C&F: Well I just pretty much f***ed myself. Forum

Favre4Prez · Post by **Favre4Prez** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:22 pm

I hadn't even remembered this incident until yesterday. But when I was a freshman and in high school and 15 years old, I was on my school's cross country team. Our coach sent us out on a run. We set out on the run and were running in a part of town under construction because we could run on the dirt roads. There was no sign saying that no one was permitted and there was an area that was an opening in the fence. Thus, being a dumb freshman, I followed the captains who were leading the team. There were 7 of us running, and all of a sudden, there is a cop car on the road who turns his lights on. Five out of the seven of us guys on the team bolt and run into the brush where the cop car can't go. Myself and another teammate stop because we don't think it is a good idea to run from a cop car and want to cooperate and weren't sure what we had done wrong. The cop saw us is our short shorts and it was fairly obvious we were engaged in aerobic activity and even made a conscious decision not to run away from him. He gets out of his car and makes us put our hands on the car and asks us if we have any weapons. We say no and explain that we were just running through here and how we are on the school's cross country team. So he says "I am placing you guys under arrest." He makes us go in the car and doesn't handcuff us or anything like that. He asks us where our coach is, and then he drives with us in the cop car 1 mile away to the part of the park where our coach is waiting for us to finish the run. We get out of the car with the cop and the cop walks us over to our coach and he explains how running in that area is trespassing and how our team is not permitted to run there anymore. He gets into an argument/screaming match with our coach and explains that we could have been charged with a crime, and then he let us go. The two of us were never accused or charged with anything, never booked, never arrested, never brought to a police station or anything like that, but he did take our names. The whole incident lasted 15 minutes. In the jurisdiction where this occurred, individuals who are "under arrest" always have to be taken to the central discharge station and undergo a bunch of processing, mugshots, medical, etc. None of this stuff happened to us. My parents overreacted and filed a formal complaint and the cop was relocated because apparently he had a history of this type of conduct.

Here is where I am worried. Under my state's law, you are under arrest simply by virtue of your freedom of free movement being taken away in any way, shape, or form. I am not so naive as to believe that you have to be booked, read your Miranda Rights, etc. I have gotten into my dream school, but I am terrified though now that I risk either losing my spot or never being able to practice after I pour an obscene amount of money into a legal education. The application reads "have you ever been arrested?" Plus it's messed up that by choosing to cooperate fully with the cop, I had to deal with this. In all honesty, I was 15. And this was such a minor and remote incident, that I didn't even think to disclose it and hadn't thought about it in years. Other than this, I have never gotten into any trouble with the law (not even a traffic ticket). How should I go about handling this? I am really terrified, and now, whereas I should be excited about starting law school (I took a year in between undergrad and law school), now I just want to sit on the couch and cry.

Ludo! · Post by **Ludo!** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:25 pm

I can't imagine this will hurt you but send in an addendum to the school right away. Explain the situation (preferably in a shorter version than you gave here) and be honest. I don't think you're fucked, just make sure you take care of it now

in2win · Post by **in2win** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:28 pm

as someone with real criminal arrests who is trying to become a lawyer, i find it offensive that you would actually think this would be a huge problem and that you have fucked yourself

Favre4Prez · Post by **Favre4Prez** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:29 pm

in2win wrote:as someone with real criminal arrests who is trying to become a lawyer, i find it offensive that you would actually think this would be a huge problem and that you have fucked yourself

I am sorry you are offended.

rinkrat19 · Post by **rinkrat19** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:29 pm

If the cop never even took down your name, I can't believe that counts as being under arrest.

I personally think you'd be fine without mentioning it (since the cop never even had your name, right?) But if it will allow you to get off the couch and stop crying

, cut out all the drama and hand-wringing and make it clear that you were never booked and send it to the schools. They won't care.

ben4847 · Post by **ben4847** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:31 pm

I agree with above poster that it is probably good idea to get it on table now. (See the thread about the guy dismissed from a T14 for some minor non disclosure reason, where it was clearly excuse to get rid of him for other reasons.)

To be a jerk though, I don't believe that you didn't remember this incident when you checked the box that asked: "Have you ever been arrested?"

Also, when a cop pulls you over for having a broken taillight, your freedom of movement is also restricted--but that is not arrest. There must be some more to the definition for these purposes.

ben4847 · Post by **ben4847** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:32 pm

rinkrat19 wrote:
I personally think you'd be fine without mentioning it (since the cop never even had your name, right?)

There is a record from the complaint they filed.

rinkrat19 · Post by **rinkrat19** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:34 pm

ben4847 wrote:
rinkrat19 wrote:
I personally think you'd be fine without mentioning it (since the cop never even had your name, right?)
There is a record from the complaint they filed.

Ok, there's a record of parents making a complaint, which obviously would mention the kid. There's no record of the kid getting arrested/detained/booked/whatever by the cop.

Ludo! · Post by **Ludo!** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:36 pm

For the record I think it's a silly thing to be worried about too but I've seen so many paranoid posts like this that it doesn't even phase me anymore. If it will make OP feel better he should just disclose it to the school now since there is virtually no chance it will affect his admission

ben4847 · Post by **ben4847** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:37 pm

rinkrat19 wrote:
ben4847 wrote:
rinkrat19 wrote:
I personally think you'd be fine without mentioning it (since the cop never even had your name, right?)
There is a record from the complaint they filed.
Ok, there's a record of parents making a complaint, which obviously would mention the kid. There's no record of the kid getting arrested/detained/booked/whatever by the cop.

guess it matters what the complaint says

aekea · Post by **aekea** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:38 pm

rinkrat19 wrote:
ben4847 wrote:
rinkrat19 wrote:
I personally think you'd be fine without mentioning it (since the cop never even had your name, right?)
There is a record from the complaint they filed.
Ok, there's a record of parents making a complaint, which obviously would mention the kid. There's no record of the kid getting arrested/detained/booked/whatever by the cop.

Fabre4Prez wrote:The two of us were never accused or charged with anything, never booked, never arrested, never brought to a police station or anything like that, but he did take our names.

Just to clarify, he did say that the police officer took his name down.

I.P. Daly · Post by **I.P. Daly** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:39 pm

OP, you may want to contact the school for a clarification of what they mean by "arrested."

rinkrat19 wrote:If the cop never even took down your name, I can't believe that counts as being under arrest.

You might be getting "arrest" confused with "charged."

An "arrest" depends on the jurisdiction. A general definition of arrest is: the taking, seizing or detaining of the person of another, accomplished by (1) touching or putting hands on the person to be detained; (2) or by any act that indicates an intention to take him into custody and that subjects him to the actual control and will of the person making the arrest; or (3) by the consent of the person to be arrested.

RedBirds2011 · Post by **RedBirds2011** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:49 pm

Favre4Prez wrote:I hadn't even remembered this incident until yesterday. But when I was a freshman and in high school and 15 years old, I was on my school's cross country team. Our coach sent us out on a run. We set out on the run and were running in a part of town under construction because we could run on the dirt roads. There was no sign saying that no one was permitted and there was an area that was an opening in the fence. Thus, being a dumb freshman, I followed the captains who were leading the team. There were 7 of us running, and all of a sudden, there is a cop car on the road who turns his lights on. Five out of the seven of us guys on the team bolt and run into the brush where the cop car can't go. Myself and another teammate stop because we don't think it is a good idea to run from a cop car and want to cooperate and weren't sure what we had done wrong. The cop saw us is our short shorts and it was fairly obvious we were engaged in aerobic activity and even made a conscious decision not to run away from him. He gets out of his car and makes us put our hands on the car and asks us if we have any weapons. We say no and explain that we were just running through here and how we are on the school's cross country team. So he says "I am placing you guys under arrest." He makes us go in the car and doesn't handcuff us or anything like that. He asks us where our coach is, and then he drives with us in the cop car 1 mile away to the part of the park where our coach is waiting for us to finish the run. We get out of the car with the cop and the cop walks us over to our coach and he explains how running in that area is trespassing and how our team is not permitted to run there anymore. He gets into an argument/screaming match with our coach and explains that we could have been charged with a crime, and then he let us go. The two of us were never accused or charged with anything, never booked, never arrested, never brought to a police station or anything like that, but he did take our names. The whole incident lasted 15 minutes. In the jurisdiction where this occurred, individuals who are "under arrest" always have to be taken to the central discharge station and undergo a bunch of processing, mugshots, medical, etc. None of this stuff happened to us. My parents overreacted and filed a formal complaint and the cop was relocated because apparently he had a history of this type of conduct.

Here is where I am worried. Under my state's law, you are under arrest simply by virtue of your freedom of free movement being taken away in any way, shape, or form. I am not so naive as to believe that you have to be booked, read your Miranda Rights, etc. I have gotten into my dream school, but I am terrified though now that I risk either losing my spot or never being able to practice after I pour an obscene amount of money into a legal education. The application reads "have you ever been arrested?" Plus it's messed up that by choosing to cooperate fully with the cop, I had to deal with this. In all honesty, I was 15. And this was such a minor and remote incident, that I didn't even think to disclose it and hadn't thought about it in years. Other than this, I have never gotten into any trouble with the law (not even a traffic ticket). How should I go about handling this? I am really terrified, and now, whereas I should be excited about starting law school (I took a year in between undergrad and law school), now I just want to sit on the couch and cry.

Relax. You are getting way way too worked up over absolutely nothing. I have a DUI on my record and the BAR C and F informed me it's very unlikely to keep me from being admitted. Just be candid and sincere.

Edit: if you already sent your app, be sure to send an addendum to the admissions committee to be on the safe side. Disclose it and then relax and breath easy. No reason to fret.

CanadianWolf · Post by **CanadianWolf** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:52 pm

It won't hurt you; it's not like you're an internet stalker or something ultra creepy & psychotic like that.

Ludo! · Post by **Ludo!** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 3:57 pm

CanadianWolf wrote:It won't hurt you; it's not like you're an internet stalker or something ultra creepy & psychotic like that.

I don't stalk you you idiot. You post in every fucking thread. The day you see me posting in a thread about canadian law schools or doing shitlaw in Florida or whatever the hell it is you actually know something about, then you'll know I'm stalking you.

thederangedwang · Post by **thederangedwang** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 4:00 pm

Ludovico Technique wrote:
CanadianWolf wrote:It won't hurt you; it's not like you're an internet stalker or something ultra creepy & psychotic like that.
I don't stalk you you idiot. You post in every fucking thread. The day you see me posting in a thread about canadian law schools or doing shitlaw in Florida or whatever the hell it is you actually know something about, then you'll know I'm stalking you.

inside insult?

Ludo! · Post by **Ludo!** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 4:02 pm

thederangedwang wrote:
Ludovico Technique wrote:
CanadianWolf wrote:It won't hurt you; it's not like you're an internet stalker or something ultra creepy & psychotic like that.
I don't stalk you you idiot. You post in every fucking thread. The day you see me posting in a thread about canadian law schools or doing shitlaw in Florida or whatever the hell it is you actually know something about, then you'll know I'm stalking you.
inside insult?

Yeah he posts terrible advice in threads where he has absolutely no personal experience and when I call him out on it he accuses me of stalking him. He also accused me of being Paul Pless

CanadianWolf · Post by **CanadianWolf** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 4:03 pm

Sensitive ? Plessian anger ? I just wish that you'd quit stalking me. Besides, if you were an actual law student, you'd be a little more concerned about C&F's view of stalking.

AreJay711 · Post by **AreJay711** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 4:04 pm

rinkrat19 wrote:[I}f it will allow you to get off the couch and stop crying , cut out all the drama and hand-wringing and make it clear that you were never booked and send it to the schools. They won't care.

This. Even if you had been arrested, charged, and convicted of criminal trespass by some fluke of the legal system it wouldn't matter.

howlery · Post by **howlery** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 7:18 pm

It depends on what C&F's definition of "is" is.

(I'd disclose. You seem to come out looking the victim anyway considering what happened to the cop.)

Clearly · Post by **Clearly** » Sat Apr 21, 2012 4:05 am

Is this a joke? As another who has big boy character and fitness issues to worry about, it really is kind of insulting to freak out on this. I have felony arrests to explain, and I'm not freaking out, grow up.

eandy · Post by **eandy** » Sat Apr 21, 2012 4:14 am

Schools won't care at all. Most schools will even let you disclose during orientation/the first week anything you may have forgotten without penalty (provided it's not murder or something ridiculous

). So just go ahead and send it and don't worry.

elterrible78 · Post by **elterrible78** » Sat Apr 21, 2012 4:22 am

ben4847 wrote:
rinkrat19 wrote:
I personally think you'd be fine without mentioning it (since the cop never even had your name, right?)
There is a record from the complaint they filed.

tl;dr version: There is no way the school is ever going to find out about this, and considering you were never processed, they probably wouldn't consider you to have "lied" about your arrest history even if they did. By all means, write an addendum if it helps you sleep at night, but to say you "pretty much fucked yourself" is ridiculous hyperbole.

tl version: It doesn't really matter. I'm a criminal analyst, and I do background checks on people all...the...time. I have no idea which "dream school" you are talking about, and I also have no idea how or to what degree schools look into your past. I would be very, very surprised if (regarding criminal history, at least) it extended beyond doing a criminal records check, and this little incident clearly would not show up on that. Really, for them to find out about this, they would have to contact the actual law enforcement agency (sound like local cops in this case) and ask someone there to look through police reports to see if your name comes up. Considering many admitted law students have probably lived in various municipalities, counties, states, and even countries, this level of detail in investigation would almost certainly be prohibitively time-intensive with very few results. I hold a TS clearance with the DoD, and I am certain the investigation that took place to clear me did not involve an investigator calling every possible law enforcement agency in every place I had ever lived to ask them to check all their files to see if anything turned up.

SunshineMagic · Post by **SunshineMagic** » Sat Apr 21, 2012 11:45 am

JamMasterJ · Post by **JamMasterJ** » Sat Apr 21, 2012 11:50 am

It's always best to disclose stuff, but no, you're totally fine

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