THE ECONOMY and the class of 2012 Forum

[BobDole34]

Other classes, ESPECIALLY class of 2010 (because of 2L hiring this summer) are going to get reamed by the recent economic troubles. For the Class of 2012, what is the outlook? Very few firms are hiring now, but we've got a year or two for things to start picking up! Thoughts?

On another note, I think the class of 2012 is lucky; the economy should start to turn around (unless this is the great depression and we're screwed anyway) yet we also miss the inevitable rush of applications that will flood the 2013 and perhaps 2014 pools because there are fewer and fewer jobs.

[slsklaver]

There is going to be a huge back log of LS graduates from 2009-2011 who couldn't get jobs due to the economy. We're screwed.

[sbalive]

Actually, most of the time the new graduating class does pretty well... this was the case during the dotcom revival of the tech industry in the late 90s (in the early 90s tech was destroyed because of post-Cold war cutbacks). The people who were unemployed for a few years wandering around doing sub-par work or being outside engineering didn't really have any advantage over newgrads - the perception being that they didn't have any useful experience beyond their education, and they weren't "fresh" - also, with more years out of school might be less trainable & ask for higher salaries / better quality of life. Also, the ability to use campus recruitment to get a job gives a huge leg up over people just shooting off resumes from the outside.

So, bottom-line, if the economy recovers heading into 2011-2012, we'll be fine - if not, well, we're looking at another Great Depression anyway, so everybody's gonna be screwed.

(The smartest thing to do was to apply for law school in this cycle and not delay - the upswing in application volume is just a prelude to what will be carnage for Class of 2013.)

[pomona]

Economy will likely still be crap.

Or the world may come to an end: http://www.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?tit ... eID=139440

[nattag]

Or the world may come to an end: http://www.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?tit ... eID=139440

[sbalive]

Or the world may come to an end: http://www.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?tit ... eID=139440

So worst case scenario is that we don't have to pay back our loans? I think this qualifies as a "win-win".

[JuryDueT1000]

Economy will likely still be crap.

Or the world may come to an end: http://www.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?tit ... eID=139440

Pomona, is there something you know that we don't? Or are you just a pro at economic forecasting?

[pomona]

Economy will likely still be crap.

Or the world may come to an end: http://www.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?tit ... eID=139440

Pomona, is there something you know that we don't? Or are you just a pro at economic forecasting?

I'm not a pro at economic forecasting, just personally unoptimistic.

The incoming administration wants to take on more debt to try to solve our economic woes (which were primarily caused by overleveraging in the first place). I don't think a Republican administration would have given us better prospects, but if what's being promised comes to be true, I don't think the next four years will say much for good economic policy-making and we could end up in the throes of another Great Depression.

Note: I don't think the world is coming to an end though! Just think those kinds of predictions are funny.

[danconstan]

Actually, most of the time the new graduating class does pretty well... this was the case during the dotcom revival of the tech industry in the late 90s (in the early 90s tech was destroyed because of post-Cold war cutbacks). The people who were unemployed for a few years wandering around doing sub-par work or being outside engineering didn't really have any advantage over newgrads - the perception being that they didn't have any useful experience beyond their education, and they weren't "fresh" - also, with more years out of school might be less trainable & ask for higher salaries / better quality of life. Also, the ability to use campus recruitment to get a job gives a huge leg up over people just shooting off resumes from the outside.

So, bottom-line, if the economy recovers heading into 2011-2012, we'll be fine - if not, well, we're looking at another Great Depression anyway, so everybody's gonna be screwed.

(The smartest thing to do was to apply for law school in this cycle and not delay - the upswing in application volume is just a prelude to what will be carnage for Class of 2013.)

I second completely...

Also, as much as the carnage of law 2013 will, it will not compare to the carnage of business school 2013!!!!

[BWOD]

Actually, most of the time the new graduating class does pretty well... this was the case during the dotcom revival of the tech industry in the late 90s (in the early 90s tech was destroyed because of post-Cold war cutbacks)...

While this is certainly true there are a few things to still think about. First, economic recovery takes time. Even if the new stimulus gets passed in the next few months, all the money will not be allocated for 6 months to a year. In addition, that money will likely go to ready to dig projects, creating jobs for manual laborers. Only after that will money start trickling to different sectors. Even conservative estimates put that at 18 months to 2 years (read: when we want 2L summer jobs).

Second, this stimulus won't necessarily push law firms (or anyone else for that matter) to hire anyone immediately or at levels they did even a few years ago. Couple this with the same amount of people graduating from law school, you will see ever increasing competition for a smaller quantity of jobs.

While those studying in undergrad at the moment, staying out of the market for a few more years will be more helpful then entering it now. But, if you thought it would be a great idea to take a few years off, get experience and payoff debt (i.e. myself), leaving a paying job for the uncertainty of the legal market for jobs during even your 1L summer is an iffy proposition.

[Cramble]

Economy will likely still be crap.

Or the world may come to an end: http://www.merinews.com/catFull.jsp?tit ... eID=139440

As if I wasn't already paranoid enough... damn it.

[sbalive]

While those studying in undergrad at the moment, staying out of the market for a few more years will be more helpful then entering it now. But, if you thought it would be a great idea to take a few years off, get experience and payoff debt (i.e. myself), leaving a paying job for the uncertainty of the legal market for jobs during even your 1L summer is an iffy proposition.

Yeah, the 1L issue is going to be a challenge, though it depends on what you want to do that summer. There were certainly challenges in getting co-ops / summer internships in Engineering during the bad times, based on what I heard.

On the other hand, your advice is predicated on having a paying, secure job, which may itself be uncertain

In general, it's really hard to catch the cycles - I went to grad school at a time when my buddies were getting $80K starting salaries right out of school. Those of us who did go to grad school then faced a lot less competition for fellowships and top-tier schools, and by the time we were getting out and ready to start our careers, our friends had been laid off and contemplating going back to school - but at a much later point in their life progression (i.e., after getting married, kids born, etc.) when the salary reduction was more of a hit. Also, our graduate school classes came out at a time when engineering faculty hiring was booming, whereas now our friends who started later will finish up in a much drier market.

The best advice is as always, if you want to do something - go to law school, work, travel, whatever - do it & don't try to make your timing match the economy. You probably won't do much better than chance in the long run anyway. Also, getting work experience before law school is a good thing anyway!

[joonix]

The economy of the last decade was largely a huge fraud. Wealth will never be as easy to come by again. Just lower your material expectations ... we may be able to get jobs, but they won't be paying as much (the actual amount may be more due to inflation, but I'm talking purchasing power). If you have a place to live and food, be happy.

[gnahapet]

I've been thinking about this subject recently especially today after receiving my first acceptance a 120,000 offer (the cost of tuition not a scholarship).

either way, good or bad economy, im going to law school. there will be a lot of growth this spring i promise you. we will not be living in a great depression. our years are overwhelmingly prosperous.

[pomona]

I've been thinking about this subject recently especially today after receiving my first acceptance a 120,000 offer (the cost of tuition not a scholarship).

either way, good or bad economy, im going to law school. there will be a lot of growth this spring i promise you. we will not be living in a great depression. our years are overwhelmingly prosperous.

How do you know this?

[etwake]

I've been thinking about this subject recently especially today after receiving my first acceptance a 120,000 offer (the cost of tuition not a scholarship).

either way, good or bad economy, im going to law school. there will be a lot of growth this spring i promise you. we will not be living in a great depression. our years are overwhelmingly prosperous.

A little bit optimistic, no? Even Barack called these times 'more than a run of the mill recession'. This is about to turn into the first depression we've had since the 'Great Depression' if things don't pick up soon.

Either way, if things don't pick up this year, I won't be as worried about finding a job in 2012, as I will be about keeping my family out of the poor house

[maxima099]

Well as for me, I'm really struggling because I currently hold professional, well paying employment and plan on going to law school this fall. This is just simply what I want to do but I'm not ignoring the possibility that this may be a financial disaster for me either in the short or long term.

My outake on the economy is as follows: we live in a complex world which presents complex problems, that thus requires complex solutions. Finding these solutions will more than ever require that we work together, yet we are divided more than ever by class, politics and regional interests.

[Harry Pothead]

You guys are going to be fine for 2L OCI in 2010. Remember, you're being hired for summer 2011. If the economy hasn't restored itself by then, we'll have bigger problems to worry about.