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[patogordo]

Anytime someone says "I did X and it made me want to become a lawyer" I think "no it didn't"

[Anonymous User]

Anytime someone says "I did X and it made me want to become a lawyer" I think "no it didn't"

What about "I talked to lawyers, liked what they did, and then went to law school." Is that reasonable?

[patogordo]

Anytime someone says "I did X and it made me want to become a lawyer" I think "no it didn't"

What about "I talked to lawyers, liked what they did, and then went to law school." Is that reasonable?

I mean, you have to say something. My point is that it's all bullshit, so get it over with and move the conversation to something more interesting.

[cron1834]

Weird/interesting shit is definitely a plus for interviews, as long as you're good at talking about it. My resume is weird as shit, to the point where most interviews would start with the interviewer looking at my resume, looking confused, and then asking "so...what exactly is going on here?" So I would view it as a strength, especially if you're the blind melon guy

I wouldn't worry a whole lot about tying whatever weird shit is on your resume to law unless there's a natural connection or you look like a flight risk. You're way better off just using it to make you seem like a likeable and interesting human being, which will immediately distinguish you from most other interviewees.

I'm going to be banking on this and similar advice come summer. Weird resume.

This is a good thread.

[ymmv]

Anytime someone says "I did X and it made me want to become a lawyer" I think "no it didn't"

What about "I talked to lawyers, liked what they did, and then went to law school." Is that reasonable?

Nah, makes you sound gullible.

[patogordo]

I mean know your limits. If you're not good at interviewing / not good at conversation then I'd be more careful. But in general I just tried to be interesting and I think it worked.

[Robb]

Yea, "my original career path didn't work out and I took a law class and kinda liked it so thought why not and went to law school" doesn't work out very well either. Just FYI.

[patogordo]

Yea, "my original career path didn't work out and I took a law class and kinda liked it so thought why not and went to law school" doesn't work out very well either. Just FYI.

In general it's a good idea to paint yourself as the master of your own destiny. Make career moves sound like they were your idea, talk about how they went well, etc.

[patogordo]

Also entirely possible I shouldn't be giving advice on this so take it with a grain of salt. I have no way to know whether my interviewing helped or hurt.

[sparty99]

Yea, "my original career path didn't work out and I took a law class and kinda liked it so thought why not and went to law school" doesn't work out very well either. Just FYI.

Of course that wouldn't work, however, saying that you had a successful career in xyyz, but always wanted to go back to school and get an advanced degree works. I took a law class and did well so I talked to lawyers who changed careers, shadowed some of them, and realized that law was the path that I wanted. It is the "got fired/laid off, couldn't get a job, suck at Math couldn't do the GMAT, thought law would save me answer" that is not good. It's all about how you spin shit. Clearly.

[sparty99]

Actual question:

Lets say my background is in Econ/Finance & Art/Music. Having a hard time not coming off as a floofy idiot when employers see the second category of stuff. My best individual accomplishments are the second category. How do I avoid this?

Honestly, the best I did was interviewed with a firm that was into that type of shit and had a reputation for wanting people with interesting backgrounds. Not that helpful, but maybe try to spin it favorably.

If you were a performer/composer then really, that is no different than having a hobby/interest in something outside of law which you would probably talk about when they ask what you do "for fun." Unless you also managed a band and booked tour dates, negotiated music contracts (etc) then the fact that you are a great composer/performer really won't matter to the firm as the skills you had in music aren't readily transferable. But all-in-all, it really doesn't matter. It's all about being quasi interesting, not fucking up answers, relating with your interviewer, and talking about other shit.

[Liquox]

The people I knew who had the most success at OCI were very often the most arrogant, entitled assholes in school. That shit can fly in 20 min interviews. People that struggle at OCI don't necessarily have shitty personalities. They might. Or they might actually have personalities that don't jive with the dozens of type-a assholes that populate big law firms.

So your point's not totally off in the sense that there is often more than luck at play but I don't think it plays out the way you say it does. That being said, there is still some luck, I think, based on the people you get matched up with. I've done interviews when I walk in the door and the interviewer is taking a personal call or clearly not interested before it even starts. That is luck.

Have you even done OCI? Why are you anecdotally referring to a friend's experience? And FYI, I'm pretty sure more than 10 ppl struck out at each of CCN.

your attention to detail suggests you go to a TTT. i even have my application cycle in my profile. if for some reason you go to a half-respectable law school, your post will now be used as my example of "precious". (fyi: your strawmanning need work)

also, i said entitled, not arrogant; those are not the same thing. you should know this if you scored anything close to acceptable on the lsat. there's nothing unemployable about a "type-a asshole"; you just have to have the rest of your shit together. if you're an arrogant piece of shit who happens to be a former investment banker now on harvard law review, it's reasonable to expect an offer from cravath/skadden/sullcrom. if you're a arrogant piece of shit from a T20 who is k-jd and at median, you deserve nothing and believing otherwise makes you an entitled moron.

take this as a dose of reality: if you can't get a job, it's not the world, it's you... and you're in the wrong field if you're looking for coddling and hand-holding.

Decided to go full retard eh? Bold move.

This is so grossly misinformed and arrogant, there's no way you've actually been through a T10 OCI yourself. Of course luck plays a huge role, you idiot. Let me clarify this for you: bad luck is not the ONLY factor, it is one of MANY factors. Luck plays a smaller role at the extremes but becomes make or break at the margins. Your T6 friend's "anecdote" is stupid and irrelevant.

Do you have any idea how many people only get ONE offer from OCI? No you don't, because you don't know shit. Hint: it's a huge number. 2 offers and 4 CBs was the median at my T10's OCI. That means half the people at my school got 2 offers or less, Simple Jack. If you can't understand how luck obviously plays a role in the very common situation where someone who had 20 screeners and 5 CBs got 1 offer, versus someone who had 20 screeners and 5 CBs got NO offers, you're beyond help.

I'd also like to point out that none of this information changes the fact that people who are struggling need to figure out how to improve their weaknesses. Like I said, luck is just one factor among many.

You really think it's T14 + not aspie = offer, eh? What are all these letters on my transcript for then? Why do all these firms want to see my resume? Why is 20 minutes not long enough to determine whether "I need an attitude adjustment?" Just lol.

(disclaimer: I didn't strike out, but know several very non-aspie, smart bidders at my T10 who did. So... fuck this guy)

super funny. come to DC if you have real game. otherwise, at your butthurt. (any chance you're from berkeley? every other one of you seems to care about "feeling," which probably explains why y'all struck out.)

one more thing i forgot to mention: for those of you at a T10, if you somehow managed to strike out of your own home market and your home market is bigger than miami, seek help or drop out.

[FKASunny]

Chastising someone for conflating synonyms and then extrapolating that to mean they did shitty on the LSAT is not a good look, wine bottle

[patogordo]

also just fucking LOL at getting mad because someone doesn't share your precise definition of "entitled"

[WhiskeynCoke]

what's the point of getting bitchy about jobs? if you don't have one, too bad. no amount of whining about luck is going to fix that.

the trouble with letting fools believe they struck out because of bad luck is that they don't do much to improve themselves afterwards. your personality sucks; either DF or someone else can tell you that. this above median/below median stuff means nothing compared to whether or not you come off as "precious" or some other atrocious piece of crap. for those of you who struck out from a t10, either you suck at bidding or you need an attitude adjustment.

anecdotally, my friend at T6 tells me of the 10 people who struck out at her OCI last year, 5 were anywhere from top 20% to law review. three guys bid DC or smaller markets only, and the rest were entitled fucks. apparently one of these people went 0/6or7 callbacks in NY.

The people I knew who had the most success at OCI were very often the most arrogant, entitled assholes in school. That shit can fly in 20 min interviews. People that struggle at OCI don't necessarily have shitty personalities. They might. Or they might actually have personalities that don't jive with the dozens of type-a assholes that populate big law firms.

So your point's not totally off in the sense that there is often more than luck at play but I don't think it plays out the way you say it does. That being said, there is still some luck, I think, based on the people you get matched up with. I've done interviews when I walk in the door and the interviewer is taking a personal call or clearly not interested before it even starts. That is luck.

Have you even done OCI? Why are you anecdotally referring to a friend's experience? And FYI, I'm pretty sure more than 10 ppl struck out at each of CCN.

your attention to detail suggests you go to a TTT. i even have my application cycle in my profile. if for some reason you go to a half-respectable law school, your post will now be used as my example of "precious". (fyi: your strawmanning need work)

also, i said entitled, not arrogant; those are not the same thing. you should know this if you scored anything close to acceptable on the lsat. there's nothing unemployable about a "type-a asshole"; you just have to have the rest of your shit together. if you're an arrogant piece of shit who happens to be a former investment banker now on harvard law review, it's reasonable to expect an offer from cravath/skadden/sullcrom. if you're a arrogant piece of shit from a T20 who is k-jd and at median, you deserve nothing and believing otherwise makes you an entitled moron.

take this as a dose of reality: if you can't get a job, it's not the world, it's you... and you're in the wrong field if you're looking for coddling and hand-holding.

U Chicago eh? Haha, figures. Thanks for reinforcing stereotypes bro.. what a douche.

Is it hard to type with one hand, since you clearly can't stop jerking yourself off? I guess you serve as a great example of "I'm an arrogant asshole but I still got a job!"

Good luck attempting to progress in a service industry with your obvious character flaws.

[Liquox]

U Chicago eh? Haha, figures. Thanks for reinforcing stereotypes bro.. what a douche.

Is it hard to type with one hand, since you clearly can't stop jerking yourself off? I guess you serve as a great example of "I'm an arrogant asshole but I still got a job!"

Good luck attempting to progress in a service industry with your obvious character flaws.

forgot to mention: i transferred up not that it matter since my degree > your degree

edit: thanks for the reminder

Chastising someone for conflating synonyms and then extrapolating that to mean they did shitty on the LSAT is not a good look, wine bottle

much like you smoking in public, i don't give a damn about looking good. some of these kids need to learn to get their shit together and act like a normal adult.

also just fucking LOL at getting mad because someone doesn't share your precise definition of "entitled"

one cannot and get mad at the same time, but you're welcome to try

[Mal Reynolds]

forgot to mention: i transferred not that it matter since my degree > your degree

edit: thanks for the reminder
y

Well good to see some things never change around U Chicago.

[Liquox]

forgot to mention: i transferred not that it matter since my degree > your degree

edit: thanks for the reminder
y

Well good to see some things never change around U Chicago.

you misinterpreted lol

[patogordo]

transfers gonna transfer

[Mal Reynolds]

forgot to mention: i transferred not that it matter since my degree > your degree

edit: thanks for the reminder
y

Well good to see some things never change around U Chicago.

you misinterpreted lol

No seems like we always recruit solid people no matter what year.

[Liquox]

No seems like we always recruit solid people no matter what year.

chicago had good people, but opportunity knocked

[patogordo]

just know that you'll never get the respect of blessedassurance

[WhiskeynCoke]

U Chicago eh? Haha, figures. Thanks for reinforcing stereotypes bro.. what a douche.

Is it hard to type with one hand, since you clearly can't stop jerking yourself off? I guess you serve as a great example of "I'm an arrogant asshole but I still got a job!"

Good luck attempting to progress in a service industry with your obvious character flaws.

forgot to mention: i transferred not that it matter since my degree > your degree

edit: thanks for the reminder

Chastising someone for conflating synonyms and then extrapolating that to mean they did shitty on the LSAT is not a good look, wine bottle

much like you smoking in public, i don't give a damn about looking good. some of these kids need to learn to get their shit together and act like a normal adult.

also just fucking LOL at getting mad because someone doesn't share your precise definition of "entitled"

one cannot and get mad at the same time, but you're welcome to try

The fact that you included these two statements together in the same post is just too much haha. Let me guess, K-JD with rich parents? Pasty-white, out of shape and can't get laid? No real friends? And no, the guys you sit around the library with bragging over who got the higher exam scores don't count.

I'd love to see you attempt to interact with other humans in a social setting... It must be a sight to see. I bet you're just beloved by all your classmates. By all means, continue your prestigeterbation. I'm sure going to the highest ranking everything and bragging to everyone about it will give you true fulfillment and some great, life-long friends who love you for who you are.

Also, you never addressed a single one of my substantive points. Presumably because you have no response. I guess that means I win. Also, I did much better on the LSAT than you bro. Obviously that means I'm a superior being, right?

Also you probably just outed yourself, idiot. I'm sure there's only so many insufferable douchebags who transfer out of U Chicago every year.

[Mal Reynolds]

Also you probably just outed yourself, idiot. I'm sure there's only so many insufferable douchebags who transfer out of U Chicago every year.

Ehhh not so fast. There are literally dozens of them.

[Liquox]

The fact that you included these two statements together in the same post is just too much haha. Let me guess, K-JD with rich parents? Pasty-white, out of shape and can't get laid? No real friends? And no, the guys you sit around the library with bragging over who got the higher exam scores don't count.

I'd love to see you attempt to interact with other humans in a social setting... It must be a sight to see. I bet you're just beloved by all your classmates. By all means, continue your prestigeterbation. I'm sure going to the highest ranking everything and bragging to everyone about it will give you true fulfillment and some great, life-long friends who love you for who you are.

Also, you never addressed a single one of my substantive points. Presumably because you have no response. I guess that means I win. Also, I did much better on the LSAT than you bro. Obviously that means I'm a superior being, right?

Also you probably just outed yourself, idiot. I'm sure there's only so many insufferable douchebags who transfer out of U Chicago every year.

the words of a man/woman/hippie who has no other way of acknowledging his degree is unimpressive. again, your opinion doesn't matter until get a job outside of your home market, though at you thinking/wishing you might have better game than a harvard man.