Advice please.. Im having a crisis Forum

[SWNAM90]

Hi, it's my first time posting anything on TLS...

And I feel sorry that my first post isn't one to give but receive help. Apologies!

So here's my situation. I had planned to take my 3rd LSAT on coming October, but Im rethinking whether I should the nearer the date gets.

I graduated from a top 30 college, got a 3.74 GPA (cum laude, and honors in philosophy) and canceled my first LSAT and got a 169 on my second attempt.

I think I can do better, but by only a few points. Also, I think that there are chances that I might lose a couple points, too, and this is the problem.

I'd like to go CCN or Penn Law, especially Columbia or Penn Law, and I am wondering these:

1. Would taking a third time and getting 170~172 make a noticeable difference in my chances of getting in?
2. How much would it hurt my candidacy if I canceled again, or got something like 165~168?
3. Am I better off not taking another test? Or, perhaps, sending my applications ASAP, and then taking the LSAT on December if I get waitlisted?

Thank you so much!

[Smoking Gunner]

1. Check mylsn--the answer is yes. Plus you'll be looking at much more $.

2. Not at all. School's don't average scores. Don't get consumed by this myth.

3. If you think there's a good chance that your score will improve, retake. If you don't think you'll improve and/or you're comfortable leaving $$ on the table, then apply now. Only you know your financial situation and your likelihood of increasing your score, so I'd say just go with your gut.

[Hutz_and_Goodman]

You should retake if you're set on Columbia/Penn. With a 171 or 172 you will get a lot more $.

[SWNAM90]

1. Check mylsn--the answer is yes. Plus you'll be looking at much more $.

2. Not at all. School's don't average scores. Don't get consumed by this myth.

3. If you think there's a good chance that your score will improve, retake. If you don't think you'll improve and/or you're comfortable leaving $$ on the table, then apply now. Only you know your financial situation and your likelihood of increasing your score, so I'd say just go with your gut.

Hey thanks for the advice. I think what's really my concern now is whether to retake in October or December. I've been busy working and writing my apps that I hadn't had the time to prepare for the LSAT. Say that in a couple weeks I know I won't do well in October, then would it be advisable for me to take the LSAT in December with more prep but send the apps in mid October any way? Hmmm...

[Hornet2011]

To my knowledge (which I believe is quite accurate) Once you submit an app the school will start evaluating it as if no further LSAT score will be submitted unless you tell them you are retaking. If the school knows you are retaking they will not evaluate your app until the score comes in. So if I understand your dilemma correctly, there are two parts to it (1) to retake or not and (2) when to submit (which is based partly off potential retake date.

For question 1 -- definitely retake. When is up to you but I would suggest retaking whenever you feel truly most ready.

Part 2 -- as to when to submit this is a bit trickier. If you do retake in October wait for that score. If you retake in Dec here is an interesting idea which would be useful to have additional feedback on from other TSLers. I read last year once or twice about people submitting, being rejected, and then retaking the LSAT and getting a much higher score and asking a school to reconsider their app based on this new score. In all the cases I saw the school did look at the app again. This might be an effective tactic if you retake in Dec, but I would wait and see what the other TSLers think.

Lastly, and this might help you improve your score, please do recognize your situation is pretty good. With your current scores you will have a pretty good cycle in the T14 regardless. Even if you bombed your 3rd take you'd still get $$ at a few T14 schools. This is a position of strength to be retaking the LSAT so be confident (and somewhat relaxed!) knowing no matter what your situation is a good one

[CanadianWolf]

Retake when you are confident that you can improve your score. With a 169/3.74, you should be admitted to Penn & most, if not all, of the lower T-14. Columbia may require a higher LSAT score--especially for scholarship money. Apply early to Penn & the lower T-14, wait until you receive a higher LSAT score to apply to Columbia.

P.S. Definitely apply to Cornell with your numbers.

[Big Dog]

Would taking a third time and getting 170~172 make a noticeable difference in my chances of getting in?

Yes, three points would be huge for CCN.

[trqdor]

in a similar boat with the next retake being the third. i also have similar numbers (my gpa is a little better, but your lsat trumps mine by a significant amount, though our goals are similar). i've decided on taking it in october instead of december, and submitting applications in november for two reasons. (1) i want to RELAX AND CELEBRATE come thanksgiving time for the first time in months (i plan to submit applications as soon as the october scores come back late oct/early nov); and (2) having to think about applications and studying for the lsat and having a full time job is too much for me. i'd rather focus on the test now, kill it on oct 3, and then switch gears to writing personal statements and supplements while i wait for the score.

your case is a bit different because you have a much more competitive lsat score than i do. but even if i were in your shoes, i would hold off from getting (unnecessarily) deep in the application process now precisely because applying now doesn't give you much of an advantage over applying any other time before thanksgiving (or so i hear). i have, however, reached out to recommenders and asked them to start drafting letters for me.

in the event that you are confident - and i do mean really confident - you won't be able to perform on oct 3, postpone the testdate to december. considering the deadline to change test dates was today, it appears that you'll have to pay for a new test, but it would be a wise purchase to make. as for me, i'm all in to take the test in october. if i do shitty (again), i'll just sit out another year, wait for lsat retakes reset, and continue to save up for law school.