Columbia EIP 2014 Forum

[FredJones]

Computers are kinda my thing. Google doc copies.

EIP Results: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing

First failed bid: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing

If you want to be able to edit it, just copy it and save your own version. I don't want to open it up because then every Tom, Dick, and Douche
(NYU student) could mess with it, be that accidentally or on purpose.

[Anonymous User]

Computers are kinda my thing. Google doc copies.

EIP Results: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing

First failed bid: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing

You, sir, are a god. Thank you!

- Captain Falcon

[lunaraeon]

Computers are kinda my thing. Google doc copies.

. . .

If you want to be able to edit it, just copy it and save your own version. I don't want to open it up because then every Tom, Dick, and Douche
(NYU student) could mess with it, be that accidentally or on purpose.

Might want to confirm the data isn't CLS-only before making it a public sheet. (They had such a warning on the hard copy of the results data, for what it's worth.)

[Anonymous User]

Might want to confirm the data isn't CLS-only before making it a public sheet. (They had such a warning on the hard copy of the results data, for what it's worth.)

I checked this before I made my own (unsuccessful) run at conversion a few days ago. Symplicity says the Offers By Honors is subject to disciplinary action and Lawnet doesn't say anything about the results data. Op should be okay (although, I will personally fund his defense team if he gets the boot).

[Anonymous User]

How much stock should we put in a firm listing its criteria (on the spreadsheet) as top quarter or top third, but giving less than half its offers to honors people? Are those firms still in play for median students?

[Anonymous User]

How much stock should we put in a firm listing its criteria (on the spreadsheet) as top quarter or top third, but giving less than half its offers to honors people? Are those firms still in play for median students?

The "criteria" listed by firms seems completely off. I would rely more on the percentage of offers to honors students.

[Anonymous User]

How much stock should we put in a firm listing its criteria (on the spreadsheet) as top quarter or top third, but giving less than half its offers to honors people? Are those firms still in play for median students?

It kinda reeks of chest puffery. I'd easily tack on another 20% to what anyone, outside of Wachtell etc., says.

[Anonymous User]

...S&C auto-callback range...

People keep mentioning this...can anybody put a concrete GPA number on it? What GPA is supposedly an S&C auto-callback?

- Gregor Clegagne

[Anonymous User]

Another Kent checking in (so long as I don't get below a B in Con Law). I'm bidding mostly NY corporate and may throw in a few DC bids. My plan is to structure my bidlist to basically ensure that I get an interview with the top 15-20 corporate shops in NY, a couple safeties, and then a couple DC firms thrown in at the end.


I'd put our WLRK chances at a bit below even, assuming we get law review. I heard that at least a couple of the offers they gave out to the just-graduated 3Ls went to non-LR, so who knows though.

A couple things:
(1) WLRK cares less about LR than other top firms.
(2) Congrats on Kent, but do not assume that because you are Kent you are getting LR. Rising 3L and I know several people who were Kent or very close but not LR. The writing component is a huge part of your score and if it's not among the more competitive pieces, your grades won't save you.

One more piece of general advice: if you want to work in a place like DC absolutely go for it. But unless you have stellar grades (like, 3.8+), it could be more difficult than you anticipate. Not impossible or anything, but would recommend having some big NY firms in there as well so you don't end up EIPwn3d.

[Anonymous User]

Okay, let's get this started. At or just below median, interested in litigation, but keeping an open mind. I realize there aren't 30 here yet, but really, how much do the last two matter. Other factors: good interviewer, 2 years unimportant work experience. Those in bold may be ranked slightly higher than necessary due to my undying love for them.

1 Kirkland & Ellis LLP (New York, NY)
2 sidley austin llp (New York, NY)
3 paul hastings llp (New York, NY)
4 Clifford Chance US LLP (New York, NY)
5 mayer brown llp (New York, NY)
6 Morrison & Foerster LLP (New York, NY)
7 Milbank Tweed Hadley & McCloy LLP (New York, NY)
8 hogan lovells US LLP (New York, NY)
9 Jones Day (New York, NY)
10 Weil Gotshal & Manges LLP (New York, NY)
11 White & Case LLP (New York, NY)
12 Akin Gump Strauss Hauer & Feld LLP (New York, NY)
13 Greenberg Traurig LLP (New York, NY)
14 Allen & Overy LLP (New York, NY)
15 Cahill Gordon & Reindel LLP (New York, NY)
16 Schulte Roth & Zabel LLP (New York, NY)
17 Willkie Farr & Gallagher LLP (New York, NY)
18 Cadwalader Wickersham & Taft LLP (New York, NY)
19 Arnold & Porter LLP (New York, NY)
20 Ropes & Gray (New York, NY)
21 Holland & Knight
22 Baker Botts LLP (New York, NY)
23 O'Melveny & Myers LLP (New York, NY)
24 goodwin procter llp (New York, NY)
25 Fried Frank Harris Shriver & Jacobson LLP (New York, NY)
26 cooley llp (New York, NY)
27 Baker Hostetler
28 DLA Piper US LLP (New York, NY)

-Zoe

[Anonymous User]

Okay, let's get this started. At or just below median, interested in litigation, but keeping an open mind. I realize there aren't 30 here yet, but really, how much do the last two matter. Other factors: good interviewer, 2 years unimportant work experience. Those in bold may be ranked slightly higher than necessary due to my undying love for them.

1 Kirkland & Ellis LLP (New York, NY)
2 Sidley Austin LLP (New York, NY)
3 Paul Hastings LLP (New York, NY)
4 Clifford Chance US LLP (New York, NY)
5 Mayer Brown LLP (New York, NY)
6 Morrison & Foerster LLP (New York, NY)
7 Milbank Tweed Hadley & McCloy LLP (New York, NY)
8 Hogan Lovells US LLP (New York, NY)
9 Jones Day (New York, NY)
10 Weil Gotshal & Manges LLP (New York, NY)
11 White & Case LLP (New York, NY)
12 Akin Gump Strauss Hauer & Feld LLP (New York, NY)
13 Greenberg Traurig LLP (New York, NY)
14 Allen & Overy LLP (New York, NY)
15 Cahill Gordon & Reindel LLP (New York, NY)
16 Schulte Roth & Zabel LLP (New York, NY)
17 Willkie Farr & Gallagher LLP (New York, NY)
18 Cadwalader Wickersham & Taft LLP (New York, NY)
19 Arnold & Porter LLP (New York, NY)
20 Ropes & Gray (New York, NY)
21 Holland & Knight
22 Baker Botts LLP (New York, NY)
23 O'Melveny & Myers LLP (New York, NY)
24 Goodwin Procter LLP (New York, NY)
25 Fried Frank Harris Shriver & Jacobson LLP (New York, NY)
26 Cooley LLP (New York, NY)
27 Baker Hostetler
28 DLA Piper US LLP (New York, NY)

-Zoe

I'd move Mayer Brown up, atleast above Clifford. Mofo can come down a bit. Move A&O up a few spots, Arnold and Porter as well (people missed it at #11 last year).

[Anonymous User]

I'd move Mayer Brown up, atleast above Clifford. Mofo can come down a bit. Move A&O up a few spots, Arnold and Porter as well (people missed it at #11 last year).

Can you let us know where you get that sort of info? I only have the honors spreadsheet and general EIP bid, interview, etc. spreadsheet.

[Anonymous User]

It's on symplicity next to the offers by honors sheet. It's called "bidding outcomes" or something like that

[Anonymous User]

It's on symplicity next to the offers by honors sheet. It's called "bidding outcomes" or something like that

Yup. It's super helpful, it lists the firms and the "last failed bid."

Separate question - if I'm mid-Stone (3.58), how conservative do I need to be with my bid list? How many firms should I have that are under 50-60% offers by honors to try to make sure I don't strike out/be too ambitious?

[Anonymous User]

It's on symplicity next to the offers by honors sheet. It's called "bidding outcomes" or something like that

Yup. It's super helpful, it lists the firms and the "last failed bid."

Separate question - if I'm mid-Stone (3.58), how conservative do I need to be with my bid list? How many firms should I have that are under 50-60% offers by honors to try to make sure I don't strike out/be too ambitious?

just to piggy back off of this (and this may be a really stupid question), but what exactly is the relevance of the % honors report, given that the bidding is a lottery process. is it just that you want to be careful not to bid too many firms that have high % honors because even if you get the initial interview, you may very well be unlikely to get a CB, which essentially constitutes a wasted bid? if so, how should you take into account how selective the firms are when ranking them for your bid list?

just want to make sure i'm thinking this through correctly.

[Anonymous User]

It's on symplicity next to the offers by honors sheet. It's called "bidding outcomes" or something like that

Yup. It's super helpful, it lists the firms and the "last failed bid."

Separate question - if I'm mid-Stone (3.58), how conservative do I need to be with my bid list? How many firms should I have that are under 50-60% offers by honors to try to make sure I don't strike out/be too ambitious?

just to piggy back off of this (and this may be a really stupid question), but what exactly is the relevance of the % honors report, given that the bidding is a lottery process. is it just that you want to be careful not to bid too many firms that have high % honors because even if you get the initial interview, you may very well be unlikely to get a CB, which essentially constitutes a wasted bid? if so, how should you take into account how selective the firms are when ranking them for your bid list?

just want to make sure i'm thinking this through correctly.

That's my understanding, yeah.

It boils down to "if you're well below median, don't bid on Sullivan & Cromwell." Firms that are 100% offers by honors may have grade cut-offs, in which case you might waste a bid no matter how charming you come across since the callback still won't happen. A rising 3L explained to me that even if you feel like you really clicked with the attorney, they're interviewing hundreds of students. There'll likely be other students that clicked very well too, and also have grades within the firm's desired margins.

Columbia's great in that there aren't nearly as many firms with that sort of rigid GPA selectivity, but if you see that 100% offers by honors for your desired firm, it's worth a long, hard thought about whether you've sacrificed a spot on your bid list.

I don't mean to discourage you from applying broadly, please do, just be wary!

[Anonymous User]

I know this was posted previously, and CSO may be able to provide some information, but what percentages for honors should we be looking at if we are median or right above/below it? Obviously anything under 50%, because there aren't a ton of firms that have large summer classes that are also below 50%, but at what percentage is it such a reach that it's not worth a bid? Thanks!

[Anonymous User]

I know this was posted previously, and CSO may be able to provide some information, but what percentages for honors should we be looking at if we are median or right above/below it? Obviously anything under 50%, because there aren't a ton of firms that have large summer classes that are also below 50%, but at what percentage is it such a reach that it's not worth a bid? Thanks!

I did up to 75% honors, but I also looked at how many offers they gave out. I was much more willing to bid on a 75% honors firm that gave out 20 offers than one than gave out 4, because it shows there's more room for a non-Honors student to impress their way in. A firm with 3 out of 4 honors offers may just mean they had 1 superstar/partners daughter/just below Stone, etc. offer, so I tried to avoid those.

[Anonymous User]

I know this was posted previously, and CSO may be able to provide some information, but what percentages for honors should we be looking at if we are median or right above/below it? Obviously anything under 50%, because there aren't a ton of firms that have large summer classes that are also below 50%, but at what percentage is it such a reach that it's not worth a bid? Thanks!

I did up to 75% honors, but I also looked at how many offers they gave out. I was much more willing to bid on a 75% honors firm that gave out 20 offers than one than gave out 4, because it shows there's more room for a non-Honors student to impress their way in. A firm with 3 out of 4 honors offers may just mean they had 1 superstar/partners daughter/just below Stone, etc. offer, so I tried to avoid those.

That's really good advice, thanks!

[Anonymous User]

~3.2 Bid list (I know it is aggressive, but I'll already have an offer):

1. Boise Schiller NY
2. Kirkland Chi
3. Skadden NY
4. Gibson Dunn NY
5. Weil NY
6. WilmerHale NY
7. Sull Crom NY
8. Arnold & Porter NY
9. Sidley Chi
10. Akin Gump NY
11. Akin Gump DC
12. Cleary NY
13. Paul Weiss NY
14. Davis Polk NY
15. Cravath NY
16. WilmerHale DC
17. Covington DC
18. Arnold & Porter DC
19. Skadden DC
20. Susman NY
21. Kirkland DC
22. Sidley DC
23. Wachtell NY
24. Boise Schiller DC
25. Mayer Brown DC
26. Gibson Dunn DC
27. Weil CA
28. Paul Weiss DC
29. Sidley NY
30. Mayer Brown Chi

Thoughts, comments, lolz?

-Voltron

[Anonymous User]

~3.2 Bid list (I know it is aggressive, but I'll already have an offer):

1. Boise Schiller NY
2. Kirkland Chi
3. Skadden NY
4. Gibson Dunn NY
5. Weil NY
6. WilmerHale NY
7. Sull Crom NY
8. Arnold & Porter NY
9. Sidley Chi
10. Akin Gump NY
11. Akin Gump DC
12. Cleary NY
13. Paul Weiss NY
14. Davis Polk NY
15. Cravath NY
16. WilmerHale DC
17. Covington DC
18. Arnold & Porter DC
19. Skadden DC
20. Susman NY
21. Kirkland DC
22. Sidley DC
23. Wachtell NY
24. Boise Schiller DC
25. Mayer Brown DC
26. Gibson Dunn DC
27. Weil CA
28. Paul Weiss DC
29. Sidley NY
30. Mayer Brown Chi

Thoughts, comments, lolz?

-Voltron

I would not put this bidlist in with a 3.2 unless I literally had the offer, and had it in writing (not a promise, not a strong feeling that my old firm would give me an offer). This bidlist is incredibly aggressive, and I think you're almost certain to not get anything out of EIP

[Anonymous User]

Thoughts, comments, lolz?

-Voltron

I would not put this bidlist in with a 3.2 unless I literally had the offer, and had it in writing (not a promise, not a strong feeling that my old firm would give me an offer). This bidlist is incredibly aggressive, and I think you're almost certain to not get anything out of EIP

I'd appreciate it if someone could correct me if I'm wrong about this and should stop thinking of EIP in this way, but...

You are running the risk of really screwing someone with the grades to get a callback out of ever getting a screener. I'm thinking particularly about Boies, which had a failed bid at 1 last year. A 3.2 isn't going to get a callback there, but you're taking up one of their very, very few screener spots.

[Anonymous User]

~3.2 Bid list (I know it is aggressive, but I'll already have an offer):

1. Boise Schiller NY
2. Kirkland Chi
3. Skadden NY
4. Gibson Dunn NY
5. Weil NY
6. WilmerHale NY
7. Sull Crom NY
8. Arnold & Porter NY
9. Sidley Chi
10. Akin Gump NY
11. Akin Gump DC
12. Cleary NY
13. Paul Weiss NY
14. Davis Polk NY
15. Cravath NY
16. WilmerHale DC
17. Covington DC
18. Arnold & Porter DC
19. Skadden DC
20. Susman NY
21. Kirkland DC
22. Sidley DC
23. Wachtell NY
24. Boise Schiller DC
25. Mayer Brown DC
26. Gibson Dunn DC
27. Weil CA
28. Paul Weiss DC
29. Sidley NY
30. Mayer Brown Chi

Thoughts, comments, lolz?

-Voltron

Don't troll, not here, please. I'm really sorry, but this list is slightly terrifying.

Nope on Boies Schiller. It's one of the most selective firms in New York, and I'd be worried about it for a 3.6, let alone a 3.2. I'd worry about it less but you're wasting your #1 spot. Looking to the rest, actually, you just bid a series of firms with or damn close to 100% offers by honors. Handpicked the most selective ones, even.

SullCrom? Kirkland Chicago? Covington DC? Susman? Please don't take up screeners at firms you objectively don't stand a chance for.

[Anonymous User]

~3.2 Bid list (I know it is aggressive, but I'll already have an offer):

1. Boise Schiller NY
2. Kirkland Chi
3. Skadden NY
4. Gibson Dunn NY
5. Weil NY
6. WilmerHale NY
7. Sull Crom NY
8. Arnold & Porter NY
9. Sidley Chi
10. Akin Gump NY
11. Akin Gump DC
12. Cleary NY
13. Paul Weiss NY
14. Davis Polk NY
15. Cravath NY
16. WilmerHale DC
17. Covington DC
18. Arnold & Porter DC
19. Skadden DC
20. Susman NY
21. Kirkland DC
22. Sidley DC
23. Wachtell NY
24. Boise Schiller DC
25. Mayer Brown DC
26. Gibson Dunn DC
27. Weil CA
28. Paul Weiss DC
29. Sidley NY
30. Mayer Brown Chi

Thoughts, comments, lolz?

-Voltron

I would not put this bidlist in with a 3.2 unless I literally had the offer, and had it in writing (not a promise, not a strong feeling that my old firm would give me an offer). This bidlist is incredibly aggressive, and I think you're almost certain to not get anything out of EIP

Ditto. Even with the offer, you're basically throwing away your bids by putting some of the most grade conscious firms on there. If the offer you have is from a V50, why not focus on the V20-V49 to see if you really click with any of those and might realisitically get an offer? Aas it is now you're just playing lottery odds hoping for a miracle from most of these firms.

[karina]

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