CLASS OF 2019! MEDIANS (LSAT/GPA/CLASS SIZE) Forum

[theconsigliere]

Yep, simply using automated alerts...

Yale:
https://www.law.yale.edu/admissions/pro ... ss-profile

170 (-1) / 173 / 176
3.79 (-0.07) /3.89 (-0.04) / 3.97 (-0.01)
210 (+10)

1. Harvard
2. Yale

Correction:

1. Yale
2. Stanford
3. Harvard


On a separate note, this makes me pissed that I got WL originally at Harvard

[canafsa]

.

[raven1231]

In bigger news...Cincinnati dropped:
https://www.law.uc.edu/prospective-stud ... -admission
155(0)
3.47 (-.12)

Where are you seeing that? I only see 2015 info.

[bearedman8]

.

[AriGold33]

omg harvard to 172!

3.94 / 3.86 / 3.76 (-.02, 0, +.01)
175 / 172 / 170 (0, -1, 0)

What implication does this have for people applying to Harvard with either a 171 or a 172 and above median GPA? Based on Mylsn, it seemed from past cycles that there's wasn't a huge difference in acceptance rate for people with a 172 vs. a 173 (and a more noticeable decline when applying with a 171).

I'd like to be optimistic and say that 171/172s will be more valued this cycle because they're now closer to/at median, but is it possible that this cycle will now be even harder for them because Harvard will be more aggressive in trying to get back to a 173?

Acceptance rate this year was actually lower, with a bit more people applying and Harvard accepting fewer ppl. And like many others I thought there were more people with higher scores this past cycle? Maybe Harvard was willing to give up their median and take the ppl they really wanted instead of just admitting all the high lsat scorers??

Also another thought, Harvard likes to admit a lot of people and let them defer for a year or two, and I believe the admissions office mentioned that at least around 60 ppl each year defer, so this might have some kind of impact? Although 60 out of a class of 560 is a small number... I wonder if they will ever consider cutting that huge class size

[goldenbear2020]

Acceptance rate this year was actually lower, with a bit more people applying and Harvard accepting fewer ppl. And like many others I thought there were more people with higher scores this past cycle? Maybe Harvard was willing to give up their median and take the ppl they really wanted instead of just admitting all the high lsat scorers??

Isn't that strong evidence that the pool of 173+ scorers (who did not choose another non-law school option such as grad school or a job) decreased last cycle? IIRC, the "higher scores" pool was something like 165+, but do we know anything about 173+ (i.e. top 1%) scorers?

[proteinshake]

Acceptance rate this year was actually lower, with a bit more people applying and Harvard accepting fewer ppl. And like many others I thought there were more people with higher scores this past cycle? Maybe Harvard was willing to give up their median and take the ppl they really wanted instead of just admitting all the high lsat scorers??

Isn't that strong evidence that the pool of 173+ scorers (who did not choose another non-law school option such as grad school or a job) decreased last cycle? IIRC, the "higher scores" pool was something like 165+, but do we know anything about 173+ (i.e. top 1%) scorers?

http://blog.spiveyconsulting.com/2015-1 ... s-of-6-24/

[goldenbear2020]

Acceptance rate this year was actually lower, with a bit more people applying and Harvard accepting fewer ppl. And like many others I thought there were more people with higher scores this past cycle? Maybe Harvard was willing to give up their median and take the ppl they really wanted instead of just admitting all the high lsat scorers??

Isn't that strong evidence that the pool of 173+ scorers (who did not choose another non-law school option such as grad school or a job) decreased last cycle? IIRC, the "higher scores" pool was something like 165+, but do we know anything about 173+ (i.e. top 1%) scorers?

http://blog.spiveyconsulting.com/2015-1 ... s-of-6-24/

Thanks for the info. I would suggest 4 possible reasons for HLS's drop to 172 despite a significant increase in 173+ applicants:
(1) This group had lower GPAs than usual (unlikely, due to rampant grade inflation)
(2) This group was less likely to apply to HLS (unlikely, since HLS had more applicants)
(3) The acceptees were more likely to choose another non-law school option such as grad school or a job (unlikely, since the yield increased from 60% to 62%) (but perhaps more of the 173+ acceptees opted out compared to below-median ones)
(4) HLS focused more on holistic admissions (possible, since the acceptance rate decreased from 17.8% to 16.5%)

[RamTitan]

Acceptance rate this year was actually lower, with a bit more people applying and Harvard accepting fewer ppl. And like many others I thought there were more people with higher scores this past cycle? Maybe Harvard was willing to give up their median and take the ppl they really wanted instead of just admitting all the high lsat scorers??

Isn't that strong evidence that the pool of 173+ scorers (who did not choose another non-law school option such as grad school or a job) decreased last cycle? IIRC, the "higher scores" pool was something like 165+, but do we know anything about 173+ (i.e. top 1%) scorers?

http://blog.spiveyconsulting.com/2015-1 ... s-of-6-24/

Thanks for the info. I would suggest 4 possible reasons for HLS's drop to 172 despite a significant increase in 173+ applicants:
(1) This group had lower GPAs than usual (unlikely, due to rampant grade inflation)
(2) This group was less likely to apply to HLS (unlikely, since HLS had more applicants)
(3) The acceptees were more likely to choose another non-law school option such as grad school or a job (unlikely, since the yield increased from 60% to 62%) (but perhaps more of the 173+ acceptees opted out compared to below-median ones)
(4) HLS focused more on holistic admissions (possible, since the acceptance rate decreased from 17.8% to 16.5%)

Or a lot of 173+ scorers saw big scholarships from schools below HYS and jumped on those

Probably a combination of many factors

[RareExports]

Has to be, at least in part, more people going to CCN/other T14s with scholarships over HYS at sticker. This is an expected result of ballooning tuition costs.

[AriGold33]

Or a lot of 173+ scorers saw big scholarships from schools below HYS and jumped on those

Probably a combination of many factors

^This, I can def see this. From personal experience last cycle and from a lot of friends I talked to, seems like a lot of schools were offering $$$ for those with 170+

[RamTitan]

Or a lot of 173+ scorers saw big scholarships from schools below HYS and jumped on those

Probably a combination of many factors

^This, I can def see this. From personal experience last cycle and from a lot of friends I talked to, seems like a lot of schools were offering $$$ for those with 170+

Anecdotal, but I have a friend who scored 173 (got into everywhere but HYS), and went to Vanderbilt on a full-ride.

[HYPSM]

Or a lot of 173+ scorers saw big scholarships from schools below HYS and jumped on those

Probably a combination of many factors

^This, I can def see this. From personal experience last cycle and from a lot of friends I talked to, seems like a lot of schools were offering $$$ for those with 170+

Anecdotal, but I have a friend who scored 173 (got into everywhere but HYS), and went to Vanderbilt on a full-ride.

That's a little surprising; I'm assuming he was a moderate splitter? I would think he would have gotten full rides at lower T-14 schools otherwise.

[HYPSM]

Or a lot of 173+ scorers saw big scholarships from schools below HYS and jumped on those

Probably a combination of many factors

^This, I can def see this. From personal experience last cycle and from a lot of friends I talked to, seems like a lot of schools were offering $$$ for those with 170+

This seems most likely.

[Helioze]

Dat harvard need aid not lookin so sweet when tuition is 60k+/yr

[ms9]

My best guess is that HLS has continued to amp up its consideration of work experience and employability -- and turned down some close calls at 173+ that in the past they would have admitted. The 1 year and 2+ year work experience data would *seem* to back some of this. Obviously they didn't want to lose an LSAT point, and I agree that there are likely other factors at play here as well.

That said, I would be surprised if a 173 doesn't loom very large for them as a goal this cycle.

[hiltopp01]

There are probably a lot of different factors going on here. If you consider the actual number of people instead of percentage changes, there were only ~200 additional people who got a score of 173+ compared to the year before. Factor in that many probably are splitters below HYS's GPA floor and the sheer number of law schools and I reckon the increase becomes sort of irrelevant.

My guess is that they missed their target 173 by a small margin due to something unforeseeable.

[cavalier1138]

Entirely anecdotal: I didn't get a JS1 at Harvard with a 173/3.6x, a graduate degree and about a decade of work experience. So I don't know if that's indicative of anything, but it certainly seems to suggest that their focus wasn't on life experience.

[raven1231]

In bigger news...Cincinnati dropped:
https://www.law.uc.edu/prospective-stud ... -admission
155(0)
3.47 (-.12)

Where are you seeing that? I only see 2015 info.

Nevermind. I saw it in the Q &A section. I wonder why they haven't posted the actual break down yet, and still have last years up. Interesting indeed, so they jump 22 spots in USNW, increase bar passage and employment but then drop in lsat and gpa median?

[goldenbear2020]

Columbia:
http://web.law.columbia.edu/admissions/ ... ss-profile

169 (+1) / 172 (+1) / 174 (+1)
3.56 (-0.03) / 3.70 / 3.81
392 (+4)

[aaronbursar]

Columbia:
http://web.law.columbia.edu/admissions/ ... ss-profile

169 (+1) / 172 (+1) / 174 (+1)
3.56 (+0.03) / 3.68 (+0.02) / 3.81
392 (+4)

so that's where everybody went.

Side note: isn't a 3.68 down 0.02?

[poptart123]

Columbia:
http://web.law.columbia.edu/admissions/ ... ss-profile

169 (+1) / 172 (+1) / 174 (+1)
3.56 (+0.03) / 3.68 (+0.02) / 3.81
392 (+4)

Wow, impressive gainz Columbia.

[USayinBoalt]

Geez, that Columbia median GPA is pretty low

[RamTitan]

Or a lot of 173+ scorers saw big scholarships from schools below HYS and jumped on those

Probably a combination of many factors

^This, I can def see this. From personal experience last cycle and from a lot of friends I talked to, seems like a lot of schools were offering $$$ for those with 170+

Anecdotal, but I have a friend who scored 173 (got into everywhere but HYS), and went to Vanderbilt on a full-ride.

That's a little surprising; I'm assuming he was a moderate splitter? I would think he would have gotten full rides at lower T-14 schools otherwise.

I don't know what his GPA was exactly....thinking it was a 3.5 or 3.6, but he was a chemical engineering major, so it could have even been lower. I know he did get a lot of money from Duke and Michigan too.

[RamTitan]

Geez, that Columbia median GPA is pretty low

Really pumps me up for this retake haha