Where to? 170 / 3.82 / 13 Years since Undergrad Forum

[zappayou]

170 LSAT /3.82 Undergrad (English) / 13 years restaurant work kitchen experience / Age 34
Hi there, I just received the score from my last LSAT take and am starting the law school application process. I'm looking for advice on where to attend law school. I'm trying to go to school for the least amount of money possible, and I want to practice law in Colorado after graduation. There's a good chance I will be able to receive generous aid practice from both UC Boulder and the University of Denver's law schools, but I know I should probably be applying to some T14 schools as well. Does anyone have an idea as to how far my numbers will go in terms of aid packages from the T14? Also, am I doing myself a disservice by going to school outside of Colorado, especially when I'm likely to receive a great deal of funding and a good chance of finding work by going to one of the aforementioned schools? How much more am I likely to gain by going to a higher rated school? I've travelled extensively in the U.S. and my career goals are modest (Public Defender, or Immigrants/Workers Rights), and as far as I know I intend to make Colorado my home for the foreseeable future.
Thanks for all the advice; this forum has been an invaluable resource, especially in motivating me to get the best LSAT score I possibly could.

[AdieuCali]

Congratulations on an excellent LSAT score! Your numbers make you competitive throughout the T20, with at least a few sizeable scholarships. https://mylsn.info/hz23om/

You'll certainly have a full ride at WUSTL and you can probably negotiate a 3/4 ride somewhere in the T13. (e.g. you could turn $$ at Columbia or $$$ at Michigan into $$$$ at Northwestern). You're also apparently a long-shot at YSH, which only use need-based aid. At your age, parental support won't be considered, so it's likely you'll get a good aid package.

Colorado is a small legal market that mostly draws from local schools, but my understanding is T13 grads are usually able to land Denver as long as you put in the work. Berkeley and Michigan both have small networks in Denver. Even with "modest" goals, there is a spectrum of prestige and opportunities (local PD in Pueblo ---> federal PD in Denver). The T13 is going to open more doors to you, including federal clerkships and "elite PI."

For your goals a 1/2 ride at Michigan may be a better financial choice than UDenver or UC Boulder. Neither of those schools guarantee LRAP and presumably even with a full ride, you'll have to take out some loans for living expenses. Also note that Denver has conditional scholarships, meaning a bad semester could move you from full-ride to sticker. All of the T13 have guaranteed LRAP packages that will probably mean you never make a single student loan payment given your goals/market. Further, at the Colorado schools, there's a 10-20% chance you'll have no legal job at all at graduation. https://www.lstreports.com/compare/colo ... /michigan/. In a down economy with state budgets being slashed, those percentages will probably look more like the 2011 numbers (30%). A T13 will pretty much guarantee you a job either in Colorado or a nearby market that you can eventually use as a springboard back into the Rockies.

I would frankly blanket the T13, WUSTL, and any other schools in the T20 that give you fee waivers. Make sure to request waivers everywhere. There's an early application advantage almost everywhere, so you should strive to have your apps in before Thanksgiving. Good luck!

[crazywafflez]

I think there's nothing wrong with going to U CB for a full ride with your goals. If your ultimate goal 100% is to be back in CO, I wouldn't go to WashU. I'd feel more confident in the T14 though. But I wouldn't pay full boat at Cornell vs a free ride to CO. If you get a great package at Mich or something, I can see taking that. I would avoid U of Denver, personally.
I do think a full ride at WashU though is a great outcome- it probs won't get you back to Boulder (maybe?) but it would open up a lot of the midwest for you doing these exact same goals, and give you an outside shot at biglaw.

[nixy]

Colorado is a small legal market that mostly draws from local schools, but my understanding is T13 grads are usually able to land Denver as long as you put in the work.

Only if you have ties. T14 people without ties get shut out (it sounds like the OP probably does, but I wanted to point this out).

I think a full ride (or the closest they give) at CU or DU is a great option for someone who really wants to be a PD or do immigrants rights - on the ground experience and connections will be most important for those fields and there are going to be tons of alumni connections. I don't think someone who starts out in Denver and wants to stay there will suffer from going to a local school. But a T14 at a discount certainly isn't a bad option. I can't really comment on how much money the OP's likely to get in the T14 (I just don't know), which sounds like it will be the determining factor. It's true too that T14s, at least especially the top ones, will have better LRAP options - CU and DU grads need to rely primarily on IBR/PSLF, which people have different comfort levels with.)

No disrespect to the glorious T20 and such, but I don't see any point in going to WashU/USC/UCLA/UT/Vandy over CU/DU (assuming a good price) for a job in Colorado long-term. The T20 are excellent but are still more regional, and aren't really going to help someone get a job in Colorado more than having gone to law school there will. I also don't think any will offer significant COL savings.

[zappayou]

Thank you all for your responses. I've been living in Colorado for 3 years so I wouldn't necessarily say I have ties, although an attorney friend said he can pretty much guarantee me a spot at his firm for my 1L and 2L summers if I attend school here. I appreciate the info on Berkeley and Michigan having ties to Colorado, do any of you know about placement opportunities here for UT grads? Looks like I'll be blanketing (Berk, Michigan, Cornell, NYU, NU, and UT in addition to CO schools)-- I'd like to give myself the opportunity to have my goals change as I pursue my legal education, as there may be opportunities in PI that I am as yet ignorant of.
Thanks again!

[AdieuCali]

Thank you all for your responses. I've been living in Colorado for 3 years so I wouldn't necessarily say I have ties

3 years in CO is a "strong" tie. In the small, high-desired markets (Seattle, Austin, SD, Denver, etc.) employers are really worried about transplants wanting a vacation destination instead of a long-term home base for their career. Two of my friends landed Denver B/L from my T13 with ties of "my wife's family lives here" and "I went to high school in CO."

although an attorney friend said he can pretty much guarantee me a spot at his firm for my 1L and 2L summers if I attend school here.

Would he not give you the job if you went to Cornell or Texas instead of Boulder?

Looks like I'll be blanketing (Berk, Michigan, Cornell, NYU, NU, and UT in addition to CO schools)--

[Ron Swanson voice] Wait. I said "blanket" the T13. I'm worried what you just heard was, "Apply to some T13 schools." What I said was, "Submit all the T13 applications you have." Do you understand?

You have a long-shot at YSH, decent chances at CCN, and great scholarship opportunities throughout the lower T13. That said, you're not a "lock" anywhere. It's totally plausible you get into Cornell w/ $150k scholly, Duke w/ $120k, waitlisted at UVA, and admits without schollys at Harvard, Berk, and Mich. Even if you have no intention of relocating to Ithaca or Durham, those offers (and the H admit) are going to be super-valuable negotiation leverage to get Berk or Michigan up to >$100k.

I'd like to give myself the opportunity to have my goals change as I pursue my legal education, as there may be opportunities in PI that I am as yet ignorant of.

Smart! Most of the people in my T13 class who wanted PI when we started (myself included) are headed for a stint in Biglaw. Besides the money, B/L will give you a major networking advantages. Having that option on the table for a median student (as well as opportunities for federal clerkships and the competitive federal honors programs) are really only possible from the T13.

[AdieuCali]

You have a long-shot at YSH, decent chances at CCN, and great scholarship opportunities throughout the lower T13. That said, you're not a "lock" anywhere. It's totally plausible you get into Cornell w/ $150k scholly, Duke w/ $120k, waitlisted at UVA, and admits without schollys at Harvard, Berk, and Mich.

Wait, I'm dumb. YHS have need-based aid. Unless you're sitting on a trust fund or substantial savings, you're going to get a nice aid package at those schools if you're admitted.