COVID-19’s effect on your practice check in Forum

[Anonymous User]

Restructuring is, unsurprisingly, extremely busy. My firm has had several training sessions for corporate associates to get them up to speed on bankruptcy basics and has been actively trying to repurpose them.

[Anonymous User]

My firm is handling this terribly IMO. It seems every decision they are making only makes associates more worried and anxious.

First, it was emailing your office practice group leader your time estimate every day.

Next, it was finalizing all your time daily but you still had to send the estimate email (why?).

Now, we have to do weekly estimates of our time.

[AnonCanary123]

My firm is handling this terribly IMO. It seems every decision they are making only makes associates more worried and anxious.

First, it was emailing your office practice group leader your time estimate every day.

Next, it was finalizing all your time daily but you still had to send the estimate email (why?).

Now, we have to do weekly estimates of our time.

Weekly estimates of your time during this recession when most legal specialties (except ones previously mentioned here like BK or IP or whatever) seems ludicrous. What, they want you to read the future too?

[Anonymous User]

My firm is handling this terribly IMO. It seems every decision they are making only makes associates more worried and anxious.

First, it was emailing your office practice group leader your time estimate every day.

Next, it was finalizing all your time daily but you still had to send the estimate email (why?).

Now, we have to do weekly estimates of our time.

Weekly estimates of your time during this recession when most legal specialties (except ones previously mentioned here like BK or IP or whatever) seems ludicrous. What, they want you to read the future too?

I work in a boutique. My firm is pretty ludicrous - asked to fill out a time billing estimate spanning the next few months. Ha! I bet partners can't even predict that right now, let alone associates. Ridiculous.

[Anonymous User]

Weekly forward looking estimates are the norm at my firm (nyc v10), even in good times, so without more I don’t find this one that odd.

[AnonCanary123]

Weekly forward looking estimates are the norm at my firm (nyc v10), even in good times, so without more I don’t find this one that odd.

I mean, estimates are easier when the firm is in a good time since there's more work to be done, so you can estimate based on deadlines. I suppose depending on your practice there could be fire drills but that seems a lot more stable and predictable compared to now where a lot of people are experiencing slower hours. How do you estimate work that isn't there?

[Anonymous User]

Weekly forward looking estimates are the norm at my firm (nyc v10), even in good times, so without more I don’t find this one that odd.

I’m the poster who brought them up.

The issue is twofold:

1. You’re right that some firms do estimates. My old firm did them as well. But, nobody took them seriously (times were good) and after about a month I started ignoring them and apparently that was the norm.

2. Introducing a weekly estimate now is horrible optics and makes associates feel like shit. Yes, it’s normal at some firms. But if it wasn’t normal before...

[Anonymous User]

EBEC associate again:

Extremely busy, with seemingly no end in sight. All work has pretty much shifted to counseling and compliance (mostly companies restructuring equity/incentive comp structures, severance issues, 401(k) matching contribution issues) and dealing with all of the coronavirus legislation and implementation.

Surprised my firm isn’t hiring more associates into the practice given that the work will still be there when all of this is later reversed.

[Anonymous User]

Weekly forward looking estimates are the norm at my firm (nyc v10), even in good times, so without more I don’t find this one that odd.

I mean, estimates are easier when the firm is in a good time since there's more work to be done, so you can estimate based on deadlines. I suppose depending on your practice there could be fire drills but that seems a lot more stable and predictable compared to now where a lot of people are experiencing slower hours. How do you estimate work that isn't there?

I get where this is coming from, but if you are being asked to estimate how much free time you have and the matters you expect to work on over the next week, and the answers are “lots” and “none,” it seems pretty easy.

[Anonymous User]

I work at a patent litigation boutique in a major market. We have still been bringing in new business and hiring laterals. Our firm has told us that there has no been negative impact on business due to COVID-19 so far and is not anticipating layoffs or salary reductions.

[Anonymous User]

I work at a patent litigation boutique in a major market. We have still been bringing in new business and hiring laterals. Our firm has told us that there has no been negative impact on business due to COVID-19 so far and is not anticipating layoffs or salary reductions.

As a 3L going into the field, that's encouraging. Do you have any insight into whether there is a similar response at equivalent firms? Probably a long shot, but I figured I'd ask just in case. Thanks.

[Anonymous User]

Can anyone comment on the status of emerging company/venture capital work? Thanks.

[Anonymous User]

I work at a patent litigation boutique in a major market. We have still been bringing in new business and hiring laterals. Our firm has told us that there has no been negative impact on business due to COVID-19 so far and is not anticipating layoffs or salary reductions.

As a 3L going into the field, that's encouraging. Do you have any insight into whether there is a similar response at equivalent firms? Probably a long shot, but I figured I'd ask just in case. Thanks.

Unfortunately, I do not know what is happening at other boutiques. I would look at a firm's clients. Are they being heavily affected by the pandemic? Pharma companies are still going to be making money. Some tech firms will as well. Companies making luxury products likely will not be. But I believe that, in general, patent litigation is less affected by recessions than most other areas of law. If courts remain closed for an extended period, however, I anticipate that work will slow down.

[Anonymous User]

I work at a patent litigation boutique in a major market. We have still been bringing in new business and hiring laterals. Our firm has told us that there has no been negative impact on business due to COVID-19 so far and is not anticipating layoffs or salary reductions.

As a 3L going into the field, that's encouraging. Do you have any insight into whether there is a similar response at equivalent firms? Probably a long shot, but I figured I'd ask just in case. Thanks.

Unfortunately, I do not know what is happening at other boutiques. I would look at a firm's clients. Are they being heavily affected by the pandemic? Pharma companies are still going to be making money. Some tech firms will as well. Companies making luxury products likely will not be. But I believe that, in general, patent litigation is less affected by recessions than most other areas of law. If courts remain closed for an extended period, however, I anticipate that work will slow down.

My impression is that the overall US patent litigation market has been slowing for the last few years. I work as in-house IP counsel now, but it seems that every IP conference that I attend includes discussions and data on the slowdown in patent litigation in the US. Many litigators I know are moving into privacy, trade secret, etc.

[Anonymous User]

I work at a patent litigation boutique in a major market. We have still been bringing in new business and hiring laterals. Our firm has told us that there has no been negative impact on business due to COVID-19 so far and is not anticipating layoffs or salary reductions.

As a 3L going into the field, that's encouraging. Do you have any insight into whether there is a similar response at equivalent firms? Probably a long shot, but I figured I'd ask just in case. Thanks.

Unfortunately, I do not know what is happening at other boutiques. I would look at a firm's clients. Are they being heavily affected by the pandemic? Pharma companies are still going to be making money. Some tech firms will as well. Companies making luxury products likely will not be. But I believe that, in general, patent litigation is less affected by recessions than most other areas of law. If courts remain closed for an extended period, however, I anticipate that work will slow down.

My impression is that the overall US patent litigation market has been slowing for the last few years. I work as in-house IP counsel now, but it seems that every IP conference that I attend includes discussions and data on the slowdown in patent litigation in the US. Many litigators I know are moving into privacy, trade secret, etc.

I work at a patent litigation boutique in a major market as well.

Things can come to a screeching halt fast. We also had some recent lateral hiring going on. Frankly, I don't know what's going to happen to the recently onboarded. Yes, we may be less affected than corporate associates, but we aren't insulated. Clients are becoming more budget conscious and scrutinizing bills, asking that work slows down as deadlines get extended (and believe me, almost all of them are). Even pharma clients are affected - sure, maybe some of them are doing COVID related vaccine research, but is that a short term moneymaker? I've seen one client have to delay a drug launch because of COVID19 - that could be a LOT of money lost (we're talking millions). Clinical trials also aren't recruiting, which will delay the launch of future drugs. As for tech companies, my good friend works for a software company and they conducted layoffs this week.

Long story short, IP litigation isn't booming right now, there's just going to be a bit of a lag time before the full effect of COVID19 hits us the way it's already hit some corporate attorneys.

[Anonymous User]

For those working in-house or with closer relationships to those making these decisions, would it be aggressive/weird to proactively reach out and ask about layoffs? Mark Cuban suggests that - https://finance.yahoo.com/news/mark-cub ... 50378.html

[Anonymous User]

Can anyone comment on the status of emerging company/venture capital work? Thanks.

Associate at an SV biglaw firm that mostly does EC/VC. No big difference yet as our tech company clients are weathering this pretty well and were set up to remote work anyways. We’re actually dealing with a rush of work due to SBA related counseling, but that’s probably short term.

[ZVBXRPL]

For those working in-house or with closer relationships to those making these decisions, would it be aggressive/weird to proactively reach out and ask about layoffs? Mark Cuban suggests that - https://finance.yahoo.com/news/mark-cub ... 50378.html

Easy for the CEO to suggest being that aggressive.

[Anonymous User]

EBEC associate again:

Extremely busy, with seemingly no end in sight. All work has pretty much shifted to counseling and compliance (mostly companies restructuring equity/incentive comp structures, severance issues, 401(k) matching contribution issues) and dealing with all of the coronavirus legislation and implementation.

Surprised my firm isn’t hiring more associates into the practice given that the work will still be there when all of this is later reversed.

I am joining this practice area post-graduation. Not sure about deferred start date. But can you elaborate on how these months compare to others, hours-wise? Do you work on employment agreements? Separation agreements? Any DD on deals? Can you describe your firm's practice group size? Usual hours? ty for the post and update!

[Anonymous User]

I work at a patent litigation boutique in a major market. We have still been bringing in new business and hiring laterals. Our firm has told us that there has no been negative impact on business due to COVID-19 so far and is not anticipating layoffs or salary reductions.

As a 3L going into the field, that's encouraging. Do you have any insight into whether there is a similar response at equivalent firms? Probably a long shot, but I figured I'd ask just in case. Thanks.

Unfortunately, I do not know what is happening at other boutiques. I would look at a firm's clients. Are they being heavily affected by the pandemic? Pharma companies are still going to be making money. Some tech firms will as well. Companies making luxury products likely will not be. But I believe that, in general, patent litigation is less affected by recessions than most other areas of law. If courts remain closed for an extended period, however, I anticipate that work will slow down.

My impression is that the overall US patent litigation market has been slowing for the last few years. I work as in-house IP counsel now, but it seems that every IP conference that I attend includes discussions and data on the slowdown in patent litigation in the US. Many litigators I know are moving into privacy, trade secret, etc.

I work at a patent litigation boutique in a major market as well.

Things can come to a screeching halt fast. We also had some recent lateral hiring going on. Frankly, I don't know what's going to happen to the recently onboarded. Yes, we may be less affected than corporate associates, but we aren't insulated. Clients are becoming more budget conscious and scrutinizing bills, asking that work slows down as deadlines get extended (and believe me, almost all of them are). Even pharma clients are affected - sure, maybe some of them are doing COVID related vaccine research, but is that a short term moneymaker? I've seen one client have to delay a drug launch because of COVID19 - that could be a LOT of money lost (we're talking millions). Clinical trials also aren't recruiting, which will delay the launch of future drugs. As for tech companies, my good friend works for a software company and they conducted layoffs this week.

Long story short, IP litigation isn't booming right now, there's just going to be a bit of a lag time before the full effect of COVID19 hits us the way it's already hit some corporate attorneys.

I am also at a full service IP boutique in a major market. We have had a substantial uptick in litigation matters over the past few years compared to what we would typically have, and have had clients coming from "big law" and general firms. In that respect we have benefitted greatly from being reasonably priced. I think it is really is going to vary firm to firm in response to the original question. In relation to COVID, beyond extended deadlines, we have stayed busy so far. Additionally, some clients seem to want to try and aggressively enforce right now, as COVID applies additional pressure to the other side. (Not saying it's right, but that is the reality of what I have seen.)

[Anonymous User]

Can anyone comment on the status of emerging company/venture capital work? Thanks.

Associate at an SV biglaw firm that mostly does EC/VC. No big difference yet as our tech company clients are weathering this pretty well and were set up to remote work anyways. We’re actually dealing with a rush of work due to SBA related counseling, but that’s probably short term.

Thanks - that's very helpful to hear. As far as you're aware, is that the case across most bigger name EC/VC biglaw firms, in SV and in other cities?

[LSATWiz.com]

It would probably be nice to hear from those on the business side of things. Just because you're still working as much or billing as many hours doesn't mean those hours are getting paid out. You also can't be sure what workflow will look like in a month, but there are people with a much better understanding of that. A lack of transparency can add stress to an already stressful situation.

[Anonymous User]

It would probably be nice to hear from those on the business side of things. Just because you're still working as much or billing as many hours doesn't mean those hours are getting paid out. You also can't be sure what workflow will look like in a month, but there are people with a much better understanding of that. A lack of transparency can add stress to an already stressful situation.

Very good point. Starting to hear rumblings of being more cost and fee sensitive for some public clients that are feeling the hurt right now. I wouldn’t be surprised if they will aggressively pursue heavy cuts to bills.

[LSATWiz.com]

It would probably be nice to hear from those on the business side of things. Just because you're still working as much or billing as many hours doesn't mean those hours are getting paid out. You also can't be sure what workflow will look like in a month, but there are people with a much better understanding of that. A lack of transparency can add stress to an already stressful situation.

Very good point. Starting to hear rumblings of being more cost and fee sensitive for some public clients that are feeling the hurt right now. I wouldn’t be surprised if they will aggressively pursue heavy cuts to bills.

It's only anecdotal but I'm in house and based on conversations with accounting, revenue is down well over 50% while everyone seems to be working more than they did before the lockdown. It's daunting that management has not had any announcement about layoffs. Obviously, any business can only operate at a loss for so long but it would be nice to have some transparency on how long that is so employees can balance that with their own estimation of how long they expect this to last for to decide whether to start looking at other options. Some companies may be able and willing to operate at a loss for 6 months while others may be positioned to do so for 3, but us working men and women have no idea which companies and/or firms those are.

[Anonymous User]

EBEC associate again:

Extremely busy, with seemingly no end in sight. All work has pretty much shifted to counseling and compliance (mostly companies restructuring equity/incentive comp structures, severance issues, 401(k) matching contribution issues) and dealing with all of the coronavirus legislation and implementation.

Surprised my firm isn’t hiring more associates into the practice given that the work will still be there when all of this is later reversed.

I am joining this practice area post-graduation. Not sure about deferred start date. But can you elaborate on how these months compare to others, hours-wise? Do you work on employment agreements? Separation agreements? Any DD on deals? Can you describe your firm's practice group size? Usual hours? ty for the post and update!

This will depend heavily on your type of practice. There are three types:

Broad-based groups (think Proskauer, MLB, McDermott, and the main tax/benefits boutiques, etc.).

Essentially deal-only / ERISA for funds (most other traditional biglaw because most clients aren’t willing to pay $600-1500/hr for 401(k) and ACA compliance).

Heavy compliance (the smaller boutique firms; smaller biglaw firms that aren’t really as deal-based, mostly due to the fact that clients are willing to pay these amounts).

I work in a broad-based group, so I do some work on executive employment agreements (mostly the deferred comp/equity clauses of the C-suite agreement), severance agreements, and DD for deals. A larger part of my practice is Title I, though.

My firm has around 10-15 benefits/comp attorneys. Other attorneys do some benefits-related work (tax), but the core group is 10-15.

My billable hours last year were around 1950. That’s probably higher than most non-deal oriented practices. But I know friends in other firms who billed 2200+ hours in similar practices. If you’re going to a firm that’s heavily compliance-based, your hours may be better and you will probably have more control over your hours. The opposite is probably true if you end up at a huge deal-oriented practice (some firms actually have the practice as a corporate specialty group).

The past few months, I’m on track for 2300+ hours. On top of that, I’ve had to do a lot of extra work to prepare for presentations and talks on coronavirus, which added a significant number of hours (30+) this month.