NYC to 200k Forum

[minnbills]

Does anyone have an actually legitimate theory re: why the other major players haven't made a peep? Why wait for cravath when Simpson already did it?

They don't want to match Milbank today and be forced to match cravath next week.

[Anonymous User]

Does anyone have an actually legitimate theory re: why the other major players haven't made a peep? Why wait for cravath when Simpson already did it?

I suspect there may be little appetite for setting precedent of giving COLAs.

The only reason would be to see if CSM or maybe another firm or two raises base higher. Literally 0% chance any ~V20 firm (let alone V5) goes into the weeks leading up to OCI without minimally matching Milbank/STB on base.

[minnbills]

what matters is that firms perceive 200 as being unlikely.

If that were the case everyone would be matching at 190 and calling it a day. The lack of movement implies that we haven't reached a ceiling yet.

[Anonymous User]

[Anonymous User]

what matters is that firms perceive 200 as being unlikely.

If that were the case everyone would be matching at 190 and calling it a day. The lack of movement implies that we haven't reached a ceiling yet.

Until the key players (Cravath) match, there's a distinct possibility of 200. Firms won't want to move until its relatively clear 200 isn't happening.

[Anonymous User]

Does anyone have an actually legitimate theory re: why the other major players haven't made a peep? Why wait for cravath when Simpson already did it?

They don't want to match Milbank today and be forced to match cravath next week.

Why? It's the same thing?

[Anonymous User]

Does anyone have an actually legitimate theory re: why the other major players haven't made a peep? Why wait for cravath when Simpson already did it?

They don't want to match Milbank today and be forced to match cravath next week.

Why? It's the same thing?

They would like to avoid looking cheap and indecisive. And a second raise implies they don't believe the associates initially deserved/should get that incremental amount, but they're forced to provide it because other firms think they do...

STB gets to save face if they have to raise again because they went over the top with the summer bonuses.

[Anonymous User]

If firms really expect one of them to go to 200k, why not be the first to do it? You're going there anyway, you get the credit with associates and applicants, and you might be able to bifurcate the salary market. For firms with $3 or $4 million in PPP, why wait?

[JoeySkoko]

If firms really expect one of them to go to 200k, why not be the first to do it? You're going there anyway, you get the credit with associates and applicants, and you might be able to bifurcate the salary market. For firms with $3 or $4 million in PPP, why wait?

they're cheap and would prefer not to unless they really have to

[alphagamma]

If firms really expect one of them to go to 200k, why not be the first to do it? You're going there anyway, you get the credit with associates and applicants, and you might be able to bifurcate the salary market. For firms with $3 or $4 million in PPP, why wait?

I was just going to post this same thought.

I've also never understood why it would be such a "disaster" to match Milbank today and then have to match a subsequent raise later. Would that cause more of a reputational hit than the absolute silence we're witnessing?

[Single-Malt-Liquor]

Does anyone have an actually legitimate theory re: why the other major players haven't made a peep? Why wait for cravath when Simpson already did it?

They don't want to match Milbank today and be forced to match cravath next week.

Why? It's the same thing?

Not really, everyone is a follower but doesn't want to look like a follower. Matching twice would feel more like playing catch up where as matching once feels like the market moving at once.

Now, I'd love to see what happens if Cravath says "Fuck it, $215K!"

My guess is that firms that would have only gone to $200 would consider not moving at all.

[Single-Malt-Liquor]

If firms really expect one of them to go to 200k, why not be the first to do it? You're going there anyway, you get the credit with associates and applicants, and you might be able to bifurcate the salary market. For firms with $3 or $4 million in PPP, why wait?

they're cheap and would prefer not to unless they really have to

For fear that Cravath unzips their pants and say "WE'RE THE GOD DAMNED MARKET LEADER - $2XXk"

All the other firms are sitting on third nuts and hoping to smooth call and see a showdown.

[Anonymous User]

Does anyone have an actually legitimate theory re: why the other major players haven't made a peep? Why wait for cravath when Simpson already did it?

They don't want to match Milbank today and be forced to match cravath next week.

Why? It's the same thing?

Not really, everyone is a follower but doesn't want to look like a follower. Matching twice would feel more like playing catch up where as matching once feels like the market moving at once.

Now, I'd love to see what happens if Cravath says "Fuck it, $215K!"

My guess is that firms that would have only gone to $200 would consider not moving at all.

Yeah Cravath to something like 215 would be disastrous, though I imagine firms would still move to 190 to match Millbank at least

[minnbills]

It certainly wouldn't destroy the firm's brand or anything like that - but I wouldn't discount the extent to which perception matters for recruitment purposes.

I mean, the fact that this thread has 120k+ views kinda speaks to how much people in this industry care about this issue, and at the end of the day virtually all biglaw associates are where they are for the sole reason that they gots to get paid. Why else do this job?

[Anonymous User]

Any other firms coming out with summer bonuses? Cahill?

[Anonymous User]

If firms really expect one of them to go to 200k, why not be the first to do it? You're going there anyway, you get the credit with associates and applicants, and you might be able to bifurcate the salary market. For firms with $3 or $4 million in PPP, why wait?

I was just going to post this same thought.

I've also never understood why it would be such a "disaster" to match Milbank today and then have to match a subsequent raise later. Would that cause more of a reputational hit than the absolute silence we're witnessing?

They don't expect it, but they understand there is a possibility of $200k. If you know anything about big law, you would understand Partners At Law firms HATE to appear like they can't read the landscape and appear reactionary. Which is what it looks like if you raise to match more than once. This is not a difficult concept to understand. Most firms don't want to raise to $200k, but CSM partners meet Monday typically and they are one of a few firms that could push us to $200k.

[Anonymous User]

Any other firms coming out with summer bonuses? Cahill?

Stop reading ATL/Go away Staci.

[Anonymous User]

Look at this timely bit of research

http://news.cornell.edu/stories/2018/06 ... motivation

SUMMER BONUS confirmed

[Anonymous User]

If firms really expect one of them to go to 200k, why not be the first to do it? You're going there anyway, you get the credit with associates and applicants, and you might be able to bifurcate the salary market. For firms with $3 or $4 million in PPP, why wait?

I was just going to post this same thought.

I've also never understood why it would be such a "disaster" to match Milbank today and then have to match a subsequent raise later. Would that cause more of a reputational hit than the absolute silence we're witnessing?

They don't expect it, but they understand there is a possibility of $200k. If you know anything about big law, you would understand partners at law firms HATE to appear like they can't read the landscape and appear reactionary. Which is what it looks like if you raise to match more than once. This is not a difficult concept to understand. Most firms don't want to raise to $200k, but CSM partners meet Monday typically and they are one of a few firms that could push us to $200k.

Nothing says reactionary and can't read the market more than waiting a week (or longer) to match Milbank, Irell, and Proskauer. Firms matched within a day or two last time. If going to 200k is a drop in the bucket for your $4 million PPP partnership (it is), and you think the market is going there anyway, why wait?

[Anonymous User]

If firms really expect one of them to go to 200k, why not be the first to do it? You're going there anyway, you get the credit with associates and applicants, and you might be able to bifurcate the salary market. For firms with $3 or $4 million in PPP, why wait?

I was just going to post this same thought.

I've also never understood why it would be such a "disaster" to match Milbank today and then have to match a subsequent raise later. Would that cause more of a reputational hit than the absolute silence we're witnessing?

They don't expect it, but they understand there is a possibility of $200k. If you know anything about big law, you would understand partners at law firms HATE to appear like they can't read the landscape and appear reactionary. Which is what it looks like if you raise to match more than once. This is not a difficult concept to understand. Most firms don't want to raise to $200k, but CSM partners meet Monday typically and they are one of a few firms that could push us to $200k.

Nothing says reactionary and can't read the market more than waiting a week (or longer) to match Milbank, Irell, and Proskauer. Firms matched within a day or two last time. If going to 200k is a drop in the bucket for your $4 million PPP partnership (it is), and you think the market is going there anyway, why wait?

I think the whole "have to wait until Cravath partners meet on Monday" nonsense is not credible. Cravath's partners can meet whenever they want.

[Anonymous User]

Cravath,

what matters is that firms perceive 200 as being unlikely.

If that were the case everyone would be matching at 190 and calling it a day. The lack of movement implies that we haven't reached a ceiling yet.

Until the key players (Cravath) match, there's a distinct possibility of 200. Firms won't want to move until its relatively clear 200 isn't happening.

[Anonymous User]

If firms really expect one of them to go to 200k, why not be the first to do it? You're going there anyway, you get the credit with associates and applicants, and you might be able to bifurcate the salary market. For firms with $3 or $4 million in PPP, why wait?

I was just going to post this same thought.

I've also never understood why it would be such a "disaster" to match Milbank today and then have to match a subsequent raise later. Would that cause more of a reputational hit than the absolute silence we're witnessing?

They don't expect it, but they understand there is a possibility of $200k. If you know anything about big law, you would understand partners at law firms HATE to appear like they can't read the landscape and appear reactionary. Which is what it looks like if you raise to match more than once. This is not a difficult concept to understand. Most firms don't want to raise to $200k, but CSM partners meet Monday typically and they are one of a few firms that could push us to $200k.

Nothing says reactionary and can't read the market more than waiting a week (or longer) to match Milbank, Irell, and Proskauer. Firms matched within a day or two last time. If going to 200k is a drop in the bucket for your $4 million PPP partnership (it is), and you think the market is going there anyway, why wait?

I think the whole "have to wait until Cravath partners meet on Monday" nonsense is not credible. Cravath's partners can meet whenever they want.

This

[Single-Malt-Liquor]

If firms really expect one of them to go to 200k, why not be the first to do it? You're going there anyway, you get the credit with associates and applicants, and you might be able to bifurcate the salary market. For firms with $3 or $4 million in PPP, why wait?

I was just going to post this same thought.

I've also never understood why it would be such a "disaster" to match Milbank today and then have to match a subsequent raise later. Would that cause more of a reputational hit than the absolute silence we're witnessing?

They don't expect it, but they understand there is a possibility of $200k. If you know anything about big law, you would understand partners at law firms HATE to appear like they can't read the landscape and appear reactionary. Which is what it looks like if you raise to match more than once. This is not a difficult concept to understand. Most firms don't want to raise to $200k, but CSM partners meet Monday typically and they are one of a few firms that could push us to $200k.

Nothing says reactionary and can't read the market more than waiting a week (or longer) to match Milbank, Irell, and Proskauer. Firms matched within a day or two last time. If going to 200k is a drop in the bucket for your $4 million PPP partnership (it is), and you think the market is going there anyway, why wait?

Because what not give a raise and build that fourth bathroom in the Hamptons beach house (affectionately named Billable Manor) with the extra $10K saved at $190k?

[Anonymous User]

I fear CSM will only go to $190k as stingy as they are. How likely is $200k?

If firms really expect one of them to go to 200k, why not be the first to do it? You're going there anyway, you get the credit with associates and applicants, and you might be able to bifurcate the salary market. For firms with $3 or $4 million in PPP, why wait?

I was just going to post this same thought.

I've also never understood why it would be such a "disaster" to match Milbank today and then have to match a subsequent raise later. Would that cause more of a reputational hit than the absolute silence we're witnessing?

They don't expect it, but they understand there is a possibility of $200k. If you know anything about big law, you would understand partners at law firms HATE to appear like they can't read the landscape and appear reactionary. Which is what it looks like if you raise to match more than once. This is not a difficult concept to understand. Most firms don't want to raise to $200k, but CSM partners meet Monday typically and they are one of a few firms that could push us to $200k.

Nothing says reactionary and can't read the market more than waiting a week (or longer) to match Milbank, Irell, and Proskauer. Firms matched within a day or two last time. If going to 200k is a drop in the bucket for your $4 million PPP partnership (it is), and you think the market is going there anyway, why wait?

I think the whole "have to wait until Cravath partners meet on Monday" nonsense is not credible. Cravath's partners can meet whenever they want.

[Anonymous User]

If firms really expect one of them to go to 200k, why not be the first to do it? You're going there anyway, you get the credit with associates and applicants, and you might be able to bifurcate the salary market. For firms with $3 or $4 million in PPP, why wait?

I was just going to post this same thought.

I've also never understood why it would be such a "disaster" to match Milbank today and then have to match a subsequent raise later. Would that cause more of a reputational hit than the absolute silence we're witnessing?

They don't expect it, but they understand there is a possibility of $200k. If you know anything about big law, you would understand partners at law firms HATE to appear like they can't read the landscape and appear reactionary. Which is what it looks like if you raise to match more than once. This is not a difficult concept to understand. Most firms don't want to raise to $200k, but CSM partners meet Monday typically and they are one of a few firms that could push us to $200k.

Nothing says reactionary and can't read the market more than waiting a week (or longer) to match Milbank, Irell, and Proskauer. Firms matched within a day or two last time. If going to 200k is a drop in the bucket for your $4 million PPP partnership (it is), and you think the market is going there anyway, why wait?

Obviously there is a minimum level of reactionary behavior... or else we would believe 100 firms all raise salaries the same amount within a month of each other independently... That's a given. The only question is how many times do you want to do the foolish dance. If you're a firm that doesn't want to go over 190k (but will if forced), there is little to no benefit to match now if there is a possibility of a move higher. That's the calculus, unless you think you know better than hundreds of the most senior partners at the most elite firms... then maybe you should send them an email.