Berkeley's Fall 2010 Medians Drop Forum

[im_blue]

Berkeley is the first T14 to release their Fall 2010 class medians:

2010: 3.64 - 3.80 - 3.88, 163 - 167 - 170
2009: 3.68 - 3.83 - 3.95, 165 - 168 - 170

2010: 8,313 apps (4.4% increase)
2009: 7,960 apps

[Kswizzie]

ooooh baby. Finally they are coming to their senses the best kind of people get 168s

[5ky]

T13. Nobody wants to pay 80k a year for law school, Boalt.

[Knock]

Berkeley is the first T14 to release their Fall 2010 class medians:

2010: 3.64 - 3.80 - 3.88, 163 - 167 - 170
2009: 3.68 - 3.83 - 3.95, 165 - 168 - 170

2010: 8,313 apps (4.4% increase)
2009: 7,960 apps

Sweet. Hopefully this is across the board, although I doubt it.

Im_blue is bringing TLS some valuable information. Thanks!

Edit: interesting: "From the Art World: Aspiring thespians, artists, photographers, dancers, vocalists, and musicians, including an opera singer, a member of a gamelan orchestra, 3 professional ballet dancers (one a principal with the San Francisco Ballet), members of at least 3 different touring and recorded bands, 3 professional actors, a radio commercial voice-over performer, a lead performer from the Broadway production of “Stomp”, a concert pianist, a fire performance artist, and a member of the LA Lakers dance team."

Let's just say Berkeley may see strong consideration from me

[IzziesGal]

It's not 80k a year. And the degree is worth the money. I am looking at only east coast firms - ny, boston, dc, nj, and pa - and I can attest to berkeley's national reach. If anyone wants specifics, PM me for details.

[allidoiswin]

2010: 3.64 - 3.80 - 3.88, 163 - 167 - 170
2009: 3.68 - 3.83 - 3.95, 165 - 168 - 170

2010: 8,313 apps (4.4% increase)
2009: 7,960 apps

Which one of the following, if true, most helps to resolve the paradox?

a) Boalt Law has traditionally has taken a holistic approach, giving extracurriculars as much weight as the one's GPA and LSAT score.
b) Boalt law school advertised more heavily this year than in years past and thus became a more popular school in terms of applications.
c) Attributable at least partially to the recent economic downturn, fewer statistically top-notch applicants are willing pass on meritorious scholarships from lesser or equally ranked schools to attend Boalt at full tuition.
d) This year Boalt law school, traditionally known for being attracted to high GPAs, was focused on raising its LSAT mean for the incoming class and less concerned with its GPA mean among entering students.
e) Stanford, a typically more highly regarded law school located close to Boalt law, attracted more applications this year than in years past.

[ArchRoark]

2010: 3.64 - 3.80 - 3.88, 163 - 167 - 170
2009: 3.68 - 3.83 - 3.95, 165 - 168 - 170

2010: 8,313 apps (4.4% increase)
2009: 7,960 apps

Which one of the following, if true, most helps to resolve the paradox?

a) Boalt Law had more international applicants this year than in years past.
b) Boalt law school advertised more heavily this year than in years past and thus became a more popular school to which applicants applied.
c) Attributable at least partially to the recent economic downturn, fewer statistically top-notch applicants are willing pass on meritorious scholarships from lesser or equally ranked schools to attend Boalt at full tuition.
d) This year Boalt law school, traditionally known for being attracted to high GPAs, was focused on raising its LSAT mean for the incoming class and less concerned with its GPA mean among entering students.
e) Stanford, a typically more highly regarded law school located close to Boalt law, attracted more applications this year than in years past.

C

[allidoiswin]

haha good job ^...but it's only a one star question!

[5ky]

It's not 80k a year. And the degree is worth the money. I am looking at only east coast firms - ny, boston, dc, nj, and pa - and I can attest to berkeley's national reach. If anyone wants specifics, PM me for details.

http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... 4&t=116667

http://www.law.berkeley.edu/6943.htm

74k, sorry. That's just a little too rich for a lot of people's blood, I know it weighed heavily on my decision.

[Hannibal]

Holy shit. I'm in state and I would not go to Boalt even if the next highest were out of T14.

[094320]

..

[Knock]

Holy shit. I'm in state and I would not go to Boalt even if the next highest were out of T14.

Hmm...well to compare to some other schools:

Boalt Hall Non-Resident
Tuition: $52,244.50
Tuition+ Expenses:$74,047.50

University of Virginia Non-Resident
Tuition: $47,500
Tuition + Expenses: $67,700

Stanford
Tuition: $44,880
Tuition + Expenses: $71,535

Columbia
Tuition: $48,648
Tuition+ Expenses:$74,000

Harvard
Tuition: $ 45,450
Tuition+ Expenses: $70,100

So I guess it's sort of comparable to going to Columbia, except without the high NYC COL to justify it.

And you get the beautiful California weather. That's got to be worth $20,000 a year easy in terms of quality of life .

[SHARK WEEK!]

I'm surprised no one has asked this: Why do you think the medians fell [any theories other than tuition]?

[Hannibal]

Bah, FINE, I'll go to Boalt. But I won't be happy about it!

*Cries over 3.42 GPA*

[tintin]

it's cuz they let me in....

[5ky]

Holy shit. I'm in state and I would not go to Boalt even if the next highest were out of T14.

Hmm...well to compare to some other schools:

Boalt Hall Non-Resident
Tuition: $52,244.50
Tuition+ Expenses:$74,047.50

University of Virginia Non-Resident
Tuition: $47,500
Tuition + Expenses: $67,700

Stanford
Tuition: $44,880
Tuition + Expenses: $71,535

Columbia
Tuition: $48,648
Tuition+ Expenses:$74,000

Harvard
Tuition: $ 45,450
Tuition+ Expenses: $70,100

So I guess it's sort of comparable to going to Columbia, except without the high NYC COL to justify it.

IMO the problem with comparing like this is that H, S, and C are a class (or two classes) above Boalt. As for UVA, it's expensive, but they dole out scholarship money like candy there, which brings the cost down significantly.

edit:

I'm surprised no one has asked this: Why do you think the medians fell [any theories other than tuition]?

I think that ITE, it's a combination of their extremely high tuition rates, combined with the fact that people are now considering NYC BigLaw the "safest" way to get a job, and want an east coast school to help them escape without falling 200k into debt without a job.

But we shall see when the other schools release their numbers. With the increase in apps, though, I just can't see many schools falling in their medians.

[jay115]

Holy shit. I'm in state and I would not go to Boalt even if the next highest were out of T14.

Hmm...well to compare to some other schools:

Boalt Hall Non-Resident
Tuition: $52,244.50
Tuition+ Expenses:$74,047.50

University of Virginia Non-Resident
Tuition: $47,500
Tuition + Expenses: $67,700

Stanford
Tuition: $44,880
Tuition + Expenses: $71,535

Columbia
Tuition: $48,648
Tuition+ Expenses:$74,000

Harvard
Tuition: $ 45,450
Tuition+ Expenses: $70,100

So I guess it's sort of comparable to going to Columbia, except without the high NYC COL to justify it.

And you get the beautiful California weather. That's got to be worth $20,000 a year easy in terms of quality of life .

Berkeley unfortunately does not get to enjoy California's vaunted beautiful weather.

[Hannibal]

Sure it does. It's a little cooler than a little further in, but it's still sunny pretty much every day in the summer.

[drdolittle]

I'm surprised no one has asked this: Why do you think the medians fell [any theories other than tuition]?

Good question. But I'm curious whether these drops are even statistically significant when compared to past year to year fluctuations? And for the LSAT, depending on the exact numbers to the decimal fraction, rounding also might have exaggerated the drops.

[iamcutdacheck]

Holy shit. I'm in state and I would not go to Boalt even if the next highest were out of T14.

Hmm...well to compare to some other schools:

Boalt Hall Non-Resident
Tuition: $52,244.50
Tuition+ Expenses:$74,047.50

University of Virginia Non-Resident
Tuition: $47,500
Tuition + Expenses: $67,700

Stanford
Tuition: $44,880
Tuition + Expenses: $71,535

Columbia
Tuition: $48,648
Tuition+ Expenses:$74,000

Harvard
Tuition: $ 45,450
Tuition+ Expenses: $70,100

So I guess it's sort of comparable to going to Columbia, except without the high NYC COL to justify it.

And you get the beautiful California weather. That's got to be worth $20,000 a year easy in terms of quality of life .

The Bay Area has the best weather in the United States

[jay115]

Sure it does. It's a little cooler than a little further in, but it's still sunny pretty much every day in the summer.

I'm not going to bicker about it - everyone has their own opinion. All I will say is when people visit, I think they might find your observation that Berkeley is "a little cooler" a bit understated and "sunny pretty much everyday" a bit overstated. Setting aside their other differences, I think people are usually referencing Stanford's (or Southern California's) weather when they mention sunny California weather. For reference, I live like a 20 minute BART ride-away from Berkeley.

The Bay Area has the best weather in the United States

I think this is true south of the SF fog bank.

[Hannibal]

Eh? Stanford is kind of foggy and cold isn't it?

The perfect weather is probably the Lafayette area since it's still coolish but the fog gets killed by the Oakland Hills. You could easily live in Lafayette and BART to Berkeley.

ITT: We talk about Bay Area geography

[jay115]

Eh? Stanford is kind of foggy and cold isn't it?

The perfect weather is probably the Lafayette area since it's still coolish but the fog gets killed by the Oakland Hills. You could easily live in Lafayette and BART to Berkeley.

ITT: We talk about Bay Area geography

Palo Alto is foggy? Have you ever been to either campus? This is what Stanford looks like: http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=htt ... x=85&ty=36

And this is Boalt: http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=htt ... x=92&ty=24

I literally just google-imaged both, and I'll let you decide which you think looks sunnier. FYI, tomorrow's weather for Palo Alto is a smooth 75 degrees with minimal cloud cover. Berkeley is more than ten degrees colder at 63 degrees.

Haha, but yes I agree Berkeley's weather is kind of irrelevant to the greater conversation at hand. Tuition at UC schools is insane.

[General Tso]

Berkeley AM is like june gloom in SoCal...often the fog will clear in the afternoon but reappear in the late evening.

Also I don't know many young people who would want to live in an uppity suburb like Lafayette.

[Total Litigator]

My family lives in Berkely. Berkeley is not California weather. Due to whatever geographical anomoalies (mountains, the bay, who knows) Berkeley is cool, foggy, and damp most of the year, although it does get hot and dry in late summer and early fall. The weather is basically like a nicer version of Seattle's.

...this thread is taking a detour...