Houston OCI, Callbacks, Offers Forum

[Anonymous User]

Anyone know what Bracewell’s turnaround is?

<24 hours out of regular CB.

How recent was this

this week

different poster than OP. Which day of the week if u don’t mind? Just had mine this morning

[Anonymous User]

Anybody heard anything from Akin? This is the only firm I haven't heard a word from. Even the people who directly asked me to email and "keep in touch" haven't responded.

[Anonymous User]

Anybody heard anything from Akin? This is the only firm I haven't heard a word from. Even the people who directly asked me to email and "keep in touch" haven't responded.

I had a pre oci callback at Akin at got an offer last week.

[Anonymous User]

What’s the K&E CB -> offer timeline been so far?

24 hours for me

I was told for litigation it would take about a week. Transactional I was told is 24-48 hours.

[Anonymous User]

V&E- cb Monday, offer today
K&E- cb Wednesday, offer Thursday morning

[Anonymous User]

How long has it taken y'all to hear from Latham?

[Anonymous User]

How long has it taken y'all to hear from Latham?

Mine took 24 hours. My friend had same day offer.

[Anonymous User]

Anybody get an offer from AZA or K&E (litigation) yet?

[Anonymous User]

Anybody get an offer from AZA or K&E (litigation) yet?

Reject from AZA, lit offer from K&E.

[Anonymous User]

Anybody heard anything from Akin? This is the only firm I haven't heard a word from. Even the people who directly asked me to email and "keep in touch" haven't responded.

A friend of mine has already accepted an offer there. Not sure what their process looked like, though.

[Anonymous User]

How long has it taken y'all to hear from Latham?

Took me a little over a week CB-->Offer

[Anonymous User]

want lit. trying to decide between V&E, Kirkland, satellite office of a national firm, and a smaller TX firm. no clue how to make my choice. concerned about culture. don't care much about "prestige." for those who want lit, how are you making your choice?

[Anonymous User]

.

[Anonymous User]

Anybody get an offer from AZA or K&E (litigation) yet?

Reject from AZA, lit offer from K&E.

Thank you. Do you mind sharing how long the turnaround was on each? Would really appreciate it.

[Anonymous User]

Not to hijack the above poster's discussion, but I am in a similar decision but on the transactional side. Really don't know how to decide, don't really care about prestige, and worry a little bit about culture and wonder if its defensible to pick a satellite office over Kirkland and V&E. No Latham offer yet but not really long enough to say for sure that I didn't get an offer so would appreciate opinion's about them as well.

Totally depends which satellites we’re talking about. Certainly not crazy to pick Sidley or Willkie (though most people probably wouldn’t), but it would probably be crazy to pick a White & Case or Skadden.

[Anonymous User]

Not to hijack the above poster's discussion, but I am in a similar decision but on the transactional side. Really don't know how to decide, don't really care about prestige, and worry a little bit about culture and wonder if its defensible to pick a satellite office over Kirkland and V&E. No Latham offer yet but not really long enough to say for sure that I didn't get an offer so would appreciate opinions about them as well.

Totally depends which satellites we’re talking about. Certainly not crazy to pick Sidley or Willkie (though most people probably wouldn’t), but it would probably be crazy to pick a White & Case or Skadden.

Willkie is pretty much the main firm I'm considering besides VE/KE, although I also really liked the partners from Simpson. I'm with you on White & Case or Skadden, declined an offer from one of them or a similarly situated firm. I'm just incredibly torn otherwise.

[Anonymous User]

Not to hijack the above poster's discussion, but I am in a similar decision but on the transactional side. Really don't know how to decide, don't really care about prestige, and worry a little bit about culture and wonder if its defensible to pick a satellite office over Kirkland and V&E. No Latham offer yet but not really long enough to say for sure that I didn't get an offer so would appreciate opinions about them as well.

Totally depends which satellites we’re talking about. Certainly not crazy to pick Sidley or Willkie (though most people probably wouldn’t), but it would probably be crazy to pick a White & Case or Skadden.

Willkie is pretty much the main firm I'm considering besides VE/KE, although I also really liked the partners from Simpson. I'm with you on White & Case or Skadden, declined an offer from one of them or a similarly situated firm. I'm just incredibly torn otherwise.

FWIW, it should matter a lot more if you liked the juniors and midlevels as those are the people you will primarily be working with at any of those firms. Liking the partners is one thing but the culture is in large part set any of those by the associates. Those satellite firms (Willkie/Simpson) also have vastly different exit opportunities from each other and V&E (Simpson/K&E have similar exits from a PE perspective). Willkie’s finance group, for example, represents mostly borrowers while Simpson represents mostly agents.

[Anonymous User]

Not to hijack the above poster's discussion, but I am in a similar decision but on the transactional side. Really don't know how to decide, don't really care about prestige, and worry a little bit about culture and wonder if its defensible to pick a satellite office over Kirkland and V&E. No Latham offer yet but not really long enough to say for sure that I didn't get an offer so would appreciate opinions about them as well.

Totally depends which satellites we’re talking about. Certainly not crazy to pick Sidley or Willkie (though most people probably wouldn’t), but it would probably be crazy to pick a White & Case or Skadden.

Willkie is pretty much the main firm I'm considering besides VE/KE, although I also really liked the partners from Simpson. I'm with you on White & Case or Skadden, declined an offer from one of them or a similarly situated firm. I'm just incredibly torn otherwise.

FWIW, it should matter a lot more if you liked the juniors and midlevels as those are the people you will primarily be working with at any of those firms. Liking the partners is one thing but the culture is in large part set any of those by the associates. Those satellite firms (Willkie/Simpson) also have vastly different exit opportunities from each other and V&E (Simpson/K&E have similar exits from a PE perspective). Willkie’s finance group, for example, represents mostly borrowers while Simpson represents mostly agents.

Yeah, that makes total sense. I've had a few people say that you shouldn't base it too much off the associates since they might easily be gone in 2 years by the time you're actually there, but I know partners move around too, and what you said definitely makes sense. I think I took what people have said about partners mattering too far... I guess I just need to try to meet some more associates from both places. I had some non-legal WE before law school and sometimes wish I had something more legal just to get a better of idea of what I want. I have some idea, but sometimes when people talk about exit options, I have a hard time because I'm just not sure where I see myself or what practice group within transactional I'll even end up in

[Anonymous User]

Not to hijack the above poster's discussion, but I am in a similar decision but on the transactional side. Really don't know how to decide, don't really care about prestige, and worry a little bit about culture and wonder if its defensible to pick a satellite office over Kirkland and V&E. No Latham offer yet but not really long enough to say for sure that I didn't get an offer so would appreciate opinions about them as well.

Totally depends which satellites we’re talking about. Certainly not crazy to pick Sidley or Willkie (though most people probably wouldn’t), but it would probably be crazy to pick a White & Case or Skadden.

Willkie is pretty much the main firm I'm considering besides VE/KE, although I also really liked the partners from Simpson. I'm with you on White & Case or Skadden, declined an offer from one of them or a similarly situated firm. I'm just incredibly torn otherwise.

FWIW, it should matter a lot more if you liked the juniors and midlevels as those are the people you will primarily be working with at any of those firms. Liking the partners is one thing but the culture is in large part set any of those by the associates. Those satellite firms (Willkie/Simpson) also have vastly different exit opportunities from each other and V&E (Simpson/K&E have similar exits from a PE perspective). Willkie’s finance group, for example, represents mostly borrowers while Simpson represents mostly agents.

Yeah, that makes total sense. I've had a few people say that you shouldn't base it too much off the associates since they might easily be gone in 2 years by the time you're actually there, but I know partners move around too, and what you said definitely makes sense. I think I took what people have said about partners mattering too far... I guess I just need to try to meet some more associates from both places. I had some non-legal WE before law school and sometimes wish I had something more legal just to get a better of idea of what I want. I have some idea, but sometimes when people talk about exit options, I have a hard time because I'm just not sure where I see myself or what practice group within transactional I'll even end up in

Sounds to me like you should do second looks with all 4 of those firms before making a decision. You should be able to specifically ask to meet with people you haven’t met with, likely down to the practice group and class (junior/mid/senior).

[Anonymous User]

Not to hijack the above poster's discussion, but I am in a similar decision but on the transactional side. Really don't know how to decide, don't really care about prestige, and worry a little bit about culture and wonder if its defensible to pick a satellite office over Kirkland and V&E. No Latham offer yet but not really long enough to say for sure that I didn't get an offer so would appreciate opinions about them as well.

Totally depends which satellites we’re talking about. Certainly not crazy to pick Sidley or Willkie (though most people probably wouldn’t), but it would probably be crazy to pick a White & Case or Skadden.

Willkie is pretty much the main firm I'm considering besides VE/KE, although I also really liked the partners from Simpson. I'm with you on White & Case or Skadden, declined an offer from one of them or a similarly situated firm. I'm just incredibly torn otherwise.

FWIW, it should matter a lot more if you liked the juniors and midlevels as those are the people you will primarily be working with at any of those firms. Liking the partners is one thing but the culture is in large part set any of those by the associates. Those satellite firms (Willkie/Simpson) also have vastly different exit opportunities from each other and V&E (Simpson/K&E have similar exits from a PE perspective). Willkie’s finance group, for example, represents mostly borrowers while Simpson represents mostly agents.

Yeah, that makes total sense. I've had a few people say that you shouldn't base it too much off the associates since they might easily be gone in 2 years by the time you're actually there, but I know partners move around too, and what you said definitely makes sense. I think I took what people have said about partners mattering too far... I guess I just need to try to meet some more associates from both places. I had some non-legal WE before law school and sometimes wish I had something more legal just to get a better of idea of what I want. I have some idea, but sometimes when people talk about exit options, I have a hard time because I'm just not sure where I see myself or what practice group within transactional I'll even end up in

Sounds to me like you should do second looks with all 4 of those firms before making a decision. You should be able to specifically ask to meet with people you haven’t met with, likely down to the practice group and class (junior/mid/senior).

Great, yeah, I'm going to focus on that this week. Thanks so much. Do you have any thoughts of it would easier to lateral from, say, KE to Simpson than Simpson to KE or anything like that?

[Anonymous User]

Not to hijack the above poster's discussion, but I am in a similar decision but on the transactional side. Really don't know how to decide, don't really care about prestige, and worry a little bit about culture and wonder if its defensible to pick a satellite office over Kirkland and V&E. No Latham offer yet but not really long enough to say for sure that I didn't get an offer so would appreciate opinions about them as well.

Totally depends which satellites we’re talking about. Certainly not crazy to pick Sidley or Willkie (though most people probably wouldn’t), but it would probably be crazy to pick a White & Case or Skadden.

Willkie is pretty much the main firm I'm considering besides VE/KE, although I also really liked the partners from Simpson. I'm with you on White & Case or Skadden, declined an offer from one of them or a similarly situated firm. I'm just incredibly torn otherwise.

Why? Look at the difference in how a K&E or Sidley has gained traction in the H, while Willkie is...well, Willkie and has had some Matt Schaub-like turnover problems. You have to be very careful in picking the right satellite office if that’s the path you go. Recommend V&E then K&E then Sidley.

[Anonymous User]

Not to hijack the above poster's discussion, but I am in a similar decision but on the transactional side. Really don't know how to decide, don't really care about prestige, and worry a little bit about culture and wonder if its defensible to pick a satellite office over Kirkland and V&E. No Latham offer yet but not really long enough to say for sure that I didn't get an offer so would appreciate opinions about them as well.

Totally depends which satellites we’re talking about. Certainly not crazy to pick Sidley or Willkie (though most people probably wouldn’t), but it would probably be crazy to pick a White & Case or Skadden.

Willkie is pretty much the main firm I'm considering besides VE/KE, although I also really liked the partners from Simpson. I'm with you on White & Case or Skadden, declined an offer from one of them or a similarly situated firm. I'm just incredibly torn otherwise.

Why? Look at the difference in how a K&E or Sidley has gained traction in the H, while Willkie is...well, Willkie and has had some Matt Schaub-like turnover problems. You have to be very careful in picking the right satellite office if that’s the path you go. Recommend V&E then K&E then Sidley.

.

[Anonymous User]

Great, yeah, I'm going to focus on that this week. Thanks so much. Do you have any thoughts of it would easier to lateral from, say, KE to Simpson than Simpson to KE or anything like that?

Might be marginally more difficult to go from KE to Simpson because Simpson just don’t take as many laterals generally and some partners aren’t the biggest fans of KE. There hasn’t been a lateral from KE to Simpson who wasn’t at Simpson before. That being said, servicing similar clients on similar types of deals means that laterals are entertained.

If you’re entertaining both offers, then look to (or ask on your second look about) the clients serviced (middle market PE v top of market), assignment system (eat what you kill v. central staffing / rotation), practice area selection (e.g., does your preference matter and can you control which group you go into), and the people (you’ve likely already met 25% of the associates in the Simpson office already and likely 2-3 of the 4 partners between screeners and callback, much harder to hide a bad egg).

For your Simpson second look, ask to do it on a Thursday and mention you want to check out the weekly in-office happy hour that an associate mentioned to you if possible.

[Anonymous User]

Not to hijack the above poster's discussion, but I am in a similar decision but on the transactional side. Really don't know how to decide, don't really care about prestige, and worry a little bit about culture and wonder if its defensible to pick a satellite office over Kirkland and V&E. No Latham offer yet but not really long enough to say for sure that I didn't get an offer so would appreciate opinions about them as well.

Totally depends which satellites we’re talking about. Certainly not crazy to pick Sidley or Willkie (though most people probably wouldn’t), but it would probably be crazy to pick a White & Case or Skadden.

Willkie is pretty much the main firm I'm considering besides VE/KE, although I also really liked the partners from Simpson. I'm with you on White & Case or Skadden, declined an offer from one of them or a similarly situated firm. I'm just incredibly torn otherwise.

Why? Look at the difference in how a K&E or Sidley has gained traction in the H, while Willkie is...well, Willkie and has had some Matt Schaub-like turnover problems. You have to be very careful in picking the right satellite office if that’s the path you go. Recommend V&E then K&E then Sidley.

God damnit, I haven't thought about Matt Schaub in a while but that metaphor totally speaks to me. I guess in regards to K&E specifically, I sometimes worry about the culture with some of the negative things you hear (especially in real life...I use more caution with what I hear on TLS). I know some of it is just rumors. I don't particularly care about prestige, although I of course want to be work hard and be busy doing good work at a healthy firm. I sort of liked the smaller environment of the satellite offices and enjoyed the people/really felt good after those callbacks and any subsequent things I've done with people from the office... but maybe I'm just looking at it through glasses that are too tinted with all the anti-K&E comments.

Respectfully, this is your own career you’re talking about. Don’t let negative recruiting from firms with obvious biases and agendas dictate your choices. Kirkland is not all sunshine and rainbows, but it is massive, unprecedented success in this market that has brought out that type of recruitment strategy.

Would you let political attack ads be the last word in helping you choose a candidate? Hopefully, if they raised a concern for you, the next step would be to do your own research.

Right now, you have a unique opportunity to make a decision that is going to affect the next few years of your life, with ripples all down the rest of your career. Do the diligence, make the calls, go for second looks. Look up deal statistics, ask to speak to senior partners.

[Neff]

The amount of hardcoreness in this thread is impressive. Me, I got one exactly offer from a band 4 corporate firm (albeit market-paying). Didn't know the difference between M&A and A&M the day I started, much less all this PE vs. capital markets, upper vs middle vs lower middle, & all the acronyms. Pre-2014 it was so much simpler, you got an offer from one of the big 3 and you were done. The market is so dynamic now, it's hard to say whether precise planning will actually mean anything since in two years time no one knows how the market will look, or whether being at X vs Y firm will lead to a more fulfilling career. I think once you all start, you'll realize that for at least your first few years, you'll be doing the same grunt work no matter where you are, and that the perceived differences between practice groups, types of clients, prestige, etc. all just add up to the same long hours and grind.