Michigan 2012 Forum

[airlineraddict]

my reason was the cost to buy insurance for my spouse.

well yes, that's a pretty damn good reason!

[tl]

Questions for airlineraddict, AP and the rest of current students on the thread - do you think the estimated COL figure on Michigan's website is accurate or by and large inflated? I have a rather hard time believing COL in AA comes out to 17,500k...

I actually thought it wasn't enough money. I think it all depends on what type of income you're used to. The people that I knew that came straight from undergrad had no problem with the budget because they were used to living on a tight budget. The people that had jobs before law school thought it wasn't nearly enough money. My advice to you would be to take out the ENTIRE amount (at least for the first year). If you don't use it all, that's fine. You can pay it back OR you can use it to fund yourself for 1L summer. DO NOT ASSUME THAT YOU WILL GET A PAYING JOB OR THAT YOU WILL GET SFF! There are a lot of people who are going to be penniless this summer because of the economy being so bad and SFF being so hard to get. Save yourself some trouble now and take out the loans just in case.

[tl]

Thank you for the advice. So, being surrounded by zero native-English speakers, I find myself doing a lot of pondering about law school, my future, etc.. So I have come up with a few more questions..

I have seen on a thread somewhere on the site that a smart piece of advice for the "0L" summer is to begin thinking about what you want to do during the next summer, as this allows you to focus on school during November/December. I took that advice to heart and began searching the NALP directory. Now, I know it is a long shot these days to get hired at a firm as a 1L, but I figure I've got nothing to lose in applying. So, many firms say 1Ls can apply anytime after 12/01, how does this make sense as we most likely won't see grades from our first semester until mid-January I am guessing?

Also, what does the application consist of? (Sorry for the ignorance, please forgive me)

I sent a cover letter, resume, and a writing sample. They ask for your grades if they're interested. I was told by Career Services that you NEVER send out a transcript before it is requested (even for 2L mass mailing).

[dresden doll]

Questions for airlineraddict, AP and the rest of current students on the thread - do you think the estimated COL figure on Michigan's website is accurate or by and large inflated? I have a rather hard time believing COL in AA comes out to 17,500k...

I actually thought it wasn't enough money. I think it all depends on what type of income you're used to. The people that I knew that came straight from undergrad had no problem with the budget because they were used to living on a tight budget. The people that had jobs before law school thought it wasn't nearly enough money. My advice to you would be to take out the ENTIRE amount (at least for the first year). If you don't use it all, that's fine. You can pay it back OR you can use it to fund yourself for 1L summer. DO NOT ASSUME THAT YOU WILL GET A PAYING JOB OR THAT YOU WILL GET SFF! There are a lot of people who are going to be penniless this summer because of the economy being so bad and SFF being so hard to get. Save yourself some trouble now and take out the loans just in case.

I see. Decent points, tl. Thanks. I am definitely used to a tight budget so 17500k for a place like AA seemed excessive. I didn't think about the summer.

[airlineraddict]

Note: If you plan to ask for a higher CoA to cover potential summer windfall, don't bother. Federal Law prohibits the using federal funds for non-educated related purposes (i.e., your summer public interest job).

[dresden doll]

Note: If you plan to ask for a higher CoA to cover potential summer windfall, don't bother. Federal Law prohibits the using federal funds for non-educated related purposes (i.e., your summer public interest job).

Well, my thought was merely that I could perhaps live on a tighter budget during the year and use the remainder of COA loans for the summer. Alternately, I could probably return to Chicago and live with SO (and hopefully take up some sort of a job in the area).

[airlineraddict]

Sounds good.

[tl]

I will agree with previous statements, I am getting nervous about law school. It seems everyone has their own strategy for success in law school, and quite frankly, reading them all, my head is swimming. It seems half of the people on this site recommend doing nothing over the summer to avoid burning out during the semester. However, I am going to side with the other half (as I know with my type-A personality, I will not burn out--I tend to be one maniacal, neurotic student) and try to do some "0L" reading. But, I was wondering if one of these current students in here might fill me in with their schedule on a typical day? How many hours per day studying, anytime for the news? anytime for the gym? etc... I am a little worried that I won't have any clue about what is going on in the world because I will be so busy with school.

My advice to you is to ignore everyone else's advice and do whatever you did in UG. That's what is going to be the best bet. There is no reason to change your study habits for law school. The reason I say this is because law school grades are SO random and (at least in my case) don't seem to correlate at all with the amount of time put in. For example, first semester I did about 75% of the reading for class. 2nd semester, I did 0% of the reading for class, so far I've done better 2nd semester. Didn't change a thing otherwise. The only thing that I will advise you to do is go to class. My grades have directly correlated to my attendance. I went to Civ Pro about 4 times total last semester. I got a B-. I missed Crim Law about 2 times. I got an A-. We'll see if my theory holds up when Contracts comes in. Since I didn't go that much, I hope it doesn't.

[airlineraddict]

Skipped civpro and attended all crim laws. Got the same grade...

[dresden doll]

Skipped civpro and attended all crim laws. Got the same grade...

So they really are that random? Might the curve explains some of it, perhaps, since the grade in each class is in a way contingent upon how well others do?

[airlineraddict]

Wasn't that random for me. I just studied my ass off.

Well, granted, I paid little attention to cases. But that was my own little strategy. I focused most on contracts, though, so we'll see how that turned out.

[dresden doll]

Wasn't that random for me. I just studied my ass off.

Okay, that response comforts me. I always feel a little demoralized when people say that it's all random.

[airlineraddict]

Well, I think TL is right. When you study the way everyone else studies, it will be random.

I followed the TLS strategy (there is a link to it here somewhere) for two of my courses and a modified strategy for the other two. I'm eager to see how it worked out.

[tl]

Skipped civpro and attended all crim laws. Got the same grade...

So they really are that random? Might the curve explains some of it, perhaps, since the grade in each class is in a way contingent upon how well others do?

I think they are. I studied for Civ Pro for an entire week. Made my own outline. Read E & E and even did a practice test.

I studied for Crim for a day and a half with an outline from 2000. No supplements. No practice tests.

It's all so random.

[dresden doll]

Well, I think TL is right. When you study the way everyone else studies, it will be random.

I followed the TLS strategy (there is a link to it here somewhere) for two of my courses and a modified strategy for the other two. I'm eager to see how it worked out.

I will look into that at some point then. You should let us (or at least me) know how it worked out. I am curious myself.

[Anhimal]

I'm flying to Ann Arbor tomorrow to check out housing, is there anything I should know? What are the cons of living close to the Law School? What are the cons of living far from the Law School (beside the time issue)?

Are noise levels a big issue close the central campus?

[waitingforanswers]

Does Summer Start give one any sort of boost when it comes to getting a 1L summer job?

[tralinds]

I'm flying to Ann Arbor tomorrow to check out housing, is there anything I should know? What are the cons of living close to the Law School? What are the cons of living far from the Law School (beside the time issue)?

Are noise levels a big issue close the central campus?

Cons of living close:
-Rent is more expensive
-Noise
-Quality of housing is hit-or-miss

Cons of living far:
-Driving to/parking on campus is kind of a pain (you'll be driving around looking for parking)
-You will miss out on the fun of living on campus! Like, walking to and from bars at night, to and from football games, etc.
-No one who lives on campus will want to come visit you. You'll spend all your time going to campus to visit friends who live there, because there is much more to do on campus.

Anywhere on campus will have noise, but it's really not that bad. The worst areas are along State (house parties on football saturdays) and Washtenaw (Frats). I would look at the neighborhood south of the law quad or north of Huron if you want to avoid noise. You could also go just east of Main Street for a quieter area, but longer walk to class.

Edit to add more about noise: Generally, people aren't throwing parties in the middle of the week. Weekend nights can get a little rowdy anywhere on campus. Don't live on Greenwood, they throw huge block parties every year.
I lived north, south, and east of campus when I was an undergrad. I never had any significant noise issues.

[Anhimal]

I'm flying to Ann Arbor tomorrow to check out housing, is there anything I should know? What are the cons of living close to the Law School? What are the cons of living far from the Law School (beside the time issue)?

Are noise levels a big issue close the central campus?

Cons of living close:
-Rent is more expensive
-Noise
-Quality of housing is hit-or-miss

Cons of living far:
-Driving to/parking on campus is kind of a pain (you'll be driving around looking for parking)
-You will miss out on the fun of living on campus! Like, walking to and from bars at night, to and from football games, etc.
-No one who lives on campus will want to come visit you. You'll spend all your time going to campus to visit friends who live there, because there is much more to do on campus.

Anywhere on campus will have noise, but it's really not that bad. The worst areas are along State (house parties on football saturdays) and Washtenaw (Frats). I would look at the neighborhood south of the law quad or north of Huron if you want to avoid noise. You could also go just east of Main Street for a quieter area, but longer walk to class.

Thanks! Very helpful... especially about the frats. That is exactly what I am trying to avoid.

Let's say we have a big snowstorm, how much of a pain would driving to school be from further away? Are they pretty good about the roads or is it a disaster?

[tralinds]

Let's say we have a big snowstorm, how much of a pain would driving to school be from further away? Are they pretty good about the roads or is it a disaster?

Hmm. The UM campus is very good about clearing snow, even in a big storm. They have mini-snowplow machines to clear all the sidewalks, too. I'm not sure how quickly the rest of Ann Arbor manages to clear out the snow, but if they are anything like the rest of Michigan, they will clear it pretty quickly, but it may take a couple hours after a storm to get it all removed. You really just need to leave yourself extra time to deal with it; you'll rarely be *snowed in* somewhere.

Snow can also be a pain if you have to park your car on the street; plows go by and throw snow to the side and create a snow wall around your car which you'll need to clear.

[lotus]

So they really are that random?

I didn't find them to be completely random. Generally the amount of effort I put into a class tracked with my grades.

It didn't track all that perfectly with how I felt coming out of the exam, which is where I think some of the random feeling comes from. In Civ Pro I sincerely thought I'd be lucky to get a B+ and ended up with an A. Whereas the opposite happened with Property last semester.

I know it's really frustrating to be told there is no one answer to studying and you'll have to figure it out for yourself (at least I found it frustrating). I can tell you what worked/didn't work for me, though. I'm still waiting on Contracts, but so far I've done significantly better second semester from the first and I think my change in studying habits made the difference. In the classes where I took hand-written notes, did at least two practice tests, and started reading the hornbooks and E&Es ~ 1/2-2/3s of the way through the semester I got As/A-s. In some of those classes I'd type up my handwritten notes at the end of each week which gave me a mini-review of each week. In the classes where I typed my notes during class and didn't use supplements I got B+s. I didn't use tutors or study groups (at least through the semester. I talked about practice tests with groups of people). I did absolutely find using old outlines helpful--though that said, where I typed up my own outline and only used older outlines as a secondary review source I did better.

At least for me, I think I would have found no use in reading the supplements before class. For me they worked best as a way of reframing the issues from a slightly different POV. They restated things from class in ways that made me understand them better and put together details I hadn't thought of earlier. I don't think I would have gotten these things from them if I wasn't already familiar with the material. I also didn't read all of the E&Es. I just picked subjects I had trouble with and the issues I was certain would be on the test.

I don't think it's a terrible idea to read supplements over 0L summer if you're that worried. But don't over-do it. I was finishing up some work for another degree the summer before 1L and was really kind of mentally burnt out even before I arrived. Which was a huge problem. So I'd strongly recommend against doing too much work over the summer. Your first year is going to involve a lot of work. You're going to need to pace yourself at least somewhat.

[MLaw11]

Law school grades aren't random; they just appear so due to the curve. Your knowledge of the subject matter is relevant only with respect to others' knowledge of the material. You walk out of your most difficult exam feeling terrible, but get a good grade and declare it random. In reality, it probably was worse than all your other exams. But your grade measures the quality of your exam relative to your classmates, not your other exams.

[tl]

Would it be rude if I e-mailed Radin to ask if she is going to turn in grades by the deadline? lol. I'm starting to get impatient and can't wait anymore.

[Alexandria]

So they really are that random?

I didn't find them to be completely random. Generally the amount of effort I put into a class tracked with my grades.

It didn't track all that perfectly with how I felt coming out of the exam, which is where I think some of the random feeling comes from.

This is how I feel. I've had things I've been embarrassed to turn in that have been As and things I thought I NAILED that were B+s. But I still don't think it's random... when I am honest with myself, the classes I was most engaged in (both in terms of actually paying attention in class and being very interested in the material) are the ones I've done the best in.

[charliec9]

Would it be rude if I e-mailed Radin to ask if she is going to turn in grades by the deadline? lol. I'm starting to get impatient and can't wait anymore.

Could be worse...you could have none. Sadly, I'm sure if I e-mail all of my professors asking about deadlines, nothing will come of it.