Anonymous User wrote:Anonymous User wrote:Anonymous User wrote:Associate at Cravath here (and the only one in this thread from what I can tell), and LOL at about 60% of everything mentioned in this thread, starting with the 13 first-years who allegedly left.
Could you please elaborate? Some of us are in the process of making this decision and having a data point from inside the firm is very valuable (I was prepared for another level of horror when I met some associates / partners but unless they laid it on thick it didn't seem half as bad as TLS makes it out to be).
I'm the CSM associate who posted this. I have no idea WTF happened in this thread, but on the outside chance that anyone is still reading this for substance I'll elaborate a bit.
I know of five first-years who left before their planned date. Three just kinda peaced out within four months because they didn't need the job (i.e. no debt and whatnot) and didn't think it worth the hours. One moved back home because that person's SO got a new job there. And one allegedly failed the bar for the second time in February. Everyone else I can think of who left (and I have no idea if that adds up to 13) left for clerkships they had already accepted before they started at the firm.
The average hours here are about the same as those at our peers in NYC. There's a reason our billable rates, RPL, PPP, etc., are all within the same range (except for Wachtell, which apparently prints money in the basement, and Quinn, which is so cheap some of our partners refuse to take depositions at their offices). The person who said, above, that hours can be worse in part because of the rotation system is on point. I bill more than most my friends at other firms, but I also know first-years here who bill much less than associates at other firms. So the range is just bigger, because no one cares about your hours. It all just depends on what team you're on. I know someone who billed less than 800 hrs in the first six months of 2014, but I also know someone (who will make partner in a year or so) who billed over 2000. But something people forget: more hours = more responsibility. If everyone on your team is kinda lounging no one is going to let a first-year take a deposition; that only happens when everyone is slammed.
As for partners being assholes, my (decidedly one-sided) impression is that most people I work with are actually more pleasant that the people I hear about from other firms. But there are also ones with bad reputations, as there are at every large workplace in the country.
As for exit options, I have no idea how it compares, but my instinct tells me that compared to our peers--Wachtell, S&C, DPW, etc.--the exit options are similar.
As for everyone saying our lit dept is shit compared to all these other firms, you're talking out of your ass. Unlike most big corporate-dependent firm, the vast majority of our lit work is generated by the lit department, not as spill-off from corporate. Moreover, we are not heavily dependent on white collar work and other enforcement stuff, which, while desirable to some, is not something I have an interest in. I want to try cases, and unlike every single one of my friends (who work at DPW, Cleary, S&C, Skadden, PW, etc.) I'm getting to do just that. Evan Chesler, like Boies at BSF, generates a LOT of trial work that flows down to more junior partners and their teams. We do about 3-4 large civil trials a year, and I think only a few places--BSF and Quinn come to mind, maybe Kirkland?--do that when correcting for size.
Look, there's no doubt we work a lot here. So do my friends at the firms down the street. If you don't want to work a lot, don't work at a big firm in NYC (or maybe anywhere). If you're OK with working hard, pick a firm that does a lot of the type of work you do and that has people there you think you might like to work with (as opposed to be friends with).
