interested in the specific firms (and that they were a good fit for them). Also, the large chunk of my class that didn't get jobs through OCI had to network (c/o 2011 here).

While there may be some truth to this, especially at Yale, there are plenty of fairly uninteresting K-JD kids roaming the halls of the various T14s who simply went to law school for lack of anything better to do. Over half of the students from just about every T14 get a 2L summer gig through OCI, and it's not because they are all super networkers or have great WE.

I'm also interested in hearing that students at lower-ranked schools are less engaged. I would have thought the opposite, because they are more likely to be aware of the importance of grades, while many at T14 schools believe (or did until very recently) that their school name can carry them pretty far on their own.

[PepperJack]

How much do CSO people get paid? I feel like not much in juxtaposition with other positions.