JD-PhD at Northwestern Pritzker and elsewhere... Forum

[Dipsychus]

Anyone who’s applied to the combined JD-PhD at Northwestern? One of the reasons it’s attractive is that the program provides full funding for six years. For someone who has a strong interest in research and academia, that seems like a good option; and even though you graduate two to three years later, you come out debt free.

Yale has only 36 students pursuing a dual degree. Most schools who allow for the dual-degree option say that applications and admissions to the law school have no impact on MA/PhD applications and admissions, and vice versa. I find that a little bit hard to believe, though. What’s said on a website does not necessarily reflect what adcoms are actually looking for.

[cavalier1138]

One of the reasons it’s attractive is that the program provides full funding for six years. For someone who has a strong interest in research and academia, that seems like a good option; and even though you graduate two to three years later, you come out debt free.

You come out debt-free from the PhD program; I don't think they're going to fully fund your JD.

And even if it's hard to believe, any joint-degree admission is really just you applying to two separate programs. Doctorate programs are selective about totally different things than law schools are.

[Dipsychus]

Yes, Pritzker fully funds the JD if you’re a JD-PhD student; the school even has a single application for this option, not two separate one. Six years and five summers fully funded, JD time included, and a stipend (in addition to tuition and fees paid) of approximately $33,000 a year for living expenses.

[cavalier1138]

Yes, Pritzker fully funds the JD if you’re a JD-PhD student; the school even has a single application for this option, not two separate one. Six years and five summers fully funded, JD time included, and a stipend (in addition to tuition and fees paid) of approximately $33,000 a year for living expenses.

Oh, that's different. I'm guessing the full funding is one of the things they're doing with the Pritzker money. I assume you'd still have to have full-ride worthy credentials and a solid research proposal for the relevant academic field. They're not going to throw that much cash at you if you're only qualified for one of the programs.

[Splurgles23]

Yes, Pritzker fully funds the JD if you’re a JD-PhD student; the school even has a single application for this option, not two separate one. Six years and five summers fully funded, JD time included, and a stipend (in addition to tuition and fees paid) of approximately $33,000 a year for living expenses.

While this program may be great for some people, 6 years isn't a whole lot of time if you're combining the two degrees. It depends on the details, obviously, but most high-quality PhD programs require around 5 years' worth of commitment, at least. So if we're talking 6 years of funding to do both the PhD AND the JD, that's a lot of compression, and your academic mastery (as well as ability/time to publish in peer-reviewed journals rather than student-run law reviews) may be adversely affected. I'd be curious to see the placement records for people who choose to do this.

[QContinuum]

Yes, Pritzker fully funds the JD if you’re a JD-PhD student; the school even has a single application for this option, not two separate one. Six years and five summers fully funded, JD time included, and a stipend (in addition to tuition and fees paid) of approximately $33,000 a year for living expenses.

While this program may be great for some people, 6 years isn't a whole lot of time if you're combining the two degrees. It depends on the details, obviously, but most high-quality PhD programs require around 5 years' worth of commitment, at least. So if we're talking 6 years of funding to do both the PhD AND the JD, that's a lot of compression, and your academic mastery (as well as ability/time to publish in peer-reviewed journals rather than student-run law reviews) may be adversely affected. I'd be curious to see the placement records for people who choose to do this.

It depends on the field. IIRC, Yale Law School's Ph.D. in Law (which is fully funded) only takes 3 years - so if one was to do a 3-year J.D. and then the Ph.D. in Law, that'd add up to 6 years total. Doing an integrated J.D.-Ph.D. at the same time would likely actually provide more time for research than doing a J.D. first and then a Ph.D., because some course credits should be able to be "double counted" toward both degrees in an integrated program.

All that said, it's important to note that a Ph.D. is not - yet - a requirement/expectation in legal hiring. The prestige of the J.D. institution remains hugely important, and I'd be hesitant to advise anyone targeting academia to attend any school outside the T6.

[nixy]

The Yale PhD in law is, AFAIK, the only program of its kind, though, and its entrants will probably be atypical. I agree that a PhD + JD in 6 years will be tough (plus being funded for 6 years doesn’t mean you finish in 6 years). It will vary by field, but you’d need to be *very* disciplined and come into the program with a *very* good idea of what you want to write your dissertation on.

I actually think that if you do a JD-PhD the strength of the PhD program carries a lot of weight and that if you’re at a top PhD program you don’t necessarily need T6 credentials (even if you’re aiming for legal academia).

[Thom]

I take it that the PhD portion will be in either a Business, Management, or Law related field as well? (public policy, etc)

[Dipsychus]

I take it that the PhD portion will be in either a Business, Management, or Law related field as well? (public policy, etc)

No, it doesn't have to be. Dual JD-PhD with history, political science, philosophy, English, and especially economics all possible.

[Dipsychus]

"While this program may be great for some people, 6 years isn't a whole lot of time if you're combining the two degrees. It depends on the details, obviously, but most high-quality PhD programs require around 5 years' worth of commitment, at least. So if we're talking 6 years of funding to do both the PhD AND the JD, that's a lot of compression, and your academic mastery (as well as ability/time to publish in peer-reviewed journals rather than student-run law reviews) may be adversely affected. I'd be curious to see the placement records for people who choose to do this."

You're expected to do a lot of PhD research work over each summer, so there's no room to be a summer associate (or much "off time" at all). An additional stipulation is that you make make a good faith effort to find academic/research-based work within fours of gaining both degrees; if, instead, you decide to follow the BigLaw track you have to pay much of the money -- and it amounts to $600K or so -- back (not sure on the details of that).

[Dipsychus]

Perhaps this should be a different thread. UVA offers a JD-MA dual degree in many fields, three years; if you qualify for merit- or need-based funding for the JD, the law school will cover the GSAS (MA) costs. This is highly unusual, given that a terminal masters is almost never funded at top graduate schools; often a cash cow.

[The Lsat Airbender]

Perhaps this should be a different thread. UVA offers a JD-MA dual degree in many fields, three years; if you qualify for merit- or need-based funding for the JD, the law school will cover the GSAS (MA) costs. This is highly unusual, given that a terminal masters is almost never funded at top graduate schools; often a cash cow.

Are you sure about this?

https://www.law.virginia.edu/academics/ ... am-english

During the first five semesters of the program, the student will pay tuition to the School of Law according to its tuition schedule. During the final two semesters of the program, the student will pay tuition to the Graduate School of Arts & Sciences according to its tuition schedule.

[...]

Financial aid (including loans and scholarships) will be provided by the school to which the student is paying tuition in a given semester. Financial aid is not guaranteed and is subject to individual school and University regulations and availability. Students must meet the satisfactory academic progress standards of the school providing the financial aid in a given semester.

It's also more than 3 years - you do 5 semesters on the JD and then two more on the MA, so at best you have to do half of a 4th year. Some of the non-GSAS duals (like the JDMPP) take even longer.