The Definitive Thread on OH Law Firms Forum

[Anonymous User]

Does anyone have any insight into Vorys corporate WLB/exit options? Similar hours to biglaw or a noticeable step down?

When I was looking at SA positions, the Cincinnati office’s corporate group had a reputation as a sweatshop. Why anyone would work NY or even Chicago hours for $150k, I don’t know.

[Anonymous User]

Does anyone have any insight into Vorys corporate WLB/exit options? Similar hours to biglaw or a noticeable step down?

When I was looking at SA positions, the Cincinnati office’s corporate group had a reputation as a sweatshop. Why anyone would work NY or even Chicago hours for $150k, I don’t know.

This has not been my experience, especially compared to BL hours. All my BL corporate friends work significantly worse hours, albeit for market pay. In Cincy, starting at $150k means never worrying about paying your bills.

[Anonymous User]

Does anyone have any insight into Vorys corporate WLB/exit options? Similar hours to biglaw or a noticeable step down?

When I was looking at SA positions, the Cincinnati office’s corporate group had a reputation as a sweatshop. Why anyone would work NY or even Chicago hours for $150k, I don’t know.

$150k in Cincinnati will almost certainly go further than $215k in New York. Googling for and clicking on the first cost-of-living calculator I could find suggests that someone making $215k and living in Manhattan would need to make a staggering $83k in Cincinnati to maintain a similar lifestyle... from Brooklyn, you'd need to make $115k; from Chicago to Cincinnati, it's $167k.

[UnfrozenCaveman]

Yea and what do senior associates make?

[Anonymous User]

Yea and what do senior associates make?

Obviously, the difference will be wider there. The poster asked about $150k, which is around (or less than) what first years are making based on what others are saying in this thread. I'm not at an Ohio firm so I can't say exactly what the compensation is, but I know raises are more compressed than in NY biglaw at the senior level. For the heck of it, let's say an 8th year senior associate in Cincinnati makes $215k—what a first year in NY makes. This is probably a low estimate (my guess is it would be nearer to $300k). I compared $530k, which is salary + bonus for an 8th year associate in Manhattan biglaw, and according to the same cost of living standard calculator, you'd need to make $205k to maintain that standard of living in Cincinnati. Since most biglaw associates may not make it far beyond 2-4 years, what seniors make in Cincinnati vs. NYC probably is an academic issue for most people.

Do you have an actual point/do you know what seniors make at these firms? Or are you just raising this to raise this? I think the point still stands that there are extreme differences in cost of living that may make a $150k (or $165k or whatever) starting salary in Cincinnati more attractive than $215k in NYC.

[Anonymous User]

Yea and what do senior associates make?

Obviously, the difference will be wider there. The poster asked about $150k, which is around (or less than) what first years are making based on what others are saying in this thread. I'm not at an Ohio firm so I can't say exactly what the compensation is, but I know raises are more compressed than in NY biglaw at the senior level. For the heck of it, let's say an 8th year senior associate in Cincinnati makes $215k—what a first year in NY makes. This is probably a low estimate (my guess is it would be nearer to $300k). I compared $530k, which is salary + bonus for an 8th year associate in Manhattan biglaw, and according to the same cost of living standard calculator, you'd need to make $205k to maintain that standard of living in Cincinnati. Since most biglaw associates may not make it far beyond 2-4 years, what seniors make in Cincinnati vs. NYC probably is an academic issue for most people.

Do you have an actual point/do you know what seniors make at these firms? Or are you just raising this to raise this? I think the point still stands that there are extreme differences in cost of living that may make a $150k (or $165k or whatever) starting salary in Cincinnati more attractive than $215k in NYC.

I’m not the OP on this comment, but I do know my friends between years 3-5 at Cincy firms make anywhere from $175-260k. Varies by firm and by individual because compensation for the most part is not lock step. If you do well, you make more. As someone who moved from cincy to a large city (not even NY), I can however tell you anectdotally that even though I make almost double of what I did in Cincy, I feel that my spending power is exactly the same if not slightly lower.

[Anonymous User]

Here's one data point for those curious -

5th year, Cincinnati
Salary $195,000
Bonus is essentially $100/billed hour over the required minimum

[UnfrozenCaveman]

Yea and what do senior associates make?

Obviously, the difference will be wider there. The poster asked about $150k, which is around (or less than) what first years are making based on what others are saying in this thread. I'm not at an Ohio firm so I can't say exactly what the compensation is, but I know raises are more compressed than in NY biglaw at the senior level. For the heck of it, let's say an 8th year senior associate in Cincinnati makes $215k—what a first year in NY makes. This is probably a low estimate (my guess is it would be nearer to $300k). I compared $530k, which is salary + bonus for an 8th year associate in Manhattan biglaw, and according to the same cost of living standard calculator, you'd need to make $205k to maintain that standard of living in Cincinnati. Since most biglaw associates may not make it far beyond 2-4 years, what seniors make in Cincinnati vs. NYC probably is an academic issue for most people.

Do you have an actual point/do you know what seniors make at these firms? Or are you just raising this to raise this? I think the point still stands that there are extreme differences in cost of living that may make a $150k (or $165k or whatever) starting salary in Cincinnati more attractive than $215k in NYC.

I’m not the OP on this comment, but I do know my friends between years 3-5 at Cincy firms make anywhere from $175-260k. Varies by firm and by individual because compensation for the most part is not lock step. If you do well, you make more. As someone who moved from cincy to a large city (not even NY), I can however tell you anectdotally that even though I make almost double of what I did in Cincy, I feel that my spending power is exactly the same if not slightly lower.

Nah, I really was curious. I forgot how much NYC COL gets everyone on TLS into debate mode. Still think best hack is to work for a market paying big firm that pays the same even for offices in a secondary market.

Separately, having lived in multiple high COL and low COL areas, I find that the calculators don't work all that well as it's not usually so apples to apples.

[Anonymous User]

Anyone know if local Cincinnati firms--or Columbus firms except for Jones Day--offer clerkship bonuses?

[Anonymous User]

Anyone know if local Cincinnati firms--or Columbus firms except for Jones Day--offer clerkship bonuses?

In Cincinnati, I think Squire, Vorys, Frost, and Taft do. Dinsmore doesn’t. I’ve heard of KMK agreeing to negotiate with a candidate for a bonus. But I wouldn’t expect much from any firm aside from Squire (and I think Frost’s is really low).