HLS: retake LSAT after 3.5 years? Forum

[biglll]

I rely on your wisdom, TLS! Please, advise me on the right strategy.

Situation:
- International applicant, Eastern Europe, foreign undergrad
- Took LSAT 2 times in '09-'10, scored 162 and 169, applied to T6, rejected
- Since then had pretty cool work experience, recently admitted to Harvard Business School
- Now want to make my dream come true and pursue a joint degree with HLS. Yes, strong professional need in both.

So, my questions are:
- Shall I invest in retaking the LSAT? I think if I work my ass off, I can get it 3-6 points higher.
- If I retake the LSAT this fall, will HLS consider my latest score, or take the average?
- How much HBS reputation will matter for HLS? E.g., does it make sense to wait with my application until the end of the semester to obtain a LOR from an HBS prof?
- Any other points to take into consideration?

Thank you soooo much in advance.

[pupshaw]

Definitely retake. 169 is probably not going to cut it. If you can improve your LSAT, given that you were able to get in to HBS, I imagine you've got a shot. Don't know specifically about going HBS --> HLS, but I do know some people who went the other direction, and conventional wisdom is that there's at least some boost.

[TripTrip]

Definitely retake.

[VegasLaw702]

Definitely retake.

[biglll]

Ok guys, thank you for your input so far. I understand that the convention is to retake (shouldn't have doubted it actually:)).

Now what about my 2 other questions:
- will HLS average the scores, or use the latest (given the 3.5Y gap)? I'm trying to realistically estimate my chances, as retaking with an upside is a huge investment for me, non-native speaker.
- does it make sense to wait until the end of fall semester with the application, assuming I could obtain a (good) HBS transcript and a fresh LOR from a prof in Finance/Accounting etc? Currently I have 2 old LORs from law professors in file, and I can get one fresh LOR from my employer.

Any ideas?

[TripTrip]

will HLS average the scores, or use the latest (given the 3.5Y gap)? I'm trying to realistically estimate my chances, as retaking with an upside is a huge investment for me, non-native speaker.

No school averages LSAT scores. Someone who retook a 169 to get a 173 will always outperform someone who only took the test once and got a 172.

does it make sense to wait until the end of fall semester with the application, assuming I could obtain a (good) HBS transcript and a fresh LOR from a prof in Finance/Accounting etc? Currently I have 2 old LORs from law professors in file, and I can get one fresh LOR from my employer.

Any ideas?

No. The "freshness" of an LOR is completely irrelevant. An early application will help you much more than a "fresh" LOR since the class will be half filled already if you wait until December.

[jmjm]

I rely on your wisdom, TLS! Please, advise me on the right strategy.

Situation:
- International applicant, Eastern Europe, foreign undergrad
- Took LSAT 2 times in '09-'10, scored 162 and 169, applied to T6, rejected
- Since then had pretty cool work experience, recently admitted to Harvard Business School
- Now want to make my dream come true and pursue a joint degree with HLS. Yes, strong professional need in both.

So, my questions are:
- Shall I invest in retaking the LSAT? I think if I work my ass off, I can get it 3-6 points higher.
- If I retake the LSAT this fall, will HLS consider my latest score, or take the average?
- How much HBS reputation will matter for HLS? E.g., does it make sense to wait with my application until the end of the semester to obtain a LOR from an HBS prof?
- Any other points to take into consideration?

Thank you soooo much in advance.

Congrats on the hbs admit! awesome job there. Can you share your work experience and stats? For international applicants law schools employ CAS evaluation to categorize the gpa. Unlike hbs, hls places more emphasis on stats than other factors.

[dawyzest1]

I know you're going to yell at me, but why in the world do you need the HLS degree to go with your HBS MBA? *Cue recorder*: The HBS MBA could legitimately be considered to be the most valuable credential in the world. *Stop recorder* I'm not trying to be difficult, I'm an MBA and soon to be at HLS myself, so I understand why someone would do this. I am always curious to learn other folks' reasons.

Back to reality: I can report with all seriousness that business school grading is a joke, so your HBS grades, unless you're a Baker Scholar, aren't going to help you. Same thing for the HBS LOR. I wouldn't be surprised if being at HBS got you a tiny, tiny nudge in admissions, but your LSAT is definitely going to have to get into the 170s.

[rebexness]

will HLS average the scores, or use the latest (given the 3.5Y gap)? I'm trying to realistically estimate my chances, as retaking with an upside is a huge investment for me, non-native speaker.

No school averages LSAT scores. Someone who retook a 169 to get a 173 will always outperform someone who only took the test once and got a 172. .

That isn't true.

[TripTrip]

will HLS average the scores, or use the latest (given the 3.5Y gap)? I'm trying to realistically estimate my chances, as retaking with an upside is a huge investment for me, non-native speaker.

No school averages LSAT scores. Someone who retook a 169 to get a 173 will always outperform someone who only took the test once and got a 172. .

That isn't true.

It is as long as 173 is median.

[The Brainalist]

One point higher and OP could be in the running for UPenn/Wharton.

But, if OP can just do the LLM from somewhere like Cornell and get the HBS degree now, I'm not sure why that wouldn't be just as good. JD/MBA programs take 4 years, while getting the Harvard business degree and an LLM from a marketable, maybe lower Ivy law school would only take 3.

[rebexness]

will HLS average the scores, or use the latest (given the 3.5Y gap)? I'm trying to realistically estimate my chances, as retaking with an upside is a huge investment for me, non-native speaker.

No school averages LSAT scores. Someone who retook a 169 to get a 173 will always outperform someone who only took the test once and got a 172. .

That isn't true.

It is as long as 173 is median.

I know a lot of retakers who would disagree with you.

[dawyzest1]

One point higher and OP could be in the running for UPenn/Wharton.

But, if OP can just do the LLM from somewhere like Cornell and get the HBS degree now, I'm not sure why that wouldn't be just as good. JD/MBA programs take 4 years, while getting the Harvard business degree and an LLM from a marketable, maybe lower Ivy law school would only take 3.

This is where it gets tricky. With b-schools, yeah its HSW, but really, its HS, W. You're giving too much on the b-school side. I think OP has to take the HBS MBA, it's like getting into Yale Law School, you just don't pass it up.

[amc987]

I know a lot of retakers who would disagree with you.

This. HLS is one of the only schools that does care about applicants' lower LSAT scores. The language on Harvard's website speaks to this as does anecdotal evidence from retakers who've had a harder time getting into Harvard than their numbers suggest they should. The site reads: The LSAT need be taken only once. If you take the test more than once, all scores and their average will be reported and considered.

Whether Harvard will give much weight to the lower scores after a 3.5 year break from testing is anyone's guess. It probably depends a lot on how much you improve on the retake. If you get 171 or 172, HLS would probably be more likely to average than if you get 179/180. I don't think having a 169 on your record would hurt too much either way, though. Having multiple scores in the 160s is more of a blip, but it's not dispositive. I'm sure plenty of others have gotten in after having taken the test 3 times.

[TrustInMusic]

Congrats on the HBS acceptance and retake.

[3ThrowAway99]

Enjoy HBS, and forget law. Jus sayin

[Dr. Dre]

Don't go to lawl skewl