Waitlist Waitlist Waitlist...even with 179

(Applications Advice, Letters of Recommendation . . . )
Post Reply
LookingGood

New
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Apr 29, 2021 8:57 am

Waitlist Waitlist Waitlist...even with 179

Post by LookingGood » Thu Apr 29, 2021 10:13 am

Just wanted to provide a little insight into how crazy this year is...

I am 36 with a Master's degree and 10 years of professional experience in healthcare administration. I previously attended law school at SMU straight after college, but failed out due to personal problems (that I fully discuss in my personal statement this time around).

I scored a 179 on the January LSAT and had a 3.39 undergrad GPA (3. 53 graduate GPA but we all know that doesn't count at all!). LoRs from the VP at my company, a Texas Super Lawyer & Top 100 Civil Trial Attorney, a federal judge, and a dean emeritus of a North Carolina law school. The dean emeritus is actually my aunt, so I have quite a bit of insight into the law school admissions process - and for multiple reasons this seems to be an abnormal year.

I applied very late in the admissions cycle due to not getting my LSAT score back until Feb 3. My applications and results so far are as follows...

University of Houston - accepted
Texas A&M - waitlisted
SMU - waitlisted
UT Austin - waitlisted
Penn State - waitlisted
Arizona State - waitlisted
Texas Tech - pending
Duke - rejected
UVA - rejected

Unfortunately, it looks like because I applied so late in the cycle I am going to need to reapply in September as soon as applications open and there is more $$ available.

My aunt told me she knows of numerous schools whose classes are full. Scoring a 179 (99.6%) and getting waitlisted practically everywhere, no $$ from UH, and rejected at 2/3 T15 schools seems to bear that out.

Anyone else having a similar experience?

nixy

Gold
Posts: 3308
Joined: Fri Feb 16, 2018 8:58 am

Re: Waitlist Waitlist Waitlist...even with 179

Post by nixy » Thu Apr 29, 2021 10:32 am

I don’t doubt that this year is weird, but applying after the Feb LSAT has always been a bad idea. And failing out of law school once is also likely to give some adcomms pause, even though I realize that it was long ago for you now.

(I don’t mean ^ at all disrespectfully, your LSAT is impressive and much better than mine. But I think you’d be an unpredictable candidate any year.)

crazywafflez

Bronze
Posts: 345
Joined: Sat Dec 23, 2017 8:02 pm

Re: Waitlist Waitlist Waitlist...even with 179

Post by crazywafflez » Thu Apr 29, 2021 11:05 am

Wait till next year and reapply. Going to Houston at sticker isn't worth it. You should be going for free.

objctnyrhnr

Moderator
Posts: 1427
Joined: Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:44 am

Re: Waitlist Waitlist Waitlist...even with 179

Post by objctnyrhnr » Thu Apr 29, 2021 11:22 am

These schools have given away both their spots and their scholly $ for the year. It sucks but yeah, looks like you’ll need to wait another cycle. But seems like you realize that so we don’t have to talk you out of a bad move.

LookingGood

New
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Apr 29, 2021 8:57 am

Re: Waitlist Waitlist Waitlist...even with 179

Post by LookingGood » Thu Apr 29, 2021 12:23 pm

Thanks for the input everyone! Yeah, I realize now applying so late in the cycle really shot me in the foot, and I agree my past law school experience is enough to give adcomms pause. My aunt (who also served on the admissions committee at a law school in Texas for a decade) said it would likely automatically trigger a committee review and some schools might not even consider me. I'm thinking since I obtained my MHA from a good school after resolving said personal issues and graduated with honors (while working full time) might have helped offset that a bit. It also wasn't a very egregious fail - I completed 69 credit hours, and actually only failed one class. Unfortunately that dropped me just below the required GPA to continue, but I look at it as more of a blessing now. I wasn't able to do anywhere near my best the first time around.

Since I did get waitlisted and not rejected at most schools, I am wondering if that past experience will have more of a negative impact on scholarship offers in the next cycle vs offers of admission.

Want to continue reading?

Register now to search topics and post comments!

Absolutely FREE!


User avatar
cavalier1138

Moderator
Posts: 7716
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2016 8:01 pm

Re: Waitlist Waitlist Waitlist...even with 179

Post by cavalier1138 » Thu Apr 29, 2021 12:54 pm

I feel like a lot of the waitlists could be YP. Did you follow up with any of those schools to express interest in them directly?

But agree with all the other posts that your past is going to be an issue and to not attend Houston at sticker.

LookingGood

New
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Apr 29, 2021 8:57 am

Re: Waitlist Waitlist Waitlist...even with 179

Post by LookingGood » Fri Apr 30, 2021 1:41 am

cavalier1138 wrote:
Thu Apr 29, 2021 12:54 pm
I feel like a lot of the waitlists could be YP. Did you follow up with any of those schools to express interest in them directly?

But agree with all the other posts that your past is going to be an issue and to not attend Houston at sticker.
I just received most of my decisions in the last 2-3 weeks aside from A&M and Houston, but I have sent letters of continued interest and additional letters of recommendation where possible and followed up with Penn State today. A&M is hosting a Waitlist Zoom Info Session next Wednesday so I'll have a better idea of what their process and timeline look like after that.

Getting kicked out of SMU for a poor GPA is a big fat red strike against me for sure, although if it were an automatic disqualifier I don't think I would have been waitlisted everywhere especially by UT Austin. Is that a reasonable assumption? It definitely renders me incapable of getting any automatic acceptances based on LSAT/GPA and I'm worried it will impact my scholarship eligibility to an extent beyond my ability to supplement. I've done pretty well for myself in the past ten years, but not THAT well lol.

Another question I have related to my undergrad GPA - a 3.39 is not indiciative of my academic proficiency. I graduated from a top 30 program for my MHA with a 3.53 while also working a full-time job with 50% travel, and was able to do so after being diagnosed with ADD after my time at SMU. I know a lot of applications asked if there was any explanation for a discrepancy between LSAT and GPA so is that something I should discuss in an addendum when I reapply?

I just didn't feel the benefit outweighed the risk, but am realizing how little I understand about the process even having gone through it before and with insider information so would appreciate your opinions.

LookingGood

New
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Apr 29, 2021 8:57 am

Re: Waitlist Waitlist Waitlist...even with 179

Post by LookingGood » Fri Apr 30, 2021 7:51 am

Well, I feel a little better. I know it's self-reported, but there is a candidate over on LSN with a 180 and 4.0 who applied late in the cycle like I did - they also got waitlisted at most places. They did better than me at some schools - Penn State accepted them but only offered $50k and they are known for offering $150k+ as 51% of their student body is on a full tuition scholarship. They got WL at Virginia whereas I was rejected, but we both got waitlisted at UT Austin.

At least gives me some hope that I'll be able to generate more positive responses in September. My friend that's a civil trial attorney said he'd give me work to do over the summer so hopefully that will help too.

nixy

Gold
Posts: 3308
Joined: Fri Feb 16, 2018 8:58 am

Re: Waitlist Waitlist Waitlist...even with 179

Post by nixy » Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:53 am

Also, your application is sort of unorthodox - apply to more places? That’s a kind of weird list - I get that it looks like you want to stay in Texas, but then why Penn State or ASU? If ASU, why not U of A? If Penn State, why not Pitt? If Austin, Duke, and UVA, why not the rest of the bottom half of the T14, Vandy, and Wash U? (I do actually agree that some of the WLs could be yield protect - A&M and probably Penn State and ASU don’t think you’ll actually go there.)

Want to continue reading?

Register for access!

Did I mention it was FREE ?


LookingGood

New
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Apr 29, 2021 8:57 am

Re: Waitlist Waitlist Waitlist...even with 179

Post by LookingGood » Fri Apr 30, 2021 12:11 pm

nixy wrote:
Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:53 am
Also, your application is sort of unorthodox - apply to more places? That’s a kind of weird list - I get that it looks like you want to stay in Texas, but then why Penn State or ASU? If ASU, why not U of A? If Penn State, why not Pitt? If Austin, Duke, and UVA, why not the rest of the bottom half of the T14, Vandy, and Wash U? (I do actually agree that some of the WLs could be yield protect - A&M and probably Penn State and ASU don’t think you’ll actually go there.)
It's quite unorthodox haha, let's be real! Yes, I don't absolutely have to stay in Texas, but my girls do. They are 8 and 10 and I really don't want to miss those three years of their childhood. Especially my older daughter. I applied to Penn State because they are tied with A&M in the rankings and they hand out full scholarships like candy, and I applied to Arizona State solely because they waived all my fees (Penn State did too, CAS included). I figured if I got a full ride from Penn State I could possibly leverage it with A&M.

I applied to Duke because my aunt that I mentioned previously lives in Raleigh as does my best friend from high school. Virginia isn't too far away from there, and I have always just been in love with that school - Virginia is also very generous with full scholarships (17%). Duke and Virginia were my "reach" schools and if I'd gotten in and gotten financial aid my family was supportive in me going there.

I actually completed applications for Vanderbilt, Wash U, Penn, Yale, and UC Berkeley but did not submit them. Figured my chances at Penn, Yale and Berkeley were slim and at the end of the day I decided the cost involved at applying to all those places didn't make sense given how unlikely it would have been for me to attend any of those schools.

I agree on the YP point. Especially with PSU, ASU, and A&M given how competitive they are with the rankings. A&M has moved up more than 100 places in the last 5 years. Honestly I think part of the reason UH accepted me is because of my extensive professional healthcare background, my in-laws live there, and they've been ranked in the lower 50s for decades and don't seem to be as concerned with moving up as the other schools I applied to.

I did make it clear in my letter of continued interest to A&M that if I am accepted and can afford it, that's where I'm going. Everyone on my mother's side graduated from A&M except for her and my aunt, so I know what it means to be an Aggie (counts for a ton with them). I also really like the way they've set up their program and how they focus heavily on legal writing, professional development, and educating students how to be a lawyer, not just think like one. I will let everyone know how the Zoom Info Session there turns out on Wednesday.

Where else would you recommend I apply? Should I reapply to Duke and Virginia right when applications open up?

crazywafflez

Bronze
Posts: 345
Joined: Sat Dec 23, 2017 8:02 pm

Re: Waitlist Waitlist Waitlist...even with 179

Post by crazywafflez » Fri Apr 30, 2021 3:27 pm

LookingGood wrote:
Fri Apr 30, 2021 12:11 pm
nixy wrote:
Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:53 am
Also, your application is sort of unorthodox - apply to more places? That’s a kind of weird list - I get that it looks like you want to stay in Texas, but then why Penn State or ASU? If ASU, why not U of A? If Penn State, why not Pitt? If Austin, Duke, and UVA, why not the rest of the bottom half of the T14, Vandy, and Wash U? (I do actually agree that some of the WLs could be yield protect - A&M and probably Penn State and ASU don’t think you’ll actually go there.)
It's quite unorthodox haha, let's be real! Yes, I don't absolutely have to stay in Texas, but my girls do. They are 8 and 10 and I really don't want to miss those three years of their childhood. Especially my older daughter. I applied to Penn State because they are tied with A&M in the rankings and they hand out full scholarships like candy, and I applied to Arizona State solely because they waived all my fees (Penn State did too, CAS included). I figured if I got a full ride from Penn State I could possibly leverage it with A&M.

I applied to Duke because my aunt that I mentioned previously lives in Raleigh as does my best friend from high school. Virginia isn't too far away from there, and I have always just been in love with that school - Virginia is also very generous with full scholarships (17%). Duke and Virginia were my "reach" schools and if I'd gotten in and gotten financial aid my family was supportive in me going there.

I actually completed applications for Vanderbilt, Wash U, Penn, Yale, and UC Berkeley but did not submit them. Figured my chances at Penn, Yale and Berkeley were slim and at the end of the day I decided the cost involved at applying to all those places didn't make sense given how unlikely it would have been for me to attend any of those schools.

I agree on the YP point. Especially with PSU, ASU, and A&M given how competitive they are with the rankings. A&M has moved up more than 100 places in the last 5 years. Honestly I think part of the reason UH accepted me is because of my extensive professional healthcare background, my in-laws live there, and they've been ranked in the lower 50s for decades and don't seem to be as concerned with moving up as the other schools I applied to.

I did make it clear in my letter of continued interest to A&M that if I am accepted and can afford it, that's where I'm going. Everyone on my mother's side graduated from A&M except for her and my aunt, so I know what it means to be an Aggie (counts for a ton with them). I also really like the way they've set up their program and how they focus heavily on legal writing, professional development, and educating students how to be a lawyer, not just think like one. I will let everyone know how the Zoom Info Session there turns out on Wednesday.

Where else would you recommend I apply? Should I reapply to Duke and Virginia right when applications open up?
You should scratch Penn State or ASU from your list unless you're using them as a bargaining chip (I know you said it, but just reiterating it). Just apply to all halfway decent TX schools (Baylor, Houston, SMU, maybe A&M) and go to the one that gives you a fullride- or close to it and you can live at home. I'd also obviously apply to UT. You can do Vandy and WashU if you really want but don't see a point, unless it is for scholly negs. Toss apps at all the T14 and just see what happens. I wouldn't leave TX if I were you though unless it were for a T13*, and even then, in your situation, I'd certainly take SMU or Houston at fullride over sticker at Cornell or whatever.
You should email the schools and ask for an app fee waiver as well. No reason to leave your family and go to a school like Emory or something when you want to be in TX and be with your family.

Register now!

Resources to assist law school applicants, students & graduates.

It's still FREE!


Post Reply

Return to “Law School Admissions Forum”