2014 University of Virginia OGI Thread Forum

[Yardbird]

For symplicity cover letters, use the contact information from NALP or the contact information in symplicity? I have the NALP addresses for the firms I'm bidding on but some of them on symplicity list the contact information for a different office.

Also, while I'm on the topic - a lot of firms don't seem to be requesting cover letters. Should we be sending CLs directly to the firm expressing an interest to interview at OGI? It seems like submitting only a Resume/Transcript turns a bit more into a numbers game than when submitting a Resume/CL/Transcript.

[5ky]

For symplicity cover letters, use the contact information from NALP or the contact information in symplicity? I have the NALP addresses for the firms I'm bidding on but some of them on symplicity list the contact information for a different office.

Also, while I'm on the topic - a lot of firms don't seem to be requesting cover letters. Should we be sending CLs directly to the firm expressing an interest to interview at OGI? It seems like submitting only a Resume/Transcript turns a bit more into a numbers game than when submitting a Resume/CL/Transcript.

It is a numbers game. If they wanted a CL they would have asked for one.

[Br3v]

For symplicity cover letters, use the contact information from NALP or the contact information in symplicity? I have the NALP addresses for the firms I'm bidding on but some of them on symplicity list the contact information for a different office.

Also, while I'm on the topic - a lot of firms don't seem to be requesting cover letters. Should we be sending CLs directly to the firm expressing an interest to interview at OGI? It seems like submitting only a Resume/Transcript turns a bit more into a numbers game than when submitting a Resume/CL/Transcript.

It is a numbers game. If they wanted a CL they would have asked for one.

Really happy for this answer, as I was not planning on making CLs for the firms that did not ask for one.

[WahooLaw24]

For symplicity cover letters, use the contact information from NALP or the contact information in symplicity? I have the NALP addresses for the firms I'm bidding on but some of them on symplicity list the contact information for a different office.

Also, while I'm on the topic - a lot of firms don't seem to be requesting cover letters. Should we be sending CLs directly to the firm expressing an interest to interview at OGI? It seems like submitting only a Resume/Transcript turns a bit more into a numbers game than when submitting a Resume/CL/Transcript.

Talked to career services and they said NALP Directory address is recommended. I believe symplicity, for many firms at least, just lists the same address for all different branches.

[Yardbird]

For symplicity cover letters, use the contact information from NALP or the contact information in symplicity? I have the NALP addresses for the firms I'm bidding on but some of them on symplicity list the contact information for a different office.

Also, while I'm on the topic - a lot of firms don't seem to be requesting cover letters. Should we be sending CLs directly to the firm expressing an interest to interview at OGI? It seems like submitting only a Resume/Transcript turns a bit more into a numbers game than when submitting a Resume/CL/Transcript.

Talked to career services and they said NALP Directory address is recommended. I believe symplicity, for many firms at least, just lists the same address for all different branches.

Thanks, that's good news since NALP had one recruiter's named listed as Mrs. Blank MaidenName MarriedName and Symplicity had Ms. Blank MaidenName. Didn't want to accidentally send a letter with the married name in case NALP was outdated - definitely don't want to get on someone's bad side for reminding them about a divorce.

[WahooLaw24]

For symplicity cover letters, use the contact information from NALP or the contact information in symplicity? I have the NALP addresses for the firms I'm bidding on but some of them on symplicity list the contact information for a different office.

Also, while I'm on the topic - a lot of firms don't seem to be requesting cover letters. Should we be sending CLs directly to the firm expressing an interest to interview at OGI? It seems like submitting only a Resume/Transcript turns a bit more into a numbers game than when submitting a Resume/CL/Transcript.

Talked to career services and they said NALP Directory address is recommended. I believe symplicity, for many firms at least, just lists the same address for all different branches.

Thanks, that's good news since NALP had one recruiter's named listed as Mrs. Blank MaidenName MarriedName and Symplicity had Ms. Blank MaidenName. Didn't want to accidentally send a letter with the married name in case NALP was outdated - definitely don't want to get on someone's bad side for reminding them about a divorce.

I mean for something like that I would probably check the firm website and see what she's listed as on there? That would seem to be the safest way to play it.

[Yardbird]

For symplicity cover letters, use the contact information from NALP or the contact information in symplicity? I have the NALP addresses for the firms I'm bidding on but some of them on symplicity list the contact information for a different office.

Also, while I'm on the topic - a lot of firms don't seem to be requesting cover letters. Should we be sending CLs directly to the firm expressing an interest to interview at OGI? It seems like submitting only a Resume/Transcript turns a bit more into a numbers game than when submitting a Resume/CL/Transcript.

Talked to career services and they said NALP Directory address is recommended. I believe symplicity, for many firms at least, just lists the same address for all different branches.

Thanks, that's good news since NALP had one recruiter's named listed as Mrs. Blank MaidenName MarriedName and Symplicity had Ms. Blank MaidenName. Didn't want to accidentally send a letter with the married name in case NALP was outdated - definitely don't want to get on someone's bad side for reminding them about a divorce.

I mean for something like that I would probably check the firm website and see what she's listed as on there? That would seem to be the safest way to play it.

Firm website linked to the NALP form so I'm going with that. I just wasn't sure if Symplicity had newer info or not.

[kingjones59]

Am I missing something or is (Squire) Patton Boggs no longer on the list of OCI employers on simplicity?

[Yardbird]

Am I missing something or is (Squire) Patton Boggs no longer on the list of OCI employers on simplicity?

They're under resume collect.

[Br3v]

Am I missing something or is (Squire) Patton Boggs no longer on the list of OCI employers on simplicity?

I think they are NOT doing OGI

[Br3v]

If a firm has "LLP" at the end of it but normally they leave the LLP off when referring to themselves (I am not talking about dropping names off, just the "LLP") should we still include the LLP in a cover letter?

What about the rare "LLP (US)" ?

[Yardbird]

If a firm has "LLP" at the end of it but normally they leave the LLP off when referring to themselves (I am not talking about dropping names off, just the "LLP") should we still include the LLP in a cover letter?

What about the rare "LLP (US)" ?

I have been using the stylization found in the copyright line at the bottom of their websites. For example, WilmerHale uses the shortened name when referring to itself in news (and NALP), but the full name (including the other names and the LLP) are at the bottom of the page in the copyright section. Same for other firms that don't chop off names but don't reference the LLP. So for a firm like WilmerHale, I reference the full name in the address block, and once again in my initial paragraph. After that, I use firm names without the LLP and I use shortened names (e.g. WilmerHale) where appropriate.

[Br3v]

If a firm has "LLP" at the end of it but normally they leave the LLP off when referring to themselves (I am not talking about dropping names off, just the "LLP") should we still include the LLP in a cover letter?

What about the rare "LLP (US)" ?

I have been using the stylization found in the copyright line at the bottom of their websites. For example, WilmerHale uses the shortened name when referring to itself in news (and NALP), but the full name (including the other names and the LLP) are at the bottom of the page in the copyright section. Same for other firms that don't chop off names but don't reference the LLP. So for a firm like WilmerHale, I reference the full name in the address block, and once again in my initial paragraph. After that, I use firm names without the LLP and I use shortened names (e.g. WilmerHale) where appropriate.

Same method. Thanks.

[Anonymous User]

With the bidding deadline looming, could someone take a quick look at my list and let me know if anything seems seriously off for one reason or another? I'm interested in lit and my cover letter is geared in that direction, but I acknowledge that I've had minimal exposure to the corporate side and will be taking some corporate classes in the fall. Accordingly, I tried to identify firms with both strong litigation and corporate practices so that I could ideally work on projects for each this summer. I'm just posting in alphabetical order as I haven't quite finalized a list yet, so I'm mostly looking for someone to say "that firm shouldn't be included because . . ." or "you forgot this firm because . . ."

Roughly a 3.80, LR, so I'm hoping to get a fair share of pre-selects (but not taking anything for granted). All offices are NY unless otherwise indicated (I'm from not too far outside the city and have decided to basically go all in on NY for OGI and then do some mass mailing in secondary markets).

Please don't quote! Thanks guys!

Akin Gump
Allen & Overy
Alston & Bird
Baker Botts
Bingham McCutchen
Boies, Schiller
Bracewell & Giuliani
Cadwalader
Cahill
Cleary
Covington
Cravath
Curtis
Davis Polk
Debevoise
Dechert
Drinker Biddle (NJ)
Fried Frank
Gibson Dunn
Greenberg Traurig
hogan lovells
Jones Day
K&L Gates
Katten
King & Spalding
Kirkland & Ellis
Latham & Watkins
Linklaters
Milbank
Morgan Lewis
Morgan Lewis (NJ)
Orrick
Paul Hastings
Paul Weiss
Pillsbury
Proskauer
Reed Smith
Ropes & Gray
Schulte Roth
Shearman & Sterling
Shipman & Goodwin (CT)
Sidley Austin
Simpson Thacher
Skadden
Sullivan & Cromwell
Vinson & Elkins
Weil
White & Case
Willkie Farr
WilmerHale
Winston Strawn

[5ky]

Looks fine. Order doesn't matter bc you won't participate in lottery. You'll have plenty of preselects and should have a number of good options from which to choose

[Anonymous User]

Looks fine. Order doesn't matter bc you won't participate in lottery. You'll have plenty of pre-selects and should have a number of good options from which to choose

Thanks for the feedback. Is it really often the case that students in that part of the class don't participate in the lottery at all (i.e. get over 23 pre-selects)?

[5ky]

Looks fine. Order doesn't matter bc you won't participate in lottery. You'll have plenty of pre-selects and should have a number of good options from which to choose

Thanks for the feedback. Is it really often the case that students in that part of the class don't participate in the lottery at all (i.e. get over 23 pre-selects)?

Yes. I was just under a 3.6 and did not participate in lottery. Granted, it was only 20 interviews when I was there and part of it was I had alternates that turned into preselects, but I'd be v. surprised if you needed lottery picks.

[daleearnhardt123]

Looks fine. Order doesn't matter bc you won't participate in lottery. You'll have plenty of pre-selects and should have a number of good options from which to choose

Thanks for the feedback. Is it really often the case that students in that part of the class don't participate in the lottery at all (i.e. get over 23 pre-selects)?

You're going to have 30-something, maybe 40 preselects.

[Anonymous User]

For symplicity cover letters, use the contact information from NALP or the contact information in symplicity? I have the NALP addresses for the firms I'm bidding on but some of them on symplicity list the contact information for a different office.

Also, while I'm on the topic - a lot of firms don't seem to be requesting cover letters. Should we be sending CLs directly to the firm expressing an interest to interview at OGI? It seems like submitting only a Resume/Transcript turns a bit more into a numbers game than when submitting a Resume/CL/Transcript.

It is a numbers game. If they wanted a CL they would have asked for one.

Really happy for this answer, as I was not planning on making CLs for the firms that did not ask for one.

You would be better served sprucing up a writing sample. Nobody asks for a cover letter after the interview. The only time it would be useful is when they're deciding whether to fly you out, and waste partner time.

[Anonymous User]

Looks fine. Order doesn't matter bc you won't participate in lottery. You'll have plenty of pre-selects and should have a number of good options from which to choose

Thanks for the feedback. Is it really often the case that students in that part of the class don't participate in the lottery at all (i.e. get over 23 pre-selects)?

I was over the 23, and while some people have a liberal definition of close, not close to law review (as in one A- vs. B+ didn't make the difference). There was a degree of randomness though as far as firms that shouldn't have denied me denying me while accepting others within .02 of me on both sides. Others were vice versa. There can be randomness so maybe put some thought into the top 5. If you mass mail and line something up nowish you can use the lottery, because at that point you don't need an offer anymore so lottery v. preselect is moot.

[Wahoos]

Looks fine. Order doesn't matter bc you won't participate in lottery. You'll have plenty of preselects and should have a number of good options from which to choose

If you have over 23 preselects though, can't you drop down to 22 if you still want a shot at your top firm from the lottery (if you didn't get preselected)?. I forget exactly how this works, but I remember there are some firms that only have 20 interview slots (so they're only going to preselect 14 people or whatever).

[DMXdawg]

I had a 3.4 or so and I had the max interviews and ~17 preselects. Not a URM or in IP. Perhaps this data point would be helpful!

[hoorahray]

Looks fine. Order doesn't matter bc you won't participate in lottery. You'll have plenty of preselects and should have a number of good options from which to choose

If you have over 23 preselects though, can't you drop down to 22 if you still want a shot at your top firm from the lottery (if you didn't get preselected)?. I forget exactly how this works, but I remember there are some firms that only have 20 interview slots (so they're only going to preselect 14 people or whatever).

Yes, you can do this. Consider that a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush, but you can do it. I'd only chance it if it was literally my #1 firm and I actually wanted to be at that firm rather than "hey I think I'll bid these guys #1 what the heck" sort of commitment to the firm. Don't forget that if you do drop to 22 to try to pick up your top lottery spot and you do not end up getting the firm by lotto, you can special request them. Or even pick up an interview from greeting room chatting.

[daleearnhardt123]

Looks fine. Order doesn't matter bc you won't participate in lottery. You'll have plenty of preselects and should have a number of good options from which to choose

If you have over 23 preselects though, can't you drop down to 22 if you still want a shot at your top firm from the lottery (if you didn't get preselected)?. I forget exactly how this works, but I remember there are some firms that only have 20 interview slots (so they're only going to preselect 14 people or whatever).

Yes, you can do this. Consider that a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush, but you can do it. I'd only chance it if it was literally my #1 firm and I actually wanted to be at that firm rather than "hey I think I'll bid these guys #1 what the heck" sort of commitment to the firm. Don't forget that if you do drop to 22 to try to pick up your top lottery spot and you do not end up getting the firm by lotto, you can special request them. Or even pick up an interview from greeting room chatting.

To add to this, you will have a VERY easy time with a 3.8 if you want to special request firms or collect interviews through chatting in the hospitality suites.

[Anonymous User]

Has anyone heard if LR has finished making their calls? Looking at past years, they don't publicly release their list until August. Who knows when they actually let those waiting right on the cutoff whether that 3.7x was good enough or not? Also just nosily curious to see the list.