COVID-19’s effect on your practice check in Forum

[LaLiLuLeLo]

I think if you are that concerned about your job, deliberately catching the virus and taking a medical leave may guarantee you job security (fear of retaliation claim + ATL publicity). Not advocating this however.

Damn, I thought wishing for a car to hit me was bad. Wishing to get sick during a global pandemic is next level

[2013]

Firms will be able to lay you off even if you take emergency FMLA leave, so please don’t try to catch the disease.

[Anonymous User]

We have been given a directive to email the practice group leader every day with our billable hours.

[Anonymous User]

We were told our hours would be monitored. Daily.

[Anonymous User]

First year litigator in regional biglaw. Billed 200+ hours in both January and February, but my work completely dried up last week. I'm going to finish March with ~100 hours. FML.

[Neff]

First year litigator in regional biglaw. Billed 200+ hours in both January and February, but my work completely dried up last week. I'm going to finish March with ~100 hours. FML.

100 isn’t close to being bad. Unless you’re at some sweatshop, over the course of a career you will have many 100 hour months. Heck I have had several 50 hour months in my five years and I’m still around.

[wwwcol]

First year litigator in regional biglaw. Billed 200+ hours in both January and February, but my work completely dried up last week. I'm going to finish March with ~100 hours. FML.

100 isn’t close to being bad. Unless you’re at some sweatshop, over the course of a career you will have many 100 hour months. Heck I have had several 50 hour months in my five years and I’m still around.

I suspect it’s not the total hours but the trajectory. A 100 hour month is fine, but 80 hours before the 15th and 20 hours after is...concerning. A lot of people are experiencing that right now as work dries up

[cavalier1138]

First year litigator in regional biglaw. Billed 200+ hours in both January and February, but my work completely dried up last week. I'm going to finish March with ~100 hours. FML.

100 isn’t close to being bad. Unless you’re at some sweatshop, over the course of a career you will have many 100 hour months. Heck I have had several 50 hour months in my five years and I’m still around.

I suspect it’s not the total hours but the trajectory. A 100 hour month is fine, but 80 hours before the 15th and 20 hours after is...concerning. A lot of people are experiencing that right now as work dries up

I think a lot of this will depend on whether litigation is drying up because it's basically impossible for most cases to proceed at the moment or whether there's going to be a longer-term hit from the economic impact. I think we're likely to see a pretty quick bounce-back, especially in sectors that will inevitably have COVID-19 related litigation to handle.

[MillllerTime]

We were told our hours would be monitored. Daily.

Are you at a biglaw firm or some place smaller? This would be extremely concerning to me. Can't think of what they would be doing with that info other than shortening the layoff time period, right? If this were just about finding work to assign you, I would think a weekly hours report or whatever they typically do would be sufficient, especially if there aren't a bunch of hours to go around.

Sorry if this sounds alarmist, but it just seems ridiculous to me. Feels like we should be outing places if it is biglaw as I would 100% want to know that as a potential hire.

[Anonymous User]

We were told our hours would be monitored. Daily.

Are you at a biglaw firm or some place smaller? This would be extremely concerning to me. Can't think of what they would be doing with that info other than shortening the layoff time period, right? If this were just about finding work to assign you, I would think a weekly hours report or whatever they typically do would be sufficient, especially if there aren't a bunch of hours to go around.

Sorry if this sounds alarmist, but it just seems ridiculous to me. Feels like we should be outing places if it is biglaw as I would 100% want to know that as a potential hire.

I'm at a boutique that pays biglaw rates. We also routinely send lateral partners and associates to biglaw, including v20s. Not going to say more for fear of outing myself. I thought it was ridiculous too.

[Anonymous User]

I’m in biglaw and posted about giving our practice group leader our estimated billable hours.

It’s pretty fucking stupid and overbearing. If they want to allocate work just look at our timesheets once they’re finalized.

I was at a white shoe firm before this and if things go south, lateraling will have been a terrible move.

[LSATWiz.com]

I’m in house but New York just passed a bill that makes telemarketing illegal during a declared state of emergency, including business to business calls. Consequently, a significant part of our business model is illegal for the duration of the pandemic. I’ve been trying to get in touch with an attorney from the governor’s office to no avail. If anyone has a connection there, feel free to PM.

[Anonymous User]

We were told our hours would be monitored. Daily.

Are you at a biglaw firm or some place smaller? This would be extremely concerning to me. Can't think of what they would be doing with that info other than shortening the layoff time period, right? If this were just about finding work to assign you, I would think a weekly hours report or whatever they typically do would be sufficient, especially if there aren't a bunch of hours to go around.

Sorry if this sounds alarmist, but it just seems ridiculous to me. Feels like we should be outing places if it is biglaw as I would 100% want to know that as a potential hire.

My $3m+ PPP biglaw firm also just asked us to enter our time on a daily basis. While I agree it seems a bit overbearing, my firm's rationale is twofold; (1) our restructuring and lev fin groups are getting slammed, so they need bodies. People with low billables will likely be farmed out to restructuring and lev fin until their practices pick up again, and (2) the firm management literally said "hey, our competitors are doing it, so we'll do it too." I've heard through the grapevine that several biglaw shops are now monitoring hours on a daily basis, and I expect more will follow.

On the flipside, however, our executive committee has told the entire firm on multiple occasions that no one should worry about job security, and the firm is well positioned to ride out a lack of litigation and corporate deal flow. Our restructuring and lev fin groups are going gangbusters, and we have strong niche groups that have not shown any slowdown (I'm in one of them and my hours are stronger than last year at this time). Also, my firm didn't lay off a single attorney in the 2008/2009 shitshow, so I actually believe them (at least for now).

[burritotaco]

We were told our hours would be monitored. Daily.

Are you at a biglaw firm or some place smaller? This would be extremely concerning to me. Can't think of what they would be doing with that info other than shortening the layoff time period, right? If this were just about finding work to assign you, I would think a weekly hours report or whatever they typically do would be sufficient, especially if there aren't a bunch of hours to go around.

Sorry if this sounds alarmist, but it just seems ridiculous to me. Feels like we should be outing places if it is biglaw as I would 100% want to know that as a potential hire.

My $3m+ PPP biglaw firm also just asked us to enter our time on a daily basis. While I agree it seems a bit overbearing, my firm's rationale is twofold; (1) our restructuring and lev fin groups are getting slammed, so they need bodies. People with low billables will likely be farmed out to restructuring and lev fin until their practices pick up again, and (2) the firm management literally said "hey, our competitors are doing it, so we'll do it too." I've heard through the grapevine that several biglaw shops are now monitoring hours on a daily basis, and I expect more will follow.

On the flipside, however, our executive committee has told the entire firm on multiple occasions that no one should worry about job security, and the firm is well positioned to ride out a lack of litigation and corporate deal flow. Our restructuring and lev fin groups are going gangbusters, and we have strong niche groups that have not shown any slowdown (I'm in one of them and my hours are stronger than last year at this time). Also, my firm didn't lay off a single attorney in the 2008/2009 shitshow, so I actually believe them (at least for now).

I'm not in private practice, but a friend of mine at a biglaw firm said her firm is now really strict about entering time every single day. If you don't do it, the managing partner emails you directly. This is a new policy that only started a few weeks ago when everyone started working remotely due to corona. It makes no sense to me, so I'm curious why lots of firms seem to be doing it.

[wwwcol]

Maybe they want to send bills out ASAP and don’t want to waste time goading people into entering their hours? That seems like the most likely explanation (if they wanted to know availability, presumably the usual method of emailing/calling people would work fine)

[Anonymous User]

We were told our hours would be monitored. Daily.

Are you at a biglaw firm or some place smaller? This would be extremely concerning to me. Can't think of what they would be doing with that info other than shortening the layoff time period, right? If this were just about finding work to assign you, I would think a weekly hours report or whatever they typically do would be sufficient, especially if there aren't a bunch of hours to go around.

Sorry if this sounds alarmist, but it just seems ridiculous to me. Feels like we should be outing places if it is biglaw as I would 100% want to know that as a potential hire.

My $3m+ PPP biglaw firm also just asked us to enter our time on a daily basis. While I agree it seems a bit overbearing, my firm's rationale is twofold; (1) our restructuring and lev fin groups are getting slammed, so they need bodies. People with low billables will likely be farmed out to restructuring and lev fin until their practices pick up again, and (2) the firm management literally said "hey, our competitors are doing it, so we'll do it too." I've heard through the grapevine that several biglaw shops are now monitoring hours on a daily basis, and I expect more will follow.

On the flipside, however, our executive committee has told the entire firm on multiple occasions that no one should worry about job security, and the firm is well positioned to ride out a lack of litigation and corporate deal flow. Our restructuring and lev fin groups are going gangbusters, and we have strong niche groups that have not shown any slowdown (I'm in one of them and my hours are stronger than last year at this time). Also, my firm didn't lay off a single attorney in the 2008/2009 shitshow, so I actually believe them (at least for now).

I'm not in private practice, but a friend of mine at a biglaw firm said her firm is now really strict about entering time every single day. If you don't do it, the managing partner emails you directly. This is a new policy that only started a few weeks ago when everyone started working remotely due to corona. It makes no sense to me, so I'm curious why lots of firms seem to be doing it.

Quoted anon from above.

I suspect other firms are doing it for the same reason my firm is. They need manpower for the practices that are overwhelmed (like restructuring, lev fin, etc.) and therefore need to know who has availability to assist in real time. If your hours are low, they'll probably ask you to assist on matters in the busier groups. While not ideal, it's mutually beneficial; busy group gets some relief, otherwise slow associate keeps their job.

[Anonymous User]

We were told our hours would be monitored. Daily.

Are you at a biglaw firm or some place smaller? This would be extremely concerning to me. Can't think of what they would be doing with that info other than shortening the layoff time period, right? If this were just about finding work to assign you, I would think a weekly hours report or whatever they typically do would be sufficient, especially if there aren't a bunch of hours to go around.

Sorry if this sounds alarmist, but it just seems ridiculous to me. Feels like we should be outing places if it is biglaw as I would 100% want to know that as a potential hire.

My $3m+ PPP biglaw firm also just asked us to enter our time on a daily basis. While I agree it seems a bit overbearing, my firm's rationale is twofold; (1) our restructuring and lev fin groups are getting slammed, so they need bodies. People with low billables will likely be farmed out to restructuring and lev fin until their practices pick up again, and (2) the firm management literally said "hey, our competitors are doing it, so we'll do it too." I've heard through the grapevine that several biglaw shops are now monitoring hours on a daily basis, and I expect more will follow.

On the flipside, however, our executive committee has told the entire firm on multiple occasions that no one should worry about job security, and the firm is well positioned to ride out a lack of litigation and corporate deal flow. Our restructuring and lev fin groups are going gangbusters, and we have strong niche groups that have not shown any slowdown (I'm in one of them and my hours are stronger than last year at this time). Also, my firm didn't lay off a single attorney in the 2008/2009 shitshow, so I actually believe them (at least for now).

I'm not in private practice, but a friend of mine at a biglaw firm said her firm is now really strict about entering time every single day. If you don't do it, the managing partner emails you directly. This is a new policy that only started a few weeks ago when everyone started working remotely due to corona. It makes no sense to me, so I'm curious why lots of firms seem to be doing it.

Quoted anon from above.

I suspect other firms are doing it for the same reason my firm is. They need manpower for the practices that are overwhelmed (like restructuring, lev fin, etc.) and therefore need to know who has availability to assist in real time. If your hours are low, they'll probably ask you to assist on matters in the busier groups. While not ideal, it's mutually beneficial; busy group gets some relief, otherwise slow associate keeps their job.

Different anon/pretty sure I work at the same shop as you. In one of the ~slammed groups and can confirm that we are pulling people from the slower groups (at least at the junior level). Is it true no one was canned in '08? Have not heard this, but am a lateral and may lack some insight.

[Anonymous User]

My biglaw firm has also recently started pushing the "enter time every day" train hard. Part of it is wanting to get bills out as quickly as possible once the month ends, and another is that delays in entering time lead to lost time (and firms think revenue will be scarcer in the future, so less willing to tolerate time loss). Part of it is letting them know who can be shifted to groups with business. But I think it's foolish to think that part of it isn't related to firms wanting to intimately track associate hours and speed up the potential layoff process. Historically, recessions have been pretty cruel to biglaw associates. This time may be different, or it may not.

As an aside, I would put zero stock into what firms say re: not having conducted layoffs in the past. Outside of maybe Wachtell, it's almost assuredly not true using the common understanding of the term "layoffs." Though I'm sure some firms would tell you that they just had simultaneous degradation in performance from 25-30% of their associate ranks coinciding with slow economic times that necessitated mass firings for performance reasons (but to them, that is not a layoff).

[Anonymous User]

My biglaw firm has also recently started pushing the "enter time every day" train hard. Part of it is wanting to get bills out as quickly as possible once the month ends, and another is that delays in entering time lead to lost time (and firms think revenue will be scarcer in the future, so less willing to tolerate time loss). Part of it is letting them know who can be shifted to groups with business. But I think it's foolish to think that part of it isn't related to firms wanting to intimately track associate hours and speed up the potential layoff process. Historically, recessions have been pretty cruel to biglaw associates. This time may be different, or it may not.

As an aside, I would put zero stock into what firms say re: not having conducted layoffs in the past. Outside of maybe Wachtell, it's almost assuredly not true using the common understanding of the term "layoffs." Though I'm sure some firms would tell you that they just had simultaneous degradation in performance from 25-30% of their associate ranks coinciding with slow economic times that necessitated mass firings for performance reasons (but to them, that is not a layoff).

"But I think it's foolish to think that part of it isn't related to firms wanting to intimately track associate hours and speed up the potential layoff process."

^This.

I'm the boutique attorney who posted. Bankruptcy and restructuring are not groups in my boutique. Our hours are being monitored daily. The only plausible reasons are (1) wanting to shift work to slow associates, and (2) speed up a potential layoff process.

[Anonymous User]

Are the associates being shifted to restructuring/bankruptcy groups coming from all practice groups? I'm a litigation junior who is slow right now and I really do not want to do bankruptcy work...

[Anonymous User]

Are the associates being shifted to restructuring/bankruptcy groups coming from all practice groups? I'm a litigation junior who is slow right now and I really do not want to do bankruptcy work...

Yes. And litigators are the first to shift over since their skill set matches bankruptcy better than an M&A associate.

[Anonymous User]

MBS banking guy here.

I think part of tracking hours every day is partners themselves are very uneasy about the whole situation so they just feel the need for some control.

My group doesn't really track hours and we currently have basically zero work but we've been forced to get in this group Skype call every day basically reporting in on what we've done for the day. It's turned into a 10-30 minute chat about what we heard about Covid-19 with a throwaway "we're reaching out for work but nothing yet."

[Anonymous User]

Does anyone know if there are firms retooling and hiring for bankruptcy now? Mid level here and my work is starting to dry up. My firm doesn’t do much bankruptcy but wondering if another firm will take me.

I’m assuming the answer is no since they can just retool their own associates, but wondering if this is a possible option if I’m laid off.

[MillllerTime]

I just don't buy the staffing reasons for needing daily hours. If the firm has excess work to be done, call some associates in the slow groups (which partners obviously know without seeing daily hours reports) and ask them if they are still buys and if not, ask to help in the busy areas. The daily hours report just seems to create panic and implies that associates with low hours are at fault.

I guess there is probably the belief among partners that this will inspire associates to be more aggressive in their search for more hours, but this is pointless as it is a demand issue.

[AnonCanary123]

My firm is planning to pull in other practices for the anticipated uptick in bankruptcy work. Is there any quick/accessible primer or book that can help someone with no experience shore up on bankruptcy?