Fall 2015 OCI Results Forum

[AT9]

School Range: Lower T1
Class rank: 5%
Market(s): South, Mid-Atlantic, Midwest
Law review: Yes
Moot Court: No
Work experience: 3 years in small firm
IP background: No
Anything else that might have an impact? Very loose ties to the markets where I had callbacks, and most were outside the market of my school, so combined I think that led to poorer results.
Screening Interviews: 40-ish
Callbacks received: 14
Callbacks accepted: 11
Offers: 1 (well-respected mid-sized firm)
Accepted: 1
Thank-you notes sent: Almost all interviews.
How many firms just didn't get back with you with a rejection/callback?: Of callbacks, 5/10 sent rejections before I withdrew.

Things I've learned from OCI and callbacks (pay attention, 0Ls!):
1. Re-take until you can't anymore and go to a T14 if financially reasonable. Don't settle for a T1 with $$$ unless you have really specific goals where it makes more sense. Friends from T14 schools with decent grades and interviewing skills equal or less than mine did way better on their CB->offer ratio. I.e., firms are prestige-whores...take that to heart now and get the prestige (again, if financially reasonable).
2. If you don't do a T14, go to a school (for free or close to it) in a specific state or city where you have strong ties. I'm in the same geographic region where I have strong ties (the southeast), but that's generally not going to cut it. If you go to school in Wisconsin, firms want people with ties to Wisconsin...not Ohio.
3. Do as much research as you can prior to callbacks. I did only a little more research for callbacks than I did screeners (mainly due to being busy, etc.), and I think that hurt me.
4. At least from T1s, this whole process is a black box. Choose your school wisely and have backup plans to OCI; top grades from a T1 with decent interviewing skills and prior WE aren't enough to guarantee an offer.

[Anonymous User]

Transfer here: just wanted to drop a quick note for those in the future considering transferring.

As a transfer from UC Davis/UCI to T6-T10, I had opportunities at the new school that I would not have had at my old school. I agree with previous poster that I could have definitely gotten BigLaw at previous school with my grades (top 5% + LR). If you are debt-averse, don't give a shit about Vault rankings, and don't mind working in a less competitive market (Sacramento, Silicon Valley, Orange County, for instance) staying might be the right call. However, almost all of the firms I got CBs from at new school did not do OCI at to my old school, and transferring opened the door to a lot of firms I did not have access to previously. Even if the firm did come to my old school, the firm was interviewing for numerous office locations instead of the satellite office that was geographically close to the school. If you care about the more selective firms and the more competitive office locations, definitely consider transferring. I accepted at V10 in my ideal location.

[Anonymous User]

Congrats to you, above poster! Definitely agree with the points you made. I wonder if I know you...

I'm at UCD/UCI and got off the wait list at a T-10 during the transfer cycle. Did not go.

OCI: Had 30+ interviews. Struck out.

Only time will tell if I regret this or not. Dream job was always Big 4, which recruits 3L year. But I wanted big law for at least the job security (and that $$$) heading into 3L year. I just couldn't give up my more than full ride at my current school to take on that much debt. However, without LR at my current school, I was pretty much sunk. In retrospect, if you want big law from one of these schools and you aren't top 10% WITH LR, it's probably best to transfer. OCI was a blood bath for people that didn't have both of those. Also, definitely agree with the above poster about more opportunities from transferring. A lot of the OCI firms were very local, and if you didn't have ties, you were fighting an uphill battle. I got asked about ties in almost every interview and CBs. Just something to think about.

[Anonymous User]

Jumping in RE: the interviewing skills. I think to be successful you need 1) to have your elevator pitch and 2) just have a normal freaking conversation with the person.

Think about it from their point of view: they're sitting in a room all day interviewing 20-30 people. I know if I was in that position, the question-answer, question-answer method would get old really, really quickly. Just talk to them, ask them about their work, act interested in what they do and don't be afraid of naturally adding in some humor. Compared to interviews I had before law school in other industries, the law school screener and cb interview is a joke format. They have no idea if you will be a good lawyer, and the interview will not tell them that. I know people that stressed and got interview coaches and practiced all summer and they are really, really struggling with excellent grades.

Of course, you will meet some people you just don't click with and w/e to those people. But for the ones you do click with, I'm saying to have a regular, normal conversation and don't come across as a crazed striver.

Edit: this assume you are not in the bottom 10% of the class or something and go to a respectable school that can get you a good number of screeners

[bobloblaw0227]

Congrats to you, above poster! Definitely agree with the points you made. I wonder if I know you...

I'm at UCD/UCI and got off the wait list at a T-10 during the transfer cycle. Did not go.

OCI: Had 30+ interviews. Struck out.

Only time will tell if I regret this or not. Dream job was always Big 4, which recruits 3L year. But I wanted big law for at least the job security (and that $$$) heading into 3L year. I just couldn't give up my more than full ride at my current school to take on that much debt. However, without LR at my current school, I was pretty much sunk. In retrospect, if you want big law from one of these schools and you aren't top 10% WITH LR, it's probably best to transfer. OCI was a blood bath for people that didn't have both of those. Also, definitely agree with the above poster about more opportunities from transferring. A lot of the OCI firms were very local, and if you didn't have ties, you were fighting an uphill battle. I got asked about ties in almost every interview and CBs. Just something to think about.

Sorry to hear that! I will always wonder what would have happened if I had stayed, so I appreciate hearing about people's experiences, good or bad. I'm sure it will work out. If it makes you feel any better, not only do the lower ranked schools have a tougher time because of prestige, but the fact that your OCI is almost 3 weeks after other schools makes it really challenging. I had offers before you even had a chance to do screeners just because my school's OCI is earlier. It definitely tilts the already very tilted playing field.

[WokeUpInACar]

Congrats to you, above poster! Definitely agree with the points you made. I wonder if I know you...

I'm at UCD/UCI and got off the wait list at a T-10 during the transfer cycle. Did not go.

OCI: Had 30+ interviews. Struck out.

Only time will tell if I regret this or not. Dream job was always Big 4, which recruits 3L year. But I wanted big law for at least the job security (and that $$$) heading into 3L year. I just couldn't give up my more than full ride at my current school to take on that much debt. However, without LR at my current school, I was pretty much sunk. In retrospect, if you want big law from one of these schools and you aren't top 10% WITH LR, it's probably best to transfer. OCI was a blood bath for people that didn't have both of those. Also, definitely agree with the above poster about more opportunities from transferring. A lot of the OCI firms were very local, and if you didn't have ties, you were fighting an uphill battle. I got asked about ties in almost every interview and CBs. Just something to think about.

FYI Big 4 is recruiting 2Ls basically starting right now for next summer (and they have a 90%+ offer rate for summers). For example, I know they are coming to the 2nd session of my school's OCI in a couple weeks. I'd definitely apply to those places ASAP.

[lavarman84]

Congrats to you, above poster! Definitely agree with the points you made. I wonder if I know you...

I'm at UCD/UCI and got off the wait list at a T-10 during the transfer cycle. Did not go.

OCI: Had 30+ interviews. Struck out.

Only time will tell if I regret this or not. Dream job was always Big 4, which recruits 3L year. But I wanted big law for at least the job security (and that $$$) heading into 3L year. I just couldn't give up my more than full ride at my current school to take on that much debt. However, without LR at my current school, I was pretty much sunk. In retrospect, if you want big law from one of these schools and you aren't top 10% WITH LR, it's probably best to transfer. OCI was a blood bath for people that didn't have both of those. Also, definitely agree with the above poster about more opportunities from transferring. A lot of the OCI firms were very local, and if you didn't have ties, you were fighting an uphill battle. I got asked about ties in almost every interview and CBs. Just something to think about.

FYI Big 4 is recruiting 2Ls basically starting right now for next summer (and they have a 90%+ offer rate for summers). For example, I know they are coming to the 2nd session of my school's OCI in a couple weeks. I'd definitely apply to those places ASAP.

Yes. This. I know PricewaterhouseCoopers is currently recruiting at our law school. So I agree with WokeUpInACar, I'd start reaching out to the Big 4 firms and see if they have openings for the summer.

[Anonymous User]

I'm that UCD/UCI anon. Yeah, I actually have an interview with one of them for a tax internship next month! Fingers crossed! From what I hear, those are actually harder to land than a job offer 3L year (due to the fact that they're 90% offer before you graduate and there are fewer of them).

[Anonymous User]

School Range: Lower Tier 2
Class rank: Top 5%
Market(s): SoCal
Law review: Yes
Moot Court: Yes
Work experience: 1 year in mid-size firm
IP background: No
Anything else that might have an impact? prestigious undergrad + good interviewer + strong regional ties
Screening Interviews: 19
Callbacks received: 4
Callbacks accepted: 4
Offers: 2 (Offers from V25 and well-respected regional firm. Rejection from V10. Turned down the 4th before they made a decision.)
Accepted: 1 (V25)
Thank-you notes sent: everyone I interviewed with.

Considered transferring but decided against it because I didn't want to give up my full-ride. For those of you 0Ls thinking it's possible to get into BigLaw from a TT school... yes, BUT keep in mind there's only about 10/250-ish from my school who got offers from V100 firms... not very good odds.

[Anonymous User]

School Range: mid-level T14
Class rank: Top 5%
Market(s): DC, home market
Law review: Yes
Moot Court: No
Work experience: Couple years shitlaw paralegal
IP background: No
Anything else that might have an impact? not great at interviews, no networking
Screening Interviews: 21 (14 DC)
Callbacks received: 11 (5 DC)
Callbacks accepted: 9 (all 5 DC)
Offers: 4 (2 in DC, 2 in other market)
Thank-you notes sent: never

DC felt pretty brutal.

[Anonymous User]

School Range: Penn/UVA/NYU
Class rank: Median
Market(s): Southern California mainly; NYC backup
Law review: No
Moot Court: No
Work experience: KJD; 6 months work experience (semester abroad) with State Dept./DoD; published articles in law review journals during college
IP background: No
Anything else that might have an impact? heavily networked in LA, nothing in NYC; had CA Mag. Judge clerkship offer prior to OCI screeners
Screening Interviews: 32 - 25 (LA); 7 (NYC)
Callbacks received: 14 - 12 (LA); 2 (NYC)
Callbacks accepted: 8
Offers: 6 - 5 (LA; 2 V10, 3 V10-30); 1 (NYC V20)

Thank-you notes sent: only for screener conducted before OCI and for top choice firms in LA post CB

[Anonymous User]

This won't be popular here, but I actually think the current results posted in this thread, especially at the t14 that I am at, might actually quite indicative of the success of this recruiting period.

Specifically, amongst the group of individuals that made up my section last year (29 people), I know that definitely 23 have offers (and most had several as in 4+), the remaining 6 either self-selected for public service or I haven't made contact with.

Certainly makes transferring to a t14 much more attractive.

[Anonymous User]

This won't be popular here, but I actually think the current results posted in this thread, especially at the t14 that I am at, might actually quite indicative of the success of this recruiting period.

Specifically, amongst the group of individuals that made up my section last year (29 people), I know that definitely 23 have offers (and most had several as in 4+), the remaining 6 either self-selected for public service or I haven't made contact with.

23 out of 26. Certainly makes transferring to a t14 much more attractive.

depends on which t14 and what your grades were at old school
if top grades (1-10%) then most likely successful at pretty much any t14 you transfer to
but if not top grades then there are real risks of striking out even if you do transfer to t14

[A. Nony Mouse]

This won't be popular here, but I actually think the current results posted in this thread, especially at the t14 that I am at, might actually quite indicative of the success of this recruiting period.

Specifically, amongst the group of individuals that made up my section last year (29 people), I know that definitely 23 have offers (and most had several as in 4+), the remaining 6 either self-selected for public service or I haven't made contact with.

Certainly makes transferring to a t14 much more attractive.

If you're talking about people in your section last year, none of them are transfers, right? (I'm not saying it isn't worth transferring to a T14 - probably depending on which one - I'm just not sure how your last sentence follows from the previous ones.)

[Anonymous User]

^That is right. But, I guess my point is, overall, the gain in the chances of you getting a job should still be in effect even for a transfer here which should make such a transfer potentially worthwhile.

[star fox]

This won't be popular here, but I actually think the current results posted in this thread, especially at the t14 that I am at, might actually quite indicative of the success of this recruiting period.

Specifically, amongst the group of individuals that made up my section last year (29 people), I know that definitely 23 have offers (and most had several as in 4+), the remaining 6 either self-selected for public service or I haven't made contact with.

Certainly makes transferring to a t14 much more attractive.

Maybe some are lying to obnoxious people like you who need to pry into that stuff.

[Anonymous User]

Not sure why my comments required that you resort to personal attacks. And sure, anyone could be lying. But generally, that type of info comes out naturally in conversation so who knows.

[star fox]

Not sure why my comments required that you resort to personal attacks. And sure, anyone could be lying. But generally, that type of info comes out naturally in conversation so who knows.

Because attitudes like yours are toxic. Unless your T14 is Yale or Stanford (I dunno, probably at least) then it's almost certainly not true that "everyone" in your section has a summer associate position lined up as long as they wanted one.

[Anonymous User]

Perhaps. However, there is really no other way to get a feel for the legal market in your school until LST comes out for your class. I guess some people feel the need to lie, but judging by people traveling back and forth for callbacks, I am inclined to believe that people are doing very well here. Certainly it's an anecdote but that's all we have right now. No need to start calling names.

[star fox]

Perhaps. However, there is really no other way to get a feel for the legal market in your school until LST comes out for your class. I guess some people feel the need to lie, but judging by people traveling back and forth for callbacks, I am inclined to believe that people are doing very well here. Certainly it's an anecdote but that's all we have right now. No need to start calling names.

Just don't "try and get a feel for the legal market" based on some anecdata. I have no doubt things are better now than 5 years ago. Economy is improved. Class sizes are a lot smaller. But that's not a case of 100% offers.

[jbagelboy]

Not sure why my comments required that you resort to personal attacks. And sure, anyone could be lying. But generally, that type of info comes out naturally in conversation so who knows.

Because attitudes like yours are toxic. Unless your T14 is Yale or Stanford (I dunno, probably at least) then it's almost certainly not true that "everyone" in your section has a summer associate position lined up as long as they wanted one.

It's probably everyone in the section that talks about this kind of thing, which makes it seem like it's really everyone.

[TheoO]

Not sure why my comments required that you resort to personal attacks. And sure, anyone could be lying. But generally, that type of info comes out naturally in conversation so who knows.

Because attitudes like yours are toxic. Unless your T14 is Yale or Stanford (I dunno, probably at least) then it's almost certainly not true that "everyone" in your section has a summer associate position lined up as long as they wanted one.

It's probably everyone in the section that talks about this kind of thing, which makes it seem like it's really everyone.

This. I know plenty of people who don't have firms. They are not screaming it at the top of their lungs, however.

[Anonymous User]

School Range: Berkeley, UVA, Michigan
Class rank: Bottom 1/3rd
Market(s): NYC, home market
Law review: No
Moot Court: No
Work experience: 2 years
IP background: No
Anything else that might have an impact? Interesting work experience
Screening Interviews: 17
Callbacks received: 4
Callbacks accepted: 3
Offers: 2
Accepted: V-50
Thank-you notes sent: None
How many firms just didn't get back with you with a rejection/callback? None

If you're below median, bid NYC. The vast majority of people I know do have at least one offer, and this includes a wide range of grades.

[Anonymous User]

To give a bit of perspective here that statistically constitutes about half the class at my T14...

School Range: Northwestern
Class rank: Slightly below median
Market(s): NYC almost exclusively w/ smaller markets where I could afford the bid
Law review: No
Moot Court: No
Work experience: 2+ years
IP background: No
Anything else that might have an impact? Family in NYC
Screening Interviews: 17
Callbacks received: 1
Callbacks accepted: 1
Offers: 0
Accepted: N/A
Thank-you notes sent: None
How many firms just didn't get back with you with a rejection/callback? Some

[BigZuck]

Maybe it's just the benefit of going to a school where not a ton of people get big law but I'm so glad I don't have to listen to people in my section talk about their bountiful offers in their "natural" conversation.

Out the school please anon, that sounds awful and we need to steer people away from that school.