Michigan State to Michigan Law Transfer Scenario Forum

[judgepayne]

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[runinthefront]

https://www.law.umich.edu/aboutus/Docum ... -31-56.pdf

They only took two transfers from MSU last year. Probably top 5% of the class. Don't assume this will be you.

[judgepayne]

No reason not to try! Thanks for the pdf

[Sideshow Raheem]

Don't attend a law school you wouldn't be content to graduate from. What are your career goals OP? If they involve something that would be unattainable if you don't do well enough to transfer to Michigan, you should seriously consider retaking and reapplying next cycle. Less than half of MSU's Class of 2014 was able to secure full-time, long-term legal employment nine months after graduation. Even on a full ride, that's a big risk.

[Kinky John]

All of this to say, I am putting in a lot of effort to get a head of the game come exam time at MSU.

Why not put half that effort into retaking the LSAT? You were already pt'ing high 160's.

Everything about your plan is risky

[lavarman84]

OP, you might finish at the top of your class. You may not. Michigan State is a low T2 school which means, as a poster above pointed out, you likely need to finish in the top 5% (possibly even higher) of your 1L class to transfer to Michigan. That's going to be difficult. Working the hardest doesn't guarantee you'll be at the top of the class. And it might lead you to burning out. Also, working part time during 1L is likely not going to be a positive for your grades.

Because of the curve in law school, studying your butt off only means so much. Not every person that works extremely hard can get an A.

I recommend you take a year off and retake the LSAT. If you are willing to work that hard prepping for law school and in law school, you can work that hard on your LSAT prep. And that'll possibly push you up into Michigan's range. Or, at minimum, you might be able to attend a school far better than Michigan State.(if you choose to)

[judgepayne]

Hey guys thanks for the responses. I'm going to stay in MI for school. Id rather go here than Wayne. Yes, upon consideration working during the semester will probably not pan out. That's fine.

I'm not revoking the acceptance at this point so all I can do is try and do well- transfer in mind or not.

If anyone has productive advice in that pursuit i would really appreciate it. Success stories are out there. I do not in any way feel entitled to being a candidate for transfer.

This is the situation I'm in and at the very least it is free. I will post here in the following months to let others see how it all goes.

[Mack.Hambleton]

MSU is a terrible law school. LESS THAN HALF of their graduates are able to land any long-term, full-time legal jobs. ANY job as a full time lawyer.

Wayne state is a better law school, but only marginally.

There's a 95% chance you won't be able to transfer to UofM and a 50%+ chance you won't even have a job as a lawyer after three years of law school (which is not a fun experience in and of itself).

Either retake or don't go.

http://www.lstscorereports.com/schools/msu/2014/

[Sideshow Raheem]

It's not too late to withdraw. Look at it this way: if you answer five more LSAT questions correctly, you'll get into Michigan right off the bat, likely with $$, and not have to worry about finishing in the top 5% at MSU in order to transfer. Especially given where you were PT'ing that seems very possible. Use your contacts at the Lansing firm to try to get a job as a legal assistant there for the next year while studying/reapplying; it'll look good on your resume for OCI and can also help give you an idea of whether you would like being a lawyer.

[Mack.Hambleton]

Also just because you're not paying tuition doesn't mean you're not giving anything up or going for free.

You've got tens of thousands in cost of living for three years.

Three years of employment, so the money there and any advancements in a career you could make in three years.

And at the end you have a TTT law school on your resume , which will hurt you if you decide to try and find any non-legal job.

[lavarman84]

Hey guys thanks for the responses. I'm going to stay in MI for school. Id rather go here than Wayne. Yes, upon consideration working during the semester will probably not pan out. That's fine.

I'm not revoking the acceptance at this point so all I can do is try and do well- transfer in mind or not.

If anyone has productive advice in that pursuit i would really appreciate it. Success stories are out there. I do not in any way feel entitled to being a candidate for transfer.

This is the situation I'm in and at the very least it is free. I will post here in the following months to let others see how it all goes.

It is your choice. I wish you luck. I don't think there's going to be much productive advice that hasn't already been given. Finish at the top of your class if you want to transfer to Michigan. If you want advice on law school in general, this thread has links to a lot of it:
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... =4&t=26949

Best advice I can give is to know yourself. Advice from other people will help but ultimately, you know yourself and you know what your strengths and weaknesses are. Trust yourself and do things in a way that best suit you.

I can tell you that I finished at the top of my 1L class without any of the TLS guides or any 0L prep.(I didn't know TLS existed until after my 1L year) I worked hard and I trusted myself. I didn't pay attention to what my classmates were doing. I didn't try to study more than them. I didn't try to study the way they did. I did things the way that made sense to me and I focused on doing the best I could. So that's my advice to you. Don't worry about your classmates. Compete against yourself. Do your best and do things the way they make sense to you. And it'll hopefully work out.

However, do pay attention to your professors. Because you need to tailor your exam to them since they're the ones grading it.

[judgepayne]

Ok, I got my fall semester grades back:

torts: A
civ pro: A
legal writing: A
contracts: A-
3.91

I'm about to submit early decision apps for Chicago and Georgetown. It seems like Chicago is a longshot no matter what your grades are from a T2, but might as well try. UofM would be great still, but I need some security if I can get in ED.

On LSAC it says Georgetown is binding, even though everyone on here says it's not. So do you just have to pay the $1600?- that still sucks but I might have to, since I know how tough Chicago ED is. What do you guys think?

[Tls2016]

Ok, I got my fall semester grades back:

torts: A
civ pro: A
legal writing: A
contracts: A-
3.91

I'm about to submit early decision apps for Chicago and Georgetown. It seems like Chicago is a longshot no matter what your grades are from a T2, but might as well try. UofM would be great still, but I need some security if I can get in ED.

On LSAC it says Georgetown is binding, even though everyone on here says it's not. So do you just have to pay the $1600?- that still sucks but I might have to, since I know how tough Chicago ED is. What do you guys think?

Congrats on the grades.
I'm a little confused about your transferring because you said you wanted to stay in Michigan? Did you change your mind?
I don't know where you get the $1600 figure from, is that supposed to be for Georgetown?
Early decision at Georgetown isn't binding and the application costs $85. It's all explained in their website.

[Maplesyrup]

Ok, I got my fall semester grades back:

torts: A
civ pro: A
legal writing: A
contracts: A-
3.91

I'm about to submit early decision apps for Chicago and Georgetown. It seems like Chicago is a longshot no matter what your grades are from a T2, but might as well try. UofM would be great still, but I need some security if I can get in ED.

On LSAC it says Georgetown is binding, even though everyone on here says it's not. So do you just have to pay the $1600?- that still sucks but I might have to, since I know how tough Chicago ED is. What do you guys think?

you rock, good luck

[reasonableperson]

Ok, I got my fall semester grades back:

torts: A
civ pro: A
legal writing: A
contracts: A-
3.91

I'm about to submit early decision apps for Chicago and Georgetown. It seems like Chicago is a longshot no matter what your grades are from a T2, but might as well try. UofM would be great still, but I need some security if I can get in ED.

On LSAC it says Georgetown is binding, even though everyone on here says it's not. So do you just have to pay the $1600?- that still sucks but I might have to, since I know how tough Chicago ED is. What do you guys think?

I would pay the deposit. You never know with your other transfers, but GULC takes 100+ a year and you're sure to get in there.
Grats on the grades.

[judgepayne]

Ok, I got my fall semester grades back:

torts: A
civ pro: A
legal writing: A
contracts: A-
3.91

I'm about to submit early decision apps for Chicago and Georgetown. It seems like Chicago is a longshot no matter what your grades are from a T2, but might as well try. UofM would be great still, but I need some security if I can get in ED.

On LSAC it says Georgetown is binding, even though everyone on here says it's not. So do you just have to pay the $1600?- that still sucks but I might have to, since I know how tough Chicago ED is. What do you guys think?

Congrats on the grades.
I'm a little confused about your transferring because you said you wanted to stay in Michigan? Did you change your mind?
I don't know where you get the $1600 figure from, is that supposed to be for Georgetown?
Early decision at Georgetown isn't binding and the application costs $85. It's all explained in their website.

I'm not sure what to tell you. On their website it is vague. On the LSAC it says "Early Decision is binding. Because offers of admission extended under the Early Decision process are binding, candidates may not apply to other law schools under similar Early Decision processes." However, this may only be about regular admissions applicants. I have no idea, maybe I will call them? lol. Look around TLS and you will see some people talking about eating the $1,600.

[Tls2016]

https://www.law.georgetown.edu/admissio ... Action.cfm

It says Early Action is non binding. You should be looking at the transfers page.

Maybe the $1600 lost is from a seat deposit while waiting on other schools. No idea.

[beantheshadow]

I was in the same situation as you last year. I was looking at $120,000 dollars in debt with everyone I know just saying accept the offer because Lawyers make a shit ton of money and the investment will be worth it. LOLOLOLOLOOL

I even put the first deposit down.... but TLS showed me the light. They showed me the risk I was getting my family in financially by accepting. So I decided to sit back and re-take. My score went from 150 to 168. So re-take and Law School will still be there next year!

[judgepayne]

I was in the same situation as you last year. I was looking at $120,000 dollars in debt with everyone I know just saying accept the offer because Lawyers make a shit ton of money and the investment will be worth it. LOLOLOLOLOOL

I even put the first deposit down.... but TLS showed me the light. They showed me the risk I was getting my family in financially by accepting. So I decided to sit back and re-take. My score went from 150 to 168. So re-take and Law School will still be there next year!

This is about transferring.

[yenisey]

I was in the same situation as you last year. I was looking at $120,000 dollars in debt with everyone I know just saying accept the offer because Lawyers make a shit ton of money and the investment will be worth it. LOLOLOLOLOOL

I even put the first deposit down.... but TLS showed me the light. They showed me the risk I was getting my family in financially by accepting. So I decided to sit back and re-take. My score went from 150 to 168. So re-take and Law School will still be there next year!

150 to 168! Terrific! How did you accomplish it?

[judgepayne]

Just wanted to update my situation on this thread for anyone who follows a similar path.

I've paid the first deposit for Georgetown ($600). The second deposit is due June 1st and I think its a bit more. I am still waiting for Chicago ED. I can't believe they haven't responded yet, but maybe I will hear something tomorrow? (I've seen that they update on Fridays). Funny thing, I called Chicago to make sure they did have all my application materials (there was some confusion at one point), then I tried to verify that the response would be delivered by June 1st. The woman on the phone says: "that's not what the website says, the website says 'all decisions will be rendered by the end of May.'"
lol.

Anyway, starting to get grades back and the most difficult one - property - was an A. So idk if I should apply to some other law schools that weren't early decision? Idk, I'm pretty tired of the process, plus I'm working full time now. Hopefully Chicago just gets back and clears up my life. I wasn't interviewed though so that's a bad sign.

[ronanOgara]

Have you thought about staying put? You'll have no debt and likely be at the top of your class. That might put you in a favorable spot.

Sounds like you have a job for the summer? You said you wanted to stay in Michigan so I'm confused about Georgetown. I don't see the point of transferring to gtown and racking up debt if you're doing well academically and financially at MSU. All comes down to what you want to do.

[judgepayne]

Here's an update.
First sem: A,A,A,A-
Second sem: A-,A-,A, A, B (1 credit 4 weeks class where grading was seemingly random)
3.85ish GPA

Paid the full $1,600 to hold Georgetown. Deferred at Chigago (the B is probably going to ruin that). Just applied to Michigan; probably the best choice in terms of saving money and having more support. Not sure if I will get in there.

[magicmagic]

Have you thought about staying put? You'll have no debt and likely be at the top of your class. That might put you in a favorable spot.

I thought this too. Sticker for Georgetown (or even Chicago) is a tough sell. Unless you want academia or biglaw, it might not be worth it to transfer.

Anyway, good job this year, and good luck!

[judgepayne]

Have you thought about staying put? You'll have no debt and likely be at the top of your class. That might put you in a favorable spot.

I thought this too. Sticker for Georgetown (or even Chicago) is a tough sell. Unless you want academia or biglaw, it might not be worth it to transfer.

Anyway, good job this year, and good luck!

Yes, there is no clear answer on this. I want to try to get a biglaw job and most seem to agree this is the way to do it. I also got a year free; isn't that basically equivalent to a 1/3rd scholarship to these schools in terms of cost?

I'm taking the summer to work and consider this big decision. Nothing is in stone yet.

Thanks.