The Vale of Tears (3L Job Hunting) (No advice for 0/1/2Ls) Forum

[JenDarby]

I can't believe I let myself get behind and late on clerkship apps. I really only have myself to blame, but I just lined up my recommenders.

I really want to get a rec from my BK professors, as he's known in the BK world and I received a good grade, but he doesn't use computers. This makes things far more tricky.

[kalvano]

I really want to get a rec from my BK professors, as he's known in the BK world and I received a good grade, but he doesn't use computers. This makes things far more tricky.

Does he have an assistant, or share an assistant with other professors? If so, talk to the assistant and set everything up in OSCAR. My professors just gave a copy of their letter to the assistant and she handled everything from there.

[chrisbru]

http://www.law2.byu.edu/page/?id=curren ... ntent=jobs

^Intercollegiate law job bank

User id= jobfind
Pw= EmployUs

Check the law schools (BigstateU, etc.) in your home state for job listings.

TYFT

[Anonymous User]

Currently studying for the bar and because I'm unemployed, am not sure how long it will take to find FT employment (or even income from any other sources either). I'm thinking I may have to take a private, bar-study loan in order to stay afloat (to pay rent/living expenses until I actually find a job). Has anyone had to do this/does anyone have suggestions on providers?

[kalvano]

Currently studying for the bar and because I'm unemployed, am not sure how long it will take to find FT employment (or even income from any other sources either). I'm thinking I may have to take a private, bar-study loan in order to stay afloat (to pay rent/living expenses until I actually find a job). Has anyone had to do this/does anyone have suggestions on providers?

Discover is pretty easy to get some from. I think you can go up to $15K.

[chrisbru]

Currently studying for the bar and because I'm unemployed, am not sure how long it will take to find FT employment (or even income from any other sources either). I'm thinking I may have to take a private, bar-study loan in order to stay afloat (to pay rent/living expenses until I actually find a job). Has anyone had to do this/does anyone have suggestions on providers?

Discover is pretty easy to get some from. I think you can go up to $15K.

$15K?! For 10 weeks? Whoa.

[BarbellDreams]

Its up to 15K but they basically require a cosigner. With no cosigner some will give it to you at like 12% interest. The reason its 15K is cause its not for 10 weeks, its for like 6 months by the time bar results come out.

[Joe Quincy]

Its up to 15K but they basically require a cosigner. With no cosigner some will give it to you at like 12% interest. The reason its 15K is cause its not for 10 weeks, its for like 6 months by the time bar results come out.

I have no cosignor and Discover gave me like 5.25% on a variable rate loan.

[kalvano]

Yeah, I was offered a loan with no co-signer.

[nevdash]

I think it's easy to get it with no co-signer, but they'll gape you on your interest rate if you don't have one. I have a pretty good credit score (definitely above average) and got 13.5%.

JQ is just lucky or something.

[Joe Quincy]

I think it's easy to get it with no co-signer, but they'll gape you on your interest rate if you don't have one. I have a pretty good credit score (definitely above average) and got 13.5%.

JQ is just lucky or something.

? I don't think so. My girlfriend was also approved at <6% without a co-signor at Discover (for a non-law school student loan). My credit score is like 792 but hers is more like 697.

Neither of us are sitting on six figures of debt though...so that may have something to do with it.

[dfsad]

Accepted an offer for a JD preferred job today. I might not be a "real" lawyer, but it's going to be a great learning experience, not to mention pretty good pay and benefits. Three weeks ago, I had absolutely nothing on the horizon, so don't give up hope because you never know when things are going to turn around.

Congrats! Can I ask how you searched for / came across this job?

I applied via Symplicity, but in researching the company/position, I noticed it was also posted on Linkedin and some other job websites

[nevdash]

I think it's easy to get it with no co-signer, but they'll gape you on your interest rate if you don't have one. I have a pretty good credit score (definitely above average) and got 13.5%.

JQ is just lucky or something.

? I don't think so. My girlfriend was also approved at <6% without a co-signor at Discover (for a non-law school student loan). My credit score is like 792 but hers is more like 697.

Neither of us are sitting on six figures of debt though...so that may have something to do with it.

Ah, maybe that's it. I'm high 600s as well, but rolling with $160k of debt.

[BarbellDreams]

Maybe its the debt thats the issue then. My friend who has six figure debt applied with Well Fargo and was basically told to get a cosigner cause the interest rate they would offer her without one wouldn't be something she would agree to.

[kalvano]

It's debt plus past credit history, or lack thereof.

[rad lulz]

.

[buddingjd]

As a 2L, it's fine to email asking for a phone call "to learn about your practice area blah blah blah." As a 3L, is that still ok, or should you be more blunt? (Blah blah blah, how we're connected in some way, blah blah, are you hiring 3Ls?)

[Nightrunner]

We got an ATL shoutout

http://abovethelaw.com/2013/07/the-ulti ... aw-school/

Pretty legit.

[kalvano]

We got an ATL shoutout

http://abovethelaw.com/2013/07/the-ulti ... aw-school/

Shame they cropped out all the stuff ab rad lulz

Wasn't me who sent it in.

[Anonymous User]

I feel so empty and hopeless about my future. How to overcome such crushing depression and ennui? Honestly, consideration for my family is the only thing that's preventing me from contemplating suicide. Despite what a loser I am, they love me and would be devastated if I made such a desperate move.

Mods, sticky this sh*t. "The Vale of Tears" thread should be required reading for every 0L.

[Anonymous User]

As a 2L, it's fine to email asking for a phone call "to learn about your practice area blah blah blah." As a 3L, is that still ok, or should you be more blunt? (Blah blah blah, how we're connected in some way, blah blah, are you hiring 3Ls?)

Been working for me so far

[NYstate]

I feel so empty and hopeless about my future. How to overcome such crushing depression and ennui? Honestly, consideration for my family is the only thing that's preventing me from contemplating suicide. Despite what a loser I am, they love me and would be devastated if I made such a desperate move.

Mods, sticky this sh*t. "The Vale of Tears" thread should be required reading for every 0L.

Don't judge yourself or your worth by your job. I know law is all about this, but it just isn't true. You aren't a loser because you don't have a job.

Every time I read a post like this I feel very sad. It makes me hate law, seriously hate law and the whole prestige and status factory and the over enrollment of law schools.

I can only confirm that your family will be devastated and may never recover. I had a close family member commit suicide and we've never been the same. Christmas and her birthday are terrible. We will never forgive ourselves. It is just such a waste.

Try to get counseling if you can. Tell people how you feel; don't keep it inside. I'm not a trained therapist so I don't want to throw out glib statements, but hang in there. Don't give up on yourself and your life.

[Anonymous User]

I feel so empty and hopeless about my future. How to overcome such crushing depression and ennui? Honestly, consideration for my family is the only thing that's preventing me from contemplating suicide. Despite what a loser I am, they love me and would be devastated if I made such a desperate move.

Mods, sticky this sh*t. "The Vale of Tears" thread should be required reading for every 0L.

Don't judge yourself or your worth by your job. I know law is all about this, but it just isn't true. You aren't a loser because you don't have a job.

Every time I read a post like this I feel very sad. It makes me hate law, seriously hate law and the whole prestige and status factory and the over enrollment of law schools.

I can only confirm that your family will be devastated and may never recover. I had a close family member commit suicide and we've never been the same. Christmas and her birthday are terrible. We will never forgive ourselves. It is just such a waste.

Try to get counseling if you can. Tell people how you feel; don't keep it inside. I'm not a trained therapist so I don't want to throw out glib statements, but hang in there. Don't give up on yourself and your life.

Thank you for your kind words.

Would I have to disclose counseling for C&F purposes?

[A. Nony Mouse]

Would I have to disclose counseling for C&F purposes?

Counseling for depression should not not not at all cause you any C&F problems. You will likely have to disclose if you seek treatment, but bar associations recognize that depression is a big problem in law, and don't want to discourage people from seeking help. My state's bar instructions say this:

The following questions address recent mental health and chemical or psychological dependency matters. The purpose of these questions is to determine the current fitness of an applicant to practice law. Each applicant is considered on an individualized basis. The mere fact of treatment for mental health problems or chemical or psychological dependency is not, in itself, a basis on which an applicant is ordinarily denied admission to the [state] bar. The Board of Law Examiners regularly recommends licensing of individuals who have demonstrated personal responsibility and maturity in dealing with mental health and chemical or psychological dependency issues. The Board encourages applicants who may benefit from treatment to seek it. As indicated in the Rules Governing Admission to the Bar, all proceedings conducted pursuant to the Rules are confidential, with certain limited and enumerated exceptions; further, no information is disclosed without giving the applicant advance notice and an opportunity to object.

On occasion a license may be denied when an applicant’s ability to function is impaired in a manner relevant to the practice of law at the time that the licensing decision is made, or when an applicant demonstrates a lack of candor by his or her responses. Protection of the public that will receive legal services underlies the licensing responsibilities assigned to the Board of Law Examiners. Furthermore, each applicant is responsible for demonstrating that he or she possesses the qualifications necessary to practice law. Your response may include information as to why, in your opinion or that of your treatment provider, your condition will not affect your ability to practice law in a competent and professional manner.

The Board does not, by its questions, seek information that is characterized as situational counseling, such as stress counseling, domestic counseling, and grief counseling. Generally, the Board does not view these types of counseling as germane to the issue of whether an applicant is qualified to practice law.

So (in my state) it's possible this would qualify as situational/stress counseling, anyway, which you wouldn't even have to disclose. But even if not, do not do not do not let worries about C&F stop you from talking to someone who can help (I know it's that circumstances suck right now, and a counselor can't get you a job, but they can still help, they really can). And no reasonable counselor/therapist is going to say that depression over job circumstances affects your ability to practice law.

Good luck to you.

[NYstate]

I feel so empty and hopeless about my future. How to overcome such crushing depression and ennui? Honestly, consideration for my family is the only thing that's preventing me from contemplating suicide. Despite what a loser I am, they love me and would be devastated if I made such a desperate move.

Mods, sticky this sh*t. "The Vale of Tears" thread should be required reading for every 0L.

Don't judge yourself or your worth by your job. I know law is all about this, but it just isn't true. You aren't a loser because you don't have a job.

Every time I read a post like this I feel very sad. It makes me hate law, seriously hate law and the whole prestige and status factory and the over enrollment of law schools.

I can only confirm that your family will be devastated and may never recover. I had a close family member commit suicide and we've never been the same. Christmas and her birthday are terrible. We will never forgive ourselves. It is just such a waste.

Try to get counseling if you can. Tell people how you feel; don't keep it inside. I'm not a trained therapist so I don't want to throw out glib statements, but hang in there. Don't give up on yourself and your life.

Thank you for your kind words.

Would I have to disclose counseling for C&F purposes?

I'm not sure. To be honest I've known people who had counseling and didn't report it. I'm not sure how they would find out. That said, I wouldn't recommend lying but I wouldn't rush to disclose a few sessions.

If you are in New York, the city bar association has a free referral line for law students.